Camille's Journal (TW)

Started by camille13512, November 12, 2017, 05:33:48 PM

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camille13512

Hi Decimal (or Rocket, depends on which one you prefer), I'm not even convinced that I "understand it intellectually". I've always learned to second doubt my own thoughts, and as the symptoms escalate, I found it harder and harder to trust anything that came out of my brain without hard evidence. And I don't even know whether I want to be angry. I can be angry on other people's behalf; I'm constantly angry this week due to injustice that happened around me but not to me. And I know how bad it sounds but I can't help with it. I can't abandon my FOO like this even if I can confirm that my theory is true. They have sacrificed for me, and I just cannot describe those details here yet. So in the end it seems I am just fighting against myself again. Thank you for your kind words. I wish to truly act on them one day.

DecimalRocket

Ah, yes. Sorry if I misunderstood you there. That's okay too.  :hug:

I feel the same way sometimes. Finding it hard to believe things intellectually without an obsessive amount of proof. Especially when I was younger — where I'd pretty much have a habit of second guessing every moment of my life.

By the way, you can call me anything you like.

Another thing. It takes time so please take it at your own pace. Good luck, Camille.




camille13512

Thanks, Decimal. There's no need to be sorry or apologize for misunderstanding. Different interpretations help a lot.

camille13512

I just want to post something that is more forward than backward. So for the first time in this journal, no trigger warning.

I have confided with my friend about my condition. I have been thinking over it for a while, not because I am worried that she will reject me, but because I know she has so much on her plate already and I know she will still try to find space to accommodate me. It's a debate between how to avoid burdening her more than she already is handling, and how much I want to be truthful. I don't think there exists a right answer or a best solution to this question (I refuse to listen to IC babbling "you are just being selfish"). In the end I did it, because I don't want to hide any more, not from someone I care about and love.
So I told her in an almost nonchalant way, like a normal chat we often have. I didn't expect myself to pour it out like that (I planned a more careful way to initiate and organize the confession but plans don't always stick); that moment came and I couldn't hold myself any more. It did not require much of the explanation, because she has talked to me before about my trust issue and other obvious or more hidden problems I have. The only difference now is that both I and she know those come from CPTSD. I almost cried when she asked me what she could do to help me get better. I sincerely doubt I ever deserve a friend like her, but I am not pushing her away just because I am scared. I am not doing that any more. At the end of the conversation we shared a big hug.

I think I am extremely lucky to have kept (!) meeting genuine and caring people, despite my tendency to attract potential predators. It is almost unbelievable. I just want to share this ray of light in my life here. My EF's, hyper-vigilance and IC are still here with me, but I'm not giving up!

sanmagic7

bravery comes in many different forms.  you showed a bunch of it in this post, by telling your friend, by not pushing away her care and concern for you, and by not giving up in spite of any ICr rants.

sound like a leap of progress to me, camille.  so very glad for you.  big hug.

DecimalRocket

There is something amazing that happens when someone is able to trust one another this way.

It's a showcase of how human beings can create connections where one isn't perfect. It's an expression of trust and an optimism for the possibilities — that despite the bad in the world, there's some good. The willingness to ask help is also a sign that you. . . somewhere in there — that you believe you deserve love and care.

I won't call myself the best person for relationship advice as I can be shy and I'm naturally solitary too . . . But from what I've heard . . .open communication has its benefits. You can work together, grow together and help each other now.

Take care.

Blueberry

Quote from: sanmagic7 on November 22, 2017, 09:59:00 PM
bravery comes in many different forms.  you showed a bunch of it in this post, by telling your friend, by not pushing away her care and concern for you, and by not giving up in spite of any ICr rants.

sound like a leap of progress to me, camille.  so very glad for you.  big hug.

:yeahthat:

camille13512

Quote from: sanmagic7 on November 22, 2017, 09:59:00 PM
sound like a leap of progress to me, camille.  so very glad for you.  big hug.

Hug you back, San! I do have a feeling that I experienced a breakthrough recently, mostly because I am gradually getting over some of my self-denial that this was a problem I have instead of my actual personality. I need to thank you and everyone who replied to me here for this progress, because it's been so easy for me to believe I "made up" the pain when I'm locked up with IC alone in the same body. IC is still (or even more) full of vengeance right now, but at least I'll try to fight it when it comes back.

camille13512

Quote from: DecimalRocket on November 23, 2017, 09:29:10 AM
open communication has its benefits. You can work together, grow together and help each other now.

My T mentioned this to me too, in a slightly different context. It was during the early sessions when I was describing to her that I didn't believe I experienced trauma, and it was just me being too "weak" when the teacher abused me, because I was not the only one who was punished, but the only one that was wrecked like this. She mentioned that people could experience the same thing differently, and having a connection to others without being isolated was found in some studies to have made a very big difference. So I think T and you are right. I used to think that due to my incapability to understand joy and a constant feeling of being segregated from "normal people", joy is something that connects people. Now I think people can get connected in many ways, and it might be more difficult and risky to try to understand each other in something painful, but it is a possibility and worth me keeping trying. After all, my friend said she doesn't understand my pain multiple times, but she still listened each time and tried to help me anyway; it made me shake with small hope rising in me.

camille13512

#24
Thank you, Blueberry.

Just something along the line San said and you seconded, I have been trying to reason with my IC on the topic about courage. I'm not sure whether this is a recommended thing to do, but the moments when my IC has complete control over me are the ones that it lists out all the reasons why I need to follow its order, and I would be forced to agree because I don't know how to rebut them. So I started having a debate with it, hoping that if it failed to support one of its argument then it cannot use that one strategy again.

