a letter I need to write to FOO

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Blueberry

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a letter I need to write to FOO
« on: November 18, 2017, 08:36:36 PM »
Blank. I can't face it. But I need to. It's about money.

F,
You asked last time you wrote how my pets are. I don't have them any more. Before you finally got round to letting me know how much money I might inherit, I gave them away. Although money wasn't the most important issue, it was part of it. The other issue was not having enough energy.

Not having enough energy for them doesn't bode well for me ever having enough energy to work enough to support myself. I appreciate that you were willing to tell me how much money, since M apparently isn't, at least that's what you wrote. Please note that it is important for me to know amounts! Otherwise I might make other decisions, like move to a much worse but cheaper place or give up freelance work all for the sake of saving what is little money in the grand scheme of things but particularly little money seen in context of our FOO and what's available. Giving up eg. freelance work before I am ready is akin to pulling the rug out from under my own feet, which done too early will be destabilising.

You say you care about me. Good, this is a test. If I let you know how angry I am at your treatment of me, at M's, at the Bs', will you cut me off or continue to support me? I can hear you saying "Don't be so ridiculous! Of course we'll still support you." But I'm not being ridiculous. I genuinely don't know. You said ten years ago that money is no-strings-attached. But I honestly don't know. So I don't dare to say what I think. I don't dare to go NC.

BTW if you and M had thought to put me in my own place last time instead of squashed in with B2 and family, possibly none of this would ever have happened! Possibly we would have had an OK family holiday without SIL2 dumping her vitriol on me that she can't dump on M, though that's certainly partially where it belongs, because the powers-that-be in FOO don't allow that. But dumping it on me? No problem. Even though M admitted herself that I was in no fit state to have that dumped on me. But she doesn't see the connect that it gets dumped on me because YOU, F, are preventing it getting dumped on her.

Not having enough energy also doesn't bode well for me ever being healthy, which I told you and M last time I was over. Possibly you didn't take that seriously, since you seem to tend not to, thinking I'm exaggerating. I wasn't. I am deadly serious.


__________________________________

I realise while I write this that some of the info needs to go to my parents, or maybe just F - he will pass the salient points on to M after all and I'll just "get in trouble" as usual if I allow her to be aware of things he doesn't want her to be aware of e.g. he gave me an estimate of the amount i'll inherit.

But some of the info I'm just venting and ranting and it shouldn't go to F at all.

I also know that some people on here and probably even more on OOTF would recommend I do without the inheritance and go on welfare. While I'm also looking into that and what exactly that might all entail, there are definitely downsides to that. Along the lines of pulling the rug out from under my own feet too early. Letting go of non-financial supports like having access to a nearby garden. It needs to be nearby or I won't go out of the house and weed it and sow seeds and pick flowers and edible weeds. It's hard enough to 'keep going' or to want to do so not having my Little Furry Creatures.

Antoher non-financial support I'd have to let go of with less money is: my local environs, e.g. by moving to a different town or even a different part of town where rents are lower. Would mean keeping contact with local people and local institutions that much harder. Going out of the house and communicating with people is hard enough as is without making it a bus ride away. Even getting up the energy and courage to go into a different church, rather than the one round the corner, might be too much... And the point is: FOO has money coming out of its ears. My sibs certainly don't need what would be my share.



 

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sanmagic7

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2017, 12:09:26 AM »
blueberry, i'm not going to give you advice.  you know what's best for you, what you're able to deal with, how much energy you have.  i completely support whatever kind of decision you make.  putting yourself in a financial bind can be a hardship in the best of times.  only you know if that's a wise decision for you at any time.

it sounds like a sticky situation, for sure.  you're not the first to go thru this dilemma.  when i used to do phone counseling for battered women, there were plenty of times the women didn't want to leave abusive relationships because of money, social standing, or personal status involved.   it's tough, no matter how one looks at it.

in the end, do what's best for you.  i think the idea of looking at the options with clear eyes is a good one.  i see no shame or failure possible here.  big hug filled with clarity, wisdom, and love.


