A New Approach

[Hope67]

Wow, I think I understand the concept of reparenting the self, at last!  They took away,  or rather refused, a massive part of my life,  which however I look at it, I won't get back again. I can't overlook this, it's a step too far for me. This is an acceptable decision for me, that doesn't hurt anyone else,  including my parents.  I can leave behind my guilt over no contact.

So many things seem to have crystalised through writing this.

Libby - I am applauding your insights here.

I also agree with you that this forum is amazing - and I personally think you give so much here in the forum - you have certainly helped me, and I thank you for that.    to you, Libby.

Hope 

[sanmagic7]

libbby, i think you're doing great with all this.  so glad that writing has helped you - it's usually helped me, too, to get clarity and realizations.  and i'm really happy that you're able to begin leaving the shame and guilt behind.  to my mind, that's huge.  good for you, sweetie.  well done.

love and a big hug filled with continuing realizations that lead to health and well-being.

[Hope67]

Hi Libby -  to you and hoping that the weekend is ok for you. 
Hope 

[Libby183]

Can't believe it's a month since I have been here,  but it's time to write some things down,  in the hope of gaining some more clarity for myself.

Firstly,  I am still struggling with the idea that was impressed on me in therapy, that,  throughout our relationship,  the faults lay as much with me as with my parents. 

I accept I was difficult as a child - I know I was not right/depressed /volatile from the time I started school, aged 4. Therapy showed me that my difficulties lay mostly with a total failure of attachment to my mother, who was very young,  and damaged herself, but is in total denial. I accept also that there may well be some genetic predisposition within me (especially likely as I have an autistic son, and I see so many similar traits). So, OK. It's not my mother's fault.  I am even toying with the idea of sending them an apology for my part in all of this. But I remember all of the horrid things she did, but the fact that it wasn't her fault,  doesn't make them any less hurtful. So around and around I go, tying myself in knots.

I am just left with this overwhelming sadness for all of us. My parents for their suffering,  my husband for having to put up with me, my children for all of the problems that have been passed onto them, through genes and experience. 

It's odd, but the people I feel no sadness for (and I feel so guilty for this) is are my elderly in-laws.  I am sure that my mother-in-law would be classed as a very psychologically healthy person, with good boundaries and a strong sense of self. I hate her with a passion. There,  I've said it. Every time I have any contact with her, I am really triggered.  She is so different to my mother, and yet I find her callous and indifferent.  It must be me, I say, but then I am stuck with the feeling that,  if she represents a psychologically healthy person,  then heaven help humanity. 

So...

I come back again, to that feeling I have had, that I am just not human, that I am not connected to society,  that up until a few years ago, I just played the roles society expected of me - devoted daughter,  good student,  worker, wife, mother. But I can't do it anymore.  So is this my authentic self? Probably, because something was so very wrong in both my genes and my very early experience.  There was never going to be any other life for me. I've not missed out on anything because nothing else was possible.

My mother's denial seems very appealing!!  But, then again,  my realisation of intergenerational trauma has saved my children from a whole heap of suffering.  So round and round and round. How to stop this?

I do feel very down,  especially as I am suffering from sinusitis or something similar.  I am too scared and ashamed (because of who I am, not the symptoms themselves)  to seek medical advice because I am sure doctors just see me as a nuisance and will just tell me it's a symptom of my mental health problems. 

I will stop now because my dog needs her walk.  It's just good to get it off my chest!

[Hope67]

Hi Libby,
to you.  I just wanted to re-connect with you, as I've been away for a couple of weeks, and I see that you've not been here for a month - and I'm glad to see you here, and that you've written this - I wondered how you were and hoped you were ok.