-- TW (language)--
One of the reason IC listed to prove that I am a worthless piece of rubbish is that I am a coward. If I really think about it, it doesn't make any sense. Because IC was the one that stirred up fear in me to prevent me from being assertive or set any boundary. Thanks to it, I still don't understand what a boundary should look like and where it should be between two normal adults. IC made me willingly give up my defense, but then used the very same thing to attack me. It mocked me, shouting that I was never able to defend others when they needed help, and I was such a coward to feel threatened and scared all the time.

In the past few days, I tried a conversation with IC. The dialog was interrupted and inconsistent in the process, but (after some organization) it looked something like this:
Me: "You said I do not possess any form of courage."
IC:" That's right. You never act until you feel hundred percent secure."
Me:" But that is not true. I just did it."
IC:"Come on, you only did it after you knew there were others who were doing the same thing. You did it merely because you don't want to look too bad."
Me: paused a bit. "Maybe, yes, I gained more confidence after hearing about I was not the only one. But that did not necessarily diminish my intention. I did it, because it felt personal, because I believed it was the right thing to do." 
IC: laugh. "You can keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. Fool, always rely on unsubstantiated feeling to gain a sense of self, which by the way, still does not e-x-i-s-t."
Me: in tears at this moment. conversation interrupted.
One day later.
Me: "Get out. I'm not done yet. We were talking about courage, and you kept saying that my action did not count as long as I felt insecure and scared."
IC: "Yes and no. Your action did not stand as a proof that you had courage, because you did it after you were not completely scared."
Me: "But that's not true. My decision was made before I got any assurance. Yes, the actual action was not an immediate response, but I was determined from the beginning."
IC: "Say that is true. But you were shaking the whole time like a pathetic timid animal. Simply pathetic. And you tell me that this is a form of courage?" Laughing.
Me: "How do you tell courage from the lack of it there was not fear in the first place? How do you validate it?"
IC: slowly quieted down.
Me: "I think it is actually because I was scared, and shaking, and feeling timid and threatened, but acted out on it any way, that showed I was brave, at least in that moment. It might only last for a second, a brief moment, because soon fear was suppressed as I was standing with the others, but it existed. You cannot deny it."
IC: quiet for a while.
Today.
IC: "I think you have a point. Don't show joy so soon, disgusting. It was only about that one single thing we talked about, doesn't mean that it applies to everything before or anything after. Remember, my eye is always on you, and any second you slip, I will be there to give you the proper reminder."
-- TW ends --

In spite of IC's threat, I consider this a triumph any way. I think the point is that I finally found a stand point where I could feel "safely scared" without fearing IC would come barking at me for just feeling scared. Now I can always tell it to wait, until it sees how I decide despite the fear. But I may also have set a trap for myself. From now on, fear would become a test that I need to pass according to IC's standard every time.

I'm not sure if this is a good tactic to try to shrink IC's voice. But I guess since I am trying to reason with it more as an equal than a subordinator, it is still a tempt forward? I discussed my logic about fear and courage with my T, due to time limit we didn't finish the discussion, but I think there is some truth in it. Why should we feel bad about being scared? Or am I simply trying to glorify something I shouldn't, as IC said "keep telling myself this because it makes me feel better"?

sanmagic7

i think this was brilliant, camille.  courage has everything to do with fear.  it doesn't take any courage to do something that feels comfortable, that you have no fear of.  courage is doing something in spite of the fear you might feel.  to my mind, fear is an essential element of courage.

the fact that you stood up to your ICr, which has cowered you all your life, was an act of courage in itself.  you have more courage than that belittling voice ever had.  as far as gaining courage because of others, the saying goes that there is strength in numbers.  it's being resourceful to use what's around us to do what we fear doing.  there's nothing pathetic or pitiful about using our resources at all.  rather, it's creative, determined, and a means of self-care.

so, pooh on that ICr!  you now know that you have the courage to stand up to it, and those dialogues will become easier and easier.  there may be tears, for there will be loss - that ICr has been with you a long time - and there may be a period of adjustment at living more and more without that constant critical hammering of your mind.  but, you're courageous, and you'll get to where you want to go.  no doubt about that.  sending a warm, encouraging hug filled with love.

camille13512

San, thank you for the validation. I was really anxious when posting it. I am still having a hard time distinguish "me" from ICr. I identified with ICr for so long that sometimes it felt rather strange to shout back at it (it felt like I was shouting at myself). But the more bitter and aggressive ICr gets, the easier it becomes to tell the difference. It's so depressing and ironic that it's almost funny sometimes. In the very few times when I managed to ridicule ICr and even laugh at it, that's when I think I really fended it off.
Most of the time though, I have to try to fight it when I'm choking on my tears. I keep telling myself that I'm fine with crying; I'm fine with feeling angry or scared; I'm entitled to those feelings. It doesn't always work, but I guess it's just the beginning, so that's ok too. Hug you back!

sanmagic7

and it's a great beginning, camille, strong, solid, and a good foundation for building on.  i love that you can laugh at your ICr at times - laughter is the best medicine, after all, and nothing deflates a bully better than a good hearty laugh.

keep going, sweetie.  smiling for your progress.  warm, loving hug to you.

DecimalRocket

It can be hard. Telling yourself things like these seem strange. But things get easier to believe when they're repeated and become familiar. There are all kinds of triggers for the IC to show itself, and to be able to deal with every one of them one by one is difficult.

But you're trying your best. And you're doing some great progress here.

Take care.

ah

camille,
I thought that inner conversation was beautiful, and very powerful.