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ah

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2017, 09:34:52 AM »
Hi Blueberry,

I feel a bit undecided, I don't want to write a long technical reply here in this part of the forums because I feel as though it should be yours, and I'd just echo what you pour out... but because you wrote another post that highlighted this one and the point about depending financially on FOO... well, just my two cents.

I can relate, very much so, and it's never easy. Don't know if my personal experience resembles your own, but when I read your letter I thought how in our lives it's never black / white; and you and I both know we need so many factors to live. One is, for sure, distance from abusers. But it isn't the only thing we need.

For some years I was helped financially here and there by rich FOO, they dished it out in smaller and smaller portions, using it as a way to be cruel. Finally they stopped giving even that altogether. I always felt like I was being paid for my services, it was money for abuse.
I hope, it does sound to me like your FOO isn't quite as demented and I'm very relieved for you. My FOO made it clear I won't inherit anything.

I know how hard it can be to feel you have to silence yourself and your integrity and that you're being paid off to be quiet. It's not the sort of thing that promotes healing. But neither does having to move somewhere else where you'll feel less safe, neither does losing things you need, neither will having no money.

Can you be true to yourself elsewhere, here, with people who are good enough and safer than FOO? Do you feel you can put on a show with FOO to the extent needed without losing yourself in it? Can you do it consciously, while continuing to heal, while separating from them emotionally?

Looked at from another angle, maybe you could say to yourself that you deserve some compensation for all you went through in FOO? :bigwink:

I say - write here, share, rant, cry, laugh, feel numb, feel confused to the core here. Use other places to be you. If you can do that, maybe the money issues can stay just that: money you'll inherit, and not a whole heavy mess tied to the money. The mess belongs with us here, not with FOO. So do the moments of happiness and success, and everything personal in between.

Hope this makes sense.
I've struggled mightily with this topic in the past. I'm sending you all my love and support.


« Last Edit: November 19, 2017, 01:02:25 PM by ah »

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2017, 02:49:17 PM »
Thank you for a wise and compassionate reply, ah. Today I feel too drained to write anymore, but I will! Meantime your and San's replies will be working in my head. Ultimately the decision is mine of course. But it helps me to write things on here and not just have them churning away in my head with no input from outside, not even validation.  :hug:

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2018, 11:35:10 PM »
I hope, it does sound to me like your FOO isn't quite as demented and I'm very relieved for you. My FOO made it clear I won't inherit anything.

It does sound to me as if my FOO is not quite as demented as yours. Now that I've just had a little contact with a FOO member, my ICr. is telling me FOO isn't demented and that it's in my head. Buuuut since ICr. developed its ideas from FOO that's not so surprising. ICr. is wrong! There are tons of my posts on here that show that my FOO damages me. That's the bottom line. Even if they don't understand and not many people who aren't on here understand, contact to FOO damages me. The dissociation and subsequent memory loss were so bad the past few times I had in-person contact to more than F that I decided: me first. My health has to be in first place.

So my FOO isn't as demented, as openly destructive and malicious as yours. But NTS, that doesn't absolve them. That would be their thinking: 'people on here like ah have it really bad, Blueberry's just emulating that.' I know you don't think that ah, but my FOO would.

So far FOO hasn't cut me out of the will, and I don't think they will. But just the fact that I have this little vestige of doubt is enough to show me how unhealthy FOO is. It doesn't matter what I speak up about, there's always this fear that there will be some repercussion.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2018, 12:33:13 AM »
As usual, things move along in my mind and emotions. A couple of days ago a friend asked me why I want to accept anything from FOO considering the way I feel about them. The day after I was fuming about the question, so triggered. It always takes a while for my real answer to sift through.

It's this: I don't believe that inheritance should be about whether you're being 'good' or not. It shouldn't be a reward. Some countries laws even bear this out. In the country I live in, you are not allowed to completely disinherit a child, whether over the age of 18 or under.