I hope that you're enjoying the walk with your dog.  I am just about to go out myself, but just wanted to say 'hello' and wish you the best for the day.
Hope 

[Eyessoblue]

Hey Libby, it's nice to hear from you again. Very sorry to hear how you're feeling but I can totally relate, at the moment I've found a private counsellor who deals with the 'inner child' and it's brought up many memories and bad beliefs plus realisations about my childhood and actually how disconnected from my parents I really was. This is explained a lot to me on how and why I feel like I do about things, the protection I've built up around myself in the form of dissociation where I dissociated so much that for a long time I'd built up a pretend family and believed I belonged, I was loved and had a wonderful relationship especially with my mum, now I'm actually going back and looking at it properly it feels like my eyes have opened and I'm now seeing it how it was, I always believed I was a difficult child but actually was just a child looking for love and doing anything whether Good or bad to try and get it, and I never did.
Just wondered if you had explored your 'inner child ' or would it be worth you finding a therapist who could do this with you.
I think like me you will learn a lot from it and realise you don't owe people apologies, you will see things clearer and learn a lot from it.
The inner child work is really hard and extremely painful but I'm having a bit of a wake up call over it and realise that it was through my parents having had poor parenting that is how they dealt with me so badly, but like you I didn't continue this with my children and have broken that cycle thankfully.
I still believe your poorly matched therapist you had on the nhs has in some way damaged you more and am sure if you could find someone else you would have different realisations and would be able to move  forward without having self blame etc. I hope this maybe something you could consider. Take care.

[Libby183]

Thank you so much, Eyessoblue.

Such a kind and understanding response was just what I needed. Your description of how disconnected you felt from your family rang so true to me. I am really starting to understand how strong this feeling was for me, as well. It wasn't just the bad times that I dissociated from. I never felt connected to them, even in the better times. Better times being, situations where everyone was OK with what my mother decided.  I still didn't really feel "right"  with them,  as if something was missing.  It's hard to explain the feeling,  but I suppose it was rooted in the failure of early attachment. I suppose,  then, that I probably did come over as "difficult".  My parents believe that they "tried so hard with me". That's maybe true, but they tried hard to make me fit in with their very strongly held view of family.  They were unable to even question why I was so unhappy.  I think this is where the emotional abuse really kicked in.  I had to be punished for spoiling our family.

So I do feel bad for my behaviour as a child and teenager,  but,  after my poor therapy experience, I am having trouble holding onto the idea that it wasn't all my fault. 

My therapist told me I was wrong in my belief that I was abused. I always assume I must be wrong about everything,  because that's the lesson I learned as a child and I assume every one else is right. But I don't trust myself or others.  That's a real feature of CPTSD isn't it? And that's where I am a bit stuck at the moment.

Thank you so much for your support and understanding.  In real life, I am coping quite well, keeping a nice, calm routine,  just with my husband, children and dog. If I could deal with the muddle of thoughts in my head, I would be OK.

Please keep in touch.

Hugs, Libby.

[Libby183]

Hi Hope.

Thank you for checking back in with me. It means a lot. I have missed you on the forum,  but am pleased you had positive experiences with your time away.

...........


I just wanted to follow up on what I said about my mother in law, for my own peace of mind. I don't generally hate anybody,  not even my FOO.  I don't hate my mother in law, either,  but I realise now that I had been very triggered by her recently. I hadn't spoken to her for a while,  but she phoned about my daughter splitting from her boyfriend.  They had lived together for a couple of years,  but DD felt it wasn't right any more.  Absolutely her decision and she has dealt with the fall-out and all the practicalities completely independently and with great maturity.  Despite telling MIL this, she tells me how E "will just have to get on and cope with it. That's life.  She'll just have to be strong"  and some other such phrases.  I was triggered into reliving her tendency to phone and ask me how things were,  when I had three children under three, two with disabilities,  and wasn't coping at all well.  As soon as I said things were less than perfect,  she would make the same sort of meaningless comments and hang up. I have been utterly invalidated by her for the whole 30 years I have known her. This is her personality,  she is like it with everyone,  my husband just accepts it and expects nothing from her. I go along with this,  but I tie myself in knots when she triggers me. We have never expected anything from her, but I really question whether a bit of validation,  sympathy,  understanding is really too much to want, especially when it is her who has initiated the conversation.  Then I tie myself in knots in my mind, telling myself that she can be however she wants to be and my reaction to her is my choice. But if my reaction to her is negative,  then I beat myself up about this, because I have no right to be judgemental, because I am damaged and therefore wrong in everything I decide. 