Whether I'm VLC or NC, I'm actually still part of the family. I don't hate FOO, I'm removing myself from them bit by bit because contact makes me really, really unwell. Paralysed to the point of hardly being able to act. In fact, I've loved them far too long, and I've done a lot for FOO over the years, probably unbeknownst to them. I've been carrying burdens for them simply by being SG. I've been functioning as emotional punching bag for years, which has relieved all of them of pressure.

Even though I don't believe that inheritance should be a reward thing, if that's what they think, well, I'm fine with financial compensation! Almost 20 years sick with varying ability to work ( ie. little to none), I have next to no pension fund, and despite the fact that I am making slow but steady progress towards some form of healing, it won't necessarily translate into even comfortable earning. More like pretty precarious.

EnF used to ask "Is this our fault somehow?" I never really answered even though at the time the question seemed genuine. I think now that he wanted to hear "No, no, it's not." I genuinely believe the answer is "Yes! It is your fault." Because one of my plaintive internal IC cries is "Where were you??"

The final point - due to FOO dysfunction, I never disengaged as a toddler or as a teenager, the way you're meant to, to individuate, become an adult. Not because I was too immature, stupid or whatever else I've heard over the years, but because I was traumatised by them and none of them wanted me to individuate. They still don't. Sibs' reactions made that clear at Horrendous Event. So this trying to figure some stuff out with FOO is very important, actually. Setting limits, setting boundaries in a healthy way, or at least trying to, while disengaging - that's a form of this testing others do as toddlers and/or teenagers. It's late on in life, but better late than never. Not for FOO, but for me! So that I'm not constantly frightened of speaking up whether to clients or neighbours or friends because all these people are still giants in my imagination and I'm a little kid. I do speak up, but it takes a lot out of me. When I set FOO a limit, or test something to see how they react and they accept it, I get more energy and I move forward.

I may not get my inheritance, but I'm certainly going to try for it. FWIW my sibs don't have a great relationship with my parents either, especially not with M, but they're not SG, and they're somehow 'allowed' to set limits and to be rude as they like. M complains somewhat but enF doesn't seem to take it up with sibs or their spouses. Whereas me, I set a limit, I just say "No" and that's rude  :stars: :stars: So I really don't see why my sibs should get all that money.

Obviously some families will make inheritance a reward thing, and maybe mine will.  But I won't know until I hash this stuff out.

______________________________________

Reply #6 on: January 31, 2018, 08:27:59 PM



With this "when i used to do phone counseling for battered women, there were plenty of times the women didn't want to leave abusive relationships because of money, social standing, or personal status involved" from san and also reading information over at OOTF, I'm realising more and more how there are real similarities between DV between partners and abuse of all kinds done by families towards children. This is a helpful realisation for me.

Blueberry
   
Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
Reply #7 on: January 31, 2018, 08:51:43 PM
Quote from: Blueberry on January 08, 2018, 05:33:13 PM

    Obviously some families will make inheritance a reward thing, and maybe mine will.  But I won't know until I hash this stuff out.


I haven't written this letter yet.

Partly there was an unexpected FOO incident in January that held me back. I'm glad that I have the compassion to hold myself back in that kind of situation. Even if FOO clearly doesn't extend that kind of compassion towards me.

Partly I seem to not be ready to deal with it, for whatever reason. Probably fear, as in Fear Obligation Guilt. It's good to move Out Of The FOG. But can take a while.

Quote from: Blueberry on January 08, 2018, 05:33:13 PM

    A couple of days ago a friend asked me why I want to accept anything from FOO considering the way I feel about them. The day after I was fuming about the question, so triggered.


I still feel mad about this question, but think the anger would be misplaced if I mentioned it to my friend. It's probably anger at FOO, maybe also some anger at myself for not being better at boundaries. With better boundaries I think you can listen and then think to yourself "What does she know??" and move on instead of getting stuck in the anger.

Another friend mentioned knowing a buddhist monk who actually lives off donations but only accepts them from people who genuinely want to give them to him. She mentioned this in the context of my FOO and inheritance. In her case I can speak my mind better, and said "I am not a buddhist monk who can live from hand-to-mouth day after day and feel happy without a secure future, materialistically-speaking."

I think my parents do genuinely want to give me some money, but they'd still like stick their oar in on how it's used. Even if they can't really have a say. M has said things like they'd be happy to give me more money if it was being used for something sensible, e.g. buying an apartment. Without realising that the mere act of looking for and buying property instead of continuing to rent could throw me for a total loop. I might manage, but would probably have to give up other important activities for months. Or I might very well not manage and end up with complete emotional exhaustion in inpatient therapy again. I know there are other people on this forum who would manage fine, but we're not all the same in what we can manage and in what severely triggers us.

In my head I say to my friends that it's all very well for them, they don't have such a huge problem earning money as I do. Neither of them work full-time, but one has 3 children. OTOH when her children are older I'm sure she'll be able to earn more money. If I were to drop the FOO rope completely, go NC, and do without any money before inheritance kicks in, and possibly lose my inheritance as well, I'm not sure that a type of healing would take place allowing me to work 'normally', earning my keep. I'm sure some healing would take place. I was going to write that I'm not sure it's worth it for 'some healing', except now I'm thinking that 'some healing' ought to always be worth attaining. New thought.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2018, 03:13:25 AM by Blueberry »

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2018, 09:01:25 PM »
I wrote my email to my enF. Just a one-liner to set the discussion in motion again. No answer yet, but that's OK. I'm otherwise occupied atm anyway. An answer will come though. That much I know.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2018, 03:20:02 AM »
Actually no answer came! So I sent a reminder and we're back where we were before, i.e. parents wanting information I've already told them is not relevant imo.

But I'm much calmer and more able to deal with that. Haven't written  a response yet but when I do, I'll be calmer and more able to write appropriately without feeling like exploding and without feeling a need to run through the letter first with my T to make sure I'm not throwing myself under a bus. This shows me that healing is taking place!

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2018, 12:47:51 AM »
Finally written the response, but I am taking it to T tomorrow just to make sure I'm not saying anything detrimental to myself. I was much calmer writing it than I have been writing other stuff to anybody in FOO in last while, so that's progress. But I was also really close to SH a few times.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2018, 03:43:51 PM »
It's good that I took it to T because he was able to point out to me in which sentences I was excusing myself for existing! He more or less dictated to me what to write. The usual two-liner. When T suggests something, my brain deletes it again very fast, even before I can write it down during T appointment. So T repeats, I write it down. We talked about amounts as well so I didn't sell myself needlessly short. parents may still decide on a lower amount but at least in my own head and heart I know why I suggested the amount I did.

Today I got my 2016 tax stuff back from the accountant. 2015 profit was so-so. 2016 abysmal. Theoretically 2016 should be better because year by year I'm getting emotionally healthier. So what happened in 2016? Horrendous FOO Event in the middle of the year which sent me reeling, and therefore refusing contract work right, left and centre.

All the more reason to get money from FOO imo. I've always seen their financial help as compensation.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2018, 10:02:14 PM »
For some years I was helped financially here and there by rich FOO, they dished it out in smaller and smaller portions, using it as a way to be cruel. Finally they stopped giving even that altogether. I always felt like I was being paid for my services, it was money for abuse.

ah, I'm not sure that quite this is going on, but it is beginning to sound a little familiar. They mentioned sending another portion but are not saying what they think of the monthly amount I could do with, which I informed them of in response to one of their questions. So I have no idea going into the future what kind of amount I'm dealing with. Or whether they've talked to sibs yet (cuz their inheritance will be affected.) So it's good for me to be forewarned by you on this.

I also think "cruel"?? My FOO cruel? No, they probably don't know what they're doing or what effect it's having. Till I remember that post on OOTF which I linked on here somewhere and that opines that our FOOs know exactly what they are doing. They just don't care.