Net result,  I don't hate her or anyone, but I simply can't cope with them. How not to feel guilty and ashamed at that?

Recently, I have considered trying to explain my cptsd to my FOO and my in-laws. I would like to think it would explain my behaviour to them.  But I don't think either group would understand.  FOO would invalidate with anger and hurt, and in-laws with a dismissive lack of interest.

Is it me, or is it just the extreme loneliness of cptsd.

[Eyessoblue]

Hi Libby, yes that's exactly what it is I think, the early attachment issue, if there wasn't any connection from your mother when you were a baby and small child and like mine remained emotionally detached then how can you grow up with a positive life experience when your main carer  literally rejected you through their own issues and nothing you had done. You were a child, you knew no better how could you, what you needed to have as part of the thriving process you never got exactly the same as myself therefore we grow up feeling detached feeling like we never fitted in and still today I have certain resistance to people and find I keep myself detached because that's what we were shown in our early life......
Again as I've said before I don't think your therapist fully understood and sounded as if she had her own issues anyway so by telling you that hadn't suffered is her easy ticket out of there!!!
Please don't give up and don't blame yourself for anything, our childhood and experiences is what makes us and and if we've been shown poor experience then that is our learned behaviour and what we grow up believing. Don't doubt yourself, you know what you've been through, you know it was abuse and just because a 'therapist' tell you different doesn't mean it's right, they're very good at wearing the 'therapist badge' but until they actually know what they are talking about they may as well have a 'learner' badge on them!!
Keep going strong, keep believing that there is someone out there who will totally get what you're saying and understand and make your life experience more positive. Please keep in touch.

[Libby183]

Thank you so much, Eyessoblue. I was struggling with this whole issue and the shame and guilt I was feeling,  so reading your explanation helped so much. I have read this post several times and it is really helping to shrink the feelings of shame.

In fact,  even though I am suffering from this sinusitis,  I think I am doing quite well and feeling much more sure of myself about what I think and feel about things. It's quite an unusual sensation.

Hoping very much that your current therapy is working out for you.  I don't feel as negative about therapy as I did,  but will see how things go for a while,  especially as I do have a lot more insight and understanding than I did, and I am being kinder to myself than before.

Thank you again for your support.  You've helped me so much with your experience and your validation.

Take care.

Libby

[Eyessoblue]

Hi Libby, I'm glad my post helped. I'm doing inner child work with a private therapist it's going well but as she isn't trauma trained there are a lot of gaps. I'm being re assessed on tues and should hopefully be able to start attending anxiety clinic, but I've got to be 'bad enough' to fit the criteria and tick the right boxes!!!! It infuriates me as my last nhs counsellor discharged me saying my anxiety was so bad I needed to be referred to the clinic before she could continue counselling me and now they have to see if I'm bad enough, no doubt another waiting list until I can be seen again!!! I'll let you know how I get on.

[Seashell]

Hi Libby,

I finally had the chance to read through your recovery journal. I had been away from the forum for the last few weeks.

I'm not sure how you've been doing and feeling lately but I just wanted to let you know your progress was encouraging for me to read. Great work!

Also, I can deeply relate to the feelings of detachment and isolation.

Sending you a hug and supportive thoughts!
-  Seashell

[Hope67]

Hi Libby,
I hope you're ok.  You've been in my thoughts - and also your lovely dog - I hope her injuries are healing well - and I really hope that you and she can still walk outside - when you want to.    to you, Libby. 
Hope 

[Libby183]

I can't believe how long it has been since I wrote here.  In some senses, I have been doing quite well,  but I don't think I could ever describe it as recovery. Change, maybe,  but not recovery.

A while back, I was feeling especially anxious, as a side effect of therapy so I started on mirtazepine,  which I has initially resisted. Antidepressants have never really helped, but as this was targeted at anxiety,  I thought it might help. It most certainly did not - I became even more unstable.  Amidst the acting out,  for some reason,  I telephoned my parents and told them how much I hated them. I have never actually said this to them and it helped. In a short conversation they used every tactic commonly used by abusers. Their bottom line was that they behaved as all parents do, including beating me, to make themselves feel better.  I have been able to let go of a lot of guilt over nc.

But what I have been left with is the feeling that,  actually,  they are right.  They took it further than the majority of parents, perhaps,  but really,  most people aren't very nice. And I include myself in that. I have no illusions about myself or about other people.  The only variable seems to be the level of denial.

I have never felt at ease with my in laws. I blamed myself mostly.  But I realise that they are just like my FOO. Their daughter has been, I believe,  deeply affected by their emotional neglect, and this is all being played out through her treatment of her children and grandchildren.  I hate to see it. My in laws have five grandchildren (three are my children) and all five have real issues.  And yet, it's all so normal, it would seem, that it's OK.  All denial, no responsibility.  Just like my family,  and many others. It makes me so sad and angry, and so distrustful.  I think I have lost trust in my husband as well. His denial is amazing, as well.

The attack on my dog also cemented my fear of people.  It wasn't the nastiness of the attack,  so much as the response of the owner.  To her, it was the fault of my dog for having traumatised her dog in some fictious past encounter.  Her denial was absolute, and felt just my mother's denial. Her belief that she never did anything wrong.  It didn't happen or if it did, it was my fault. 

It seems that childhood abuse is so destroying because, ultimately,  it makes you question yourself and others.  I know I am a very flawed individual but that seems to make me see so many flaws in others.  Are these flaws normal? My parents and in laws certainly think they are. So I suppose I am to blame/think myself above others for objecting to these things. Why did I object to my parents in the first place? Lack of attachment,  certainly,  but why? Autism,  very possibly. 

This has all been sloshing around in my head so perhaps writing here will lessen it's hold on me.

Any feedback would be gratefully received.  I really am in a state of overwhelming confusion.

[Hope67]

Hi Libby,
Firstly, I just wanted to say that I've missed you - and I'm glad to see you here today -  to you.  I read what you wrote, and I saw you said that 'any feedback would be gratefully received' - so I wanted to reflect on what went through my mind as I read what you wrote - I am glad that you have 'been doing quite well' and you called that 'change' rather than 'recovery' - that makes sense to me - and I am glad that you have noticed some change.  I was also glad to hear that you felt that you were able to 'let go of a lot of guilt over nc' by contacting your parents and expressing your feelings to them.  I think that was a brave thing to have done. 

You spoke of some themes of 'denial' - and different levels of denial - and how this plays out in FOO, in-laws, and examples of your lovely dog too - and how that other owner didn't take responsibility for her part in what happened there.  I agree with you about levels of denial - I think they are quite prominent in many things - situations, scenarios, all kinds of things - and I've thought that people often are biased in terms of looking out for themselves (myself included) and then anything that doesn't fit with the perception can be minimised or denied - potentially.  When you spoke of the reaction of your parents when you phoned them, and how they acknowledged that how they had behaved had made them feel better - and of course, that was at the expensive of your feelings and your autonomy.  Denying your experience.  I felt sure that if I had contacted my FOO - that I would similarly have a response whereby they wouldn't take any responsibility for their behaviour - that seems very sad to me. 

I feel compassion for you when you say you question yourself and others, that you feel that you are a flawed individual and that you can see flaws in others.  I think you are sensitive to spotting what lies beneath denial - that you don't accept the sugary picture that can be portrayed by people - I often think of Enid Blyton at times like this, and how she wrote such carefree stories of Adventures and children having fun, and yet she had so many difficult things to deal with in her own personal life - and I wondered if maybe she dissociated into the fairytale land of writing to escape - to pretend that families were happy and content and enjoying Marmalade and Tea and cake.  Libby - the fact you are sensitive to seeing underneath these facades, and you can see the vulnerabilities in people and you feel them, I think it makes you a sensitive and more caring person - because if you didn't care, I doubt you'd feel these things and question what lies underneath denial.

Anyway, I hope you don't mind my writing so much - but you really made me think today - and what you wrote resonated strongly with me - and I just wanted to come over and give you some feedback on what you wrote - and how it made me feel - just a few reflections.

I wish you the best for the weekend, and I am happy to see you again Libby.  I hope you are able to go out walking with your lovely dog and that you have a good weekend.

Much love,
Hope