I say - write here, share, rant, cry, laugh, feel numb, feel confused to the core here. Use other places to be you. If you can do that, maybe the money issues can stay just that: money you'll inherit, and not a whole heavy mess tied to the money. The mess belongs with us here, not with FOO. So do the moments of happiness and success, and everything personal in between.

That certainly. I remember once when physically and emotionally abusive older sib expressed regret and sadness that I'd deprived FOO of the pleasure of seeing me grow up the way my younger sib had provided that, I thought "I didn't owe you that." And I didn't. Some of the things people without an abusive family learn like navigating friendships, the opposite sex etc. I learned 2 decades later at a place in life where I didn't feel under constant threat. (Some of these things I haven't really learnt yet and maybe I never will). So too, happiness and success can go on here, and it does quite often under 3 Good Things or I share with people around me. And the mess too. It's not FOO's to know anymore. They would only use it against me, as they did with the results of the first time I was badly retraumatised a few years ago in FOO company.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2018, 02:15:00 PM »
Sent another one.  :cheer:

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2018, 08:21:37 PM »
For some years I was helped financially here and there by rich FOO, they dished it out in smaller and smaller portions, using it as a way to be cruel. Finally they stopped giving even that altogether. I always felt like I was being paid for my services, it was money for abuse.

The portions haven't changed noticeably but it's the correspondence about them that has. They pretend not to understand me, they don't get back to me. Stringing me along. The "not understanding" is particularly bad because that's what they always did in my childhood - pretended I was defective in my ability to communicate and stupid as well. So I really feel your point now here, ah, it's money for emotional abuse.

I know how hard it can be to feel you have to silence yourself and your integrity and that you're being paid off to be quiet. It's not the sort of thing that promotes healing.

Can you be true to yourself elsewhere, here, with people who are good enough and safer than FOO? Do you feel you can put on a show with FOO to the extent needed without losing yourself in it? Can you do it consciously, while continuing to heal, while separating from them emotionally?

No it certainly doesn't promote healing! It's beginning to feel as if "putting on a show for FOO" isn't going to work, especially as they seem to be showing their true colours. I think I need to go through with the healing on all levels, it's a sort of cleansing I think. Getting rid of FOO's influence in me altogether.

Not that I'm going to send them a letter and tell them to keep their stupid money themselves or anything quite that risky, but slowly learning to act towards them the way I need to, as an adult instead of as a frightened child, is the way to go. They will notice the change. They already have. I need to be true to this change in myself and see where it takes me. On to more healing probably. Even though I've just had a few days of shakey state, a few days of feeling like I'm going backwards. But only a couple of days really, not the weeks and months it used to feel like.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #13 on: May 26, 2018, 10:18:46 AM »
An answer will come though. That much I know.

But it didn't come, as I posted above. Even though I 'knew' it would.

Last time I was discussing with T how to negotiate with my brother on continuing contact with my niece and god-daughter, I said to T that I'm really pretty sure that B won't cut me off for stating how I'd like contact to continue. But now i'm not sure on that at all. The more I realise about the family dynamics, the more I see massive dysfunction and massive vindictiveness.

I thought I was sure of quite a lot in FOO, but the more I attempt to either negotiate or even just simply state my own boundary, the more I see what I didn't want to see before. My body is in a bit of physical pain again, probably the emotional pain I'm not really feeling. Not that the physical pain is bad compared to what others on here go through, but it's a sign.

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Blueberry

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Re: a letter I need to write to FOO
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2018, 08:23:11 PM »
An answer will come though. That much I know.

But it didn't come, as I posted above. Even though I 'knew' it would.

Ditto to the next answer I'm waiting for. Been waiting a month to get a response from people who don't collapse with exhaustion every couple of weeks (unlike me) and more importantly from a person who writes that anytime I want to continue discussing they will. But then they don't.  :thumbdown: