Okay, I thought it might be best if I do start a recovery journal after all. I do like posting different subjects in different sections, but I'm also starting to feel I wanna keep my story together. And there's just so much I want to vent that I don't want to be bothering others' threads with it too much or start so many different threads. So here goes. (Most of the suggestions for prompts make me wanna cry instantly so that's today too.)
It doesn't feel like recovering at the moment though. Bad dreams are returning. I think that's because I'm delving deeper into what's going on inside and the things I used to ignore are surfacing. I think I can deal with it and I knew it was gonna be difficult but still.
Parts work
I've been looking into parts work and I got to know a part I didn't know was so distinctive. I was feeling very low the other day and I was sitting in a very noisy overstimulating situations at a kids playground. And I was noticing how I have very strong opinions about people around me that are overweight (please don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to fat-shame anybody, I'm just being honest here to myself, it's difficult). And how these people would dare wear what they do and show their bodies anyway. (I realise I admire them in a way and I would not dare myself). And I thought, okay, if I have these thoughts about so many people, this really must be about ME. And suddenly, I saw her sitting. A little, blue fat part, cowering against the wall, enourmously afraid of being seen, of being there at all. Her hands over her head like she wanted to avoid being hit. And I felt so so very sad for her. (And I don't even think people would call me fat. I've just been called fat so many times by my abuser and my m implied the same, and this was at a time that I was actually underweight.)
And today, I had a very clear image of my inner critic. I do not like her at all (she looks like a schoolteacher dressed in grey traditional clothes with her hair tightly up in a bun, holding a ruler up in her hand, ready to smack me any time I make a mistake - my m was a school teacher, I recently learned her 'mothering' she was more like a school teacher than a mother) and most of all, I want her to go away. But it is important, I learned here, to distinguish between how she acts and what she says and what she's actually trying to do - she is trying to protect me. But I still don't know how to talk to her because she scares me so much.
And this morning in bed, I realised there's many many more parts that wanna come out now.
And a very difficult one is a baby, wrapped in cloth. (Someone will have to carry the baby because she cannot come to me herself.) Very still, not moving, not crying. Alone. Very difficult image to deal with.
I think I am approaching the pain and the grief that I'm supposed to in order to work through it and recover. Yesterday, my rib started hurting again. My rib was broken half a year ago (from coughing and pneumonia) and I was in a LOT of pain then (and fear also, for not being able to perform my duties). But these days, I didn't do anything physical that could have set off the rib. And I know the pain center in the brain for physical pain and mental pain are the same. That's how I know I'm approaching mental pain.
A dream
I dreamt that I had two places to clean up. (I have recurring dreams about having to pack because I'm going somewhere and having to clean up before I go and not having enough time because the plane is leaving, the place is a mess etc. etc.). The place where I was at was some sort of class room and the teacher was starting the lesson already and I still needed to clean up. And the teacher gave me a reprimand because I was disturbing class with my cleaning. But there was also another place, this appeared to be the place where we had slept and everybody had brought their stuff over from the dorm to the class room already but I hadn't yet and transportation between the two places was difficult. But I knew I had to get that stuff out first and I got angry at the teacher for scolding me and not understanding and I told him I couldn't do it, I could not do these things (taking care of both places) at the same time and I didn't have enough time.
And this tells me I am afraid I will not be able to keep up taking care of everything in my everyday life once I start digging into the stuff from before (I am starting therapy for real next Thursday brrr). I feel pressured. Actually, my boss (in a kind way, but still) said I should try to keep coming to work throughout therapy, but I'm not sure I will be able to.
Hey DF,
I think it's great that your parts were able to come out and you're compassionate about them, and willing to meet them. I laughed because I have a clear impression of your school teacher ICr and I have a teacher, and her treatment of me, still surface from time to time.
I also think it was really aware to realize your feelings to those people were not about them, but about you. Good on you for being brave and willing to admit that you felt those things you did and to deal with it in that way.
I don't know how much you've read about parts work, but in my understanding, it's always good to have permission from protectors before dealing with exiles as there can be reactions that come out. The baby might be one of those parts.
Sending you support :hug:
dolly
I think it's interesting with the dream that it's a school teacher and your ICr is a school teacher. Perhaps you're wanting to take care of, and "clean up," the emotional stuff in your life so you can move onto the next phase, but there is a critical aspect that is stopping you from doing that? Just my two bits, so please take and leave as needed.
Thank you dolly, it's nice to know someone is reading this. I think you're suggestions are very valuable. I'm only just now starting to read about the parts work, I'm not sure how it works entirely. But this is what happened anyway. Thanks for the support too. :hug:
Quote from: Desert Flower on August 18, 2024, 08:18:12 AMParts work
And a very difficult one is a baby, wrapped in cloth. (Someone will have to carry the baby because she cannot come to me herself.) Very still, not moving, not crying. Alone. Very difficult image to deal with.
I read this final paragraph before the rest. Really moved me, I felt sadness, sorrow and empathy. If I felt more deeply into the situation, I might feel a bit frozen, so I'm not going there. For reasons of self-care.
I've done a lot of Parts work over the years, more and more started cropping up, holding a lot of pain and fear, terror and other nameless 'uncomfortable' feelings. There were baby Parts too, or still are in fact, but better integrated now. Unfortunately I imagine there are more to come sometime. So I also resonate very much with "And this morning in bed, I realised there's many many more parts that wanna come out now."
Quote from: Desert Flower on August 18, 2024, 08:18:12 AMI've been looking into parts work and I got to know a part I didn't know was so distinctive. ... And I was noticing how I have very strong opinions about people around me that are overweight (please don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to fat-shame anybody, I'm just being honest here to myself, it's difficult). And how these people would dare wear what they do and show their bodies anyway. (I realise I admire them in a way and I would not dare myself). And I thought, okay, if I have these thoughts about so many people, this really must be about ME. And suddenly, I saw her sitting. A little, blue fat part, cowering against the wall, enourmously afraid of being seen, of being there at all. Her hands over her head like she wanted to avoid being hit. And I felt so so very sad for her. (And I don't even think people would call me fat. I've just been called fat so many times by my abuser and my m implied the same, and this was at a time that I was actually underweight.)
I am really interested to read the above. I also used to have strong opinions and even internal reactions like disgust towards overweight people, at the latest when I started intensive inpatient therapy 30 or so years, I knew it had nothing to do with those people. You're brave to write about it on the forum, I know you're not fat-shaming! I wasn't either, it was more like self-shame even though I also was underweight at the time. I'm now fat, no two ways about that, but I'm much less ashamed of my body than back then and no disgust about own body fat as far as I can tell. There's other stuff I resonate with too.
Your little blue fat part makes me feel sad. Gentle :hug: to you Adult DF of today. If that feels too close, please ignore. One of my own Little Blueberries is sending empathy to your little blue fat part. This Little Blueberry would stand facing your little blue fat part as close as safe for both. No words, just attempting comfort and solidarity and acceptance (literally 'standing with you'). And - I think, yup the Part confirms with a nod, this is a new Part of mine. (More on my own Journal some time, not here certainly.)
Thank you, thank you, thank you
Desert Flower! Your openness about your own parts and your process has brought me a whole lot of progress rn, while writing. I had no idea when I started this post that this would be the result, that a new Little Blueberry would turn up. (More on my own Journal some time, not here certainly.)
This is great Blueberry, how your responding is turning out for you. It really feels like we're helping each other by sharing, I like that a lot. It feels good your little Blueberry came out to stand with my little fat part. Thank you. :hug:
So okay, I'm really starting to feel like I'm posting 'too much', but I really feel there's so much I have to get out of my system.
About being strong/vulnerable
Funny thing is, when I've told people lately about how I'm feeling, that I'm starting therapy etc., they often respond by saying: But you're so strong, you're such a tough cookie, up to: But you're so bad-* with those tattoos all over. And the thing is, I've been trying to look strong for all those years indeed. I never wanted others to see how much of a mess I was inside, hurting, scared etc. Mostly, because I thought I would collapse entirely if I would really feel all of this myself.
And now I decided I'm not gonna keep that up anymore. I want to be able to feel vulnerable. I think it's time I explore that side of me. And so I tell people about it. And I get this reaction about being strong, like they don't want me to admit to this vulnerability either. Why would that be hard on them? They seem to wanna keep the old me. :Idunno:
And I also feel I need to write something about:
Asking for help
This is such a huge issue for me. I always think I have to do everything myself. I should be able to. Never ask for help.
- Trigger Warning -
In my family, and when the abuse was going on, everything inside me was screaming, but we didn't ask for help.
Except for one occasion. This was when our m was very upset, losing it really, and my brother and I were teenagers watching this and we just had no idea what to do. We had no skills for this. We had never learned to deal with any emotions. And then she said she wanted to end her life, she didn't wanna live anymore. And we knew that in our neighbourhood, there was this person who had been like a friend to the family. So my brother and I went to his house and told him what was going on. I don't remember anything of what happenend next. The only thing I remember is the massive anger and outrage that our m buried us with afterwards. Just to make sure we never ever ever asked for help again. And we didn't. :fallingbricks:
Desert Flower,
I truly feel what you are saying. Being punished for trying to save your m's life by asking an adult for help just breaks my heart. I'm SO sorry that happened to you. I feel deep connection with you right now over what you're going through. I wish I could grab my toolbox and head to your house and fix anything you wanted fixed, just to help you feel the truth that you are allowed to ask for help.
Naturally, I feel this empathy because I am just like you in that regard. Asking for help is pretty close to completely impossible when it was something that shamed us in the past. I know the same feeling. I was to be everyone's helper, and if I ever asked for help, I was punished. So today I am quick to serve and unable to accept help in return.
My heart definitely goes out to you. Dealing with the traumas that keep us from our birthrights is so unfair. We all have the right to ask for help. But trauma keeps us from doing it. I'm terrible at it too. I never want anyone to help me with anything. I feel you. I empathize totally.
:hug:
Thank you Papa Coco. That's such a great and empathetic response. I really feel you getting ready with your toolbox to come over and fix things, it warms my heart. I'm so glad you're here.
When I wrote it, I didn't feel anything really. It's only now that I read your response that I'm starting to feel it. Yes, it was hard. It is hard. Makes me sad now. That's okay.
I got so much stuff I'm gonna have to work through. It's a lot. (We're all gonna be okay though, Papa Coco. We are.)
:hug:
I'm getting quite apprehensive and anxious about my next therapy session, that's Thursday. This will be the first real session really, the last turned out to be an extended intake. So we haven't really started yet. I really don't know what we'll be doing, it's called schema therapy (which is maybe like inner child and parts work, I'm not sure) and some other stuff. And this will supposedly have to get done in ten sessions. This seems quite impossible to me. How can all this stuff that I've carried around all my life be done in ten sessions?? It cannot. My husband says I'm gonna be doing 90 percent of the work myself anyway, so it doesn't matter much. So it might help a little bit. Maybe I should just think of it as another step in the process.
Desert Flower,
I understand your anxiety around Thursday's Schema therapy session. It will most likely be okay, but that doesn't mean the days leading up to it are a bit nerve wracking. It would be for me too.
I looked up Schema Therapy. I don't understand it by reading about it on the internet. It says it's focused on the right goals. Even though 10 sessions are not a lifelong healing treatment, I have participated in many, many, many different short-term therapies, and while they didn't make me live "happily ever after," they did help. So, hopefully, even though you only get 10 sessions, hopefully you'll gain at least some tools from it that you can apply to your healing while you experience more types of therapies in the future. The multi-pronged approach to healing is probably the best idea. A little of this. A little of that. Each therapy gives us more tools. I've been with my therapist for 30 years and he's helping me a lot but he's not the silver bullet either. I've learned a lot from him but also from some of the many other things I've done in addition. They weren't the silver bullets either, but each thing I've done has given me something I didn't have before participating in it.
I am excited to hear what you think about Schema Therapy. Even if it isn't long enough, it might give some good stuff for you to add to your list of things you do to work through the Trauma issues of life.
Hi DF,
I just wanted to say that I hope your therapy session goes well :cheer:
Sending you support,
dolly
Again, so many things to vent. I do apologize for not responding to many of your posts these days, I'm very self-absorbed.
Quote from: Papa Coco on August 20, 2024, 03:08:26 AMThe multi-pronged approach to healing is probably the best idea. A little of this. A little of that. Each therapy gives us more tools.
and
Quote from: Papa Coco on August 20, 2024, 03:08:26 AMeven though you only get 10 sessions, hopefully you'll gain at least some tools from it that you can apply to your healing while you experience more types of therapies in the future
Yes, therapy is a step my process. Even if it is ten sessions, it may well be helpful. And indeed, I've come a long way already by trying different things at different times. And I had different teachers before, whose advice was spot on sometimes and other times not quite that and some of it was (I now see) premature. That's all okay. I have to be realistic.
Today has been such a great day. I did something great for myself: I asked for help! In the workplace even! :cheer:
A month or so ago, I'd already opened up in the workplace but I did't feel so great afterwards. I think it was because, while my colleagues did respond in a supportive way, it still wasn't what I needed, because I've been lacking so much confirmation that the confirmation a normal person would give does not suffice for me. The colleagues were not to blame, past experiences were.
But today, I took it a step further. At my work place, once a year or so, we have evacuation exercises. And they scare me terribly. They make me very anxious. So I had been taking part in these 'safety walks' that prepare us for evacuations, but I had not remembered any of what they said, I had just dissociated completely and I still have no idea what exit to use in these cases. So this was not gonna help. So today what I did was, I asked my teammates whether any of them would be willing to be my 'buddy' in such a situation, and walk me to the exit, knowing I would probably not be communicating very adequately and all of them said Yes, they would.
But that wasn't the best part. The best was riding my bike back home and thinking about this afterwards, and feeling soooo relieved. I just felt so light! And the relief was that I didn't care anymore if they were talking about it to other people or if they had any opinions about it. So what if they think I'm vulnerable, or strong, or silly, or wise or whatever. Let them think whatever they want. I thought: I spent 50 years worrying about what people probably didn't think of me, just making up the worst scenarios unrelated to the truth, let me now spend the rest of my years NOT worrying about whatever they DO think of me. Ha ha. :phoot:
Quote from: dollyvee on August 18, 2024, 08:47:52 AMI don't know how much you've read about parts work, but in my understanding, it's always good to have permission from protectors before dealing with exiles as there can be reactions that come out. The baby might be one of those parts.
I wanted to get back on this dolly, because I've been reading into 'No Bad Parts' some more and I think you're right here. I now learned about the exiles, protectors and fire-fighters and I've got all of them of course.
(I also read 'Healing the Shame' in the mean time, but I'm not sure where to start on that so I'll leave that for now.)
So far, I've found that around this baby (and around some other very young parts like Little Indian and Ladybug, whom I also discovered recently) there are some big protectors and for now they're not letting me anywhere near these exiles. There is a very strong sense of NO here, they're not moving at all. There are five or six of them, they are larger than life and they do have a somewhat human shape but quite amorphous and they are whitish/almost translucent. And in addition, there is a fence around the exiles. So it seems I will have some work to do with these protectors. That's okay, I'll do that.
I've also discovered some more distinct protectors, in addition to the Teacher, there is Ms. Perfect, Anxiety (keeping me from feeling sad and angry parts or anything else), and Nice Girl (fawning in order to avoid parts getting triggered). All very strong parts. I was able to relate to Anxiety a little bit, she wanted to be held and stroked and acknowledged really, she would still stick around but she was be able to sit down in my lap and not be so jumpy anymore.
I also have a very strong protector that used to cause many different physical symptoms to keep me from feeling unwanted emotions, but I had learned to relate to that very well already. She's now causing me to feel my rib (that I broke a while ago) but that's okay.
And I used to have some very strong fire-fighters too, that were trying to numb me into not feeling anything by doing drugs and drinking alcohol too much, but I stopped doing all that 15 years ago (after I really had been in some very risky situations because of them and I didn't wanna end up as a newsflash).
(Oh, and I just found another one: Organizer, very strong protector too. Very interesting, almost fun this discovery.)
Desert Flower,
Wow. I'm getting chills reading about all the good parts you are meeting up with right now. You're covering all the bases, Exiles, Protectors, Organizers, etc. I've found that in my life, the IFS work has been one of the most powerful healing tools I've worked with. You are really running with this. I'm cheering for you that you and your parts are all getting to know how you can work as a team and less as isolated individuals.
This is really good news, and I'm glad you guided me toward reading this thread. I love reading when my friends on the forum are on a positive roll.
I actually feel like right now is a good time to say Congratulations on how well the book is helping you meet and greet and interact with all your good parts.
:party:
May the healing continue!
Thanks for cheering me on Papa Coco YAY!!!
More and more keep coming out ... It's like a dam broke and there's no stopping the flow (I feel okay though, at ease, remarkably).
There's a Dissociative Part of course, I'll call her Airy (She's up in the air it feels). She's also a protector/ fire-fighter keeping me from feeling the pain and sadness and fear of the little ones (and of the exiled teenagers as well!) by not being here at all. She's done an awful lot of work for me. She still takes over a lot. But I'm getting better at feeling when she does it and then bringing my Self back by feeling my body. I've been practicing. But she's keeping doors shut still. I think she may be multiple.
And there's Fantasy, a very young protector, who's been making up stories about why my father wasn't really be dead and was gonna be coming back in the end. She's sitting by the fence. Or by the (communal) swimming pool (in my home town). She's had quite the task, being such a little one. But she can be quite stubborn too. And she's very sad when I tell her dad did really die. She doesn't know what to do now. I'll hold her. I think I will have to hold her for a long time.
And there's Worker Girl. Getting things done. Check, check, check. Lately she's quieted down a lot though. Sometimes I'm almost lazy now. And content. I've gotten a lot done these last couple months. (But also, I feel like I lost my drive somehow. Maybe it's not important to me anymore the way it used to be, working working working. I like looking at the sky better sometimes. Very strange.)
And come to think of it, very hard to admit, Lover has become an exiled part somewhere along the way.... Worker Girl and Organizer have a lot to do with that I think. They give Lover no time or relaxation (she needs that) to come out. And Lover feels no longer needed. She's lonely. And she's with my little Fat part now. And she's with Little Indian, who's not allowed to play anymore.
Wow. I've got a lot of Parts.
Quote from: Desert Flower on August 20, 2024, 05:20:39 PMToday has been such a great day. I did something great for myself: I asked for help! In the workplace even! :cheer:
As someone who also finds it hard to ask for help, I cheer with you!
Hey Desert Flower,
I started reading your story because your name resonates with me. I nearly chose the name of Prickly Pear which is also a desert flower before it fruits. I'm Saluki because I've always been running away but I never managed to run away fast enough, so I wanted to be the fastest most streamlined being like a saluki. I'm very conscious that I'm very self absorbed too, that's normal with CPTSD. I think it's more being overwhelmed with so many thoughts because self absorbed feels uncomfortable, so please don't worry about replying. It often takes me months to even remember I wrote something on here. Tomorrow I will probably have forgotten I wrote this reply but I just wanted to say I have read maybe half of your posts and I have some similar traumas. My mother brought me up like I was her pupil. I was never treated as a daughter. I understand the stern teacher thing and my inner critic (or one of them) wears stern grey clothes too. Also my mother threatened suicide. Different experiences different people but reading your story helped me cry because I empathise so much. Because I went through similar.
I don't understand much about parts but trying to learn. But reading about your different parts was a very emotional experience for me because I identify with so much.
The fat thing, wow, I was just writing something about fat shaming from my own experience, why oh why do abusers body shame us too? It's like they want to squeeze every drop of confidence out of us. I'm aware that I'm too vague headed to express what I want to at the moment so I'll stop filling your page with my essay!
Wishing you every luck with your therapy. I hope you are able to find a lot of healing in it. It's reassuring to read about short term things helping others even if it's not a magic fix, every step along the way goes to finding our way a little easier.
Hi Saluki, nice of you to drop by. I looked up what a Saluki is, I didn't know. And I like your ladybug too, one of my Inner Child Parts is called Ladybug.
And although it's not at all nice to know some of these things happened to you too, it is good we can share. That really helps. Thank you.
I must say my first real therapy session went very well today. Exceeded my expectations really. I'm very happy about that.
I was a little bit apprehensive but confident too when I went there. And this T has this approach of 'walk and talk'. So we walked through a forest and sat by a lake a little away from my neighbourhood. And she acknowledged I might not feel completely safe being in the forest and with people walking their dogs so that helped.
And what I liked very much was that she started right where I was at the moment, not from what she had planned (although she is still working from the Schema Therapy perspective). And as I had been working with my Parts in the past days, she went right in there with me. I felt supported.
First, we created my own safe place, which was nice.
And then we worked with the baby part, we unwrapped her, held her (the T held the baby actually after she asked if that was okay and I sat with them), we gave the baby a nice room with some soft toys, sang songs to her. And the baby started making little sounds and playing with her toes (I'm surprised how fast this happened) and it was very nice and comfy.
I told her afterwards I had been a little scared that she went in straight away to the most vulnerable part but I also felt like something had opened up and I had been able to handle it all right. And it's good to start with these basic needs.
And I must say, therapy has come long way since my first terribly useless experiences with it. This might actually be very helpful. I now feel we're actually healing something.
Now, I do have some backlash of being tired and my back hurting a bit, but this is a protector I know very well and I'll be able to handle.
Next time, we will be working on my biography (I already wrote that) and my basic needs.
(I looked in on the protectors later on and they were surprised and befuddled that I had been able to handle this. They're not quite sure what to do now.)
Quote from: Desert Flower on August 20, 2024, 05:20:39 PMToday has been such a great day. I did something great for myself: I asked for help! In the workplace even! :cheer:
That's awesome! I understand how daunting it can be to work up for the courage for this stuff, so it's all very commendable. :cheer:
Hearing about your parts discoveries and communication is really nice to hear, I'm glad you're getting these benefits out of therapy! I don't know what all these part archetypes are or what they entail but it's really neat that you know.
Regards,
Aphotic.
Hey DF, my therapist gave me a little tiny plastic baby and has asked me to take care of that baby-self in me, protect it, comfort it, like I myself would like to be comforted. Sounds like you are doing a lot of good things in therapy. Good to read and know, thanks. :hug:
Hi Chart, nice of you to drop by. I hope you are okay.
Yes, my therapist also suggested I keep a little plushy with me to comfort when I need it. So take that with me as well now.
:hug:
My therapist gave me some homework and that was difficult.
There was this chart of seven basic needs that should have been fulfilled in our earliest childhood and with me, five out of seven turned out not to have been. And the other assignment was to write my biography and my T gave me some pointers for that like: who did you turn to for comfort (no one) and if there was no one inside the family you could turn to, who outside the family would you turn to (no one) etc. It made me feel really bad/sad.
A while ago I was very happy that I found out there actually was never anything wrong with me, there was a lot wrong with what happened to me. But now, diving into what actually happened to me, has been difficult. And I feel so different from the people around me who do not seem to feel this way at all. Me comparing again, I shouldn't.
And I've also been thinking about what I think Lakelynn said about us grieving what we could have been in life, had we not had this condition. That is really sinking in too. I'm trying to accept what is. And at times I can really feel we do not need to be 'the best' at everything and what matters most is to be happy and I am really happy at times. But I still feel really inadequate many times and not living up to expectations. Whose expectations, would be the question. That would be the part of me that wants to be perfect. Not possible. So this endeavour would be doomed to fail.
And I read a bit of really useful advice from the School of Life about 'what others think of us'. Just in case my feeling inadequate would have something to do with that. SoL said that in ancient times, when we were living in tribes, our lives would actually depend on what others thought of us and fitting in with the group. But in our times, with social securities and all that, it shouldn't matter so much to us anymore what others think. Just as a reminder to myself.
Which would of course be different for infants and very young children, being totally dependent on their parents for survival, which brings me back to my former point of basic needs (not) being met, making us feel very anxious.
And I bought myself a really nice sweater that says "Issues". Cause I've got some, yes.
Desert Flower, I resonate with what you wrote. I both feel relief and grief for understanding my upbringing through the lens of CPTSD. I wonder if I will ever truly feel like I belong. I appreciate what you wrote and am glad to be on this journey with others here.
Quote from: Desert Flower on August 30, 2024, 01:04:56 PMwho did you turn to for comfort (no one) and if there was no one inside the family you could turn to, who outside the family would you turn to (no one) etc. It made me feel really bad/sad.
I feel your pain, Desert Flower. I find there's a lot of questions like that out in the wild that constantly remind us of our needs not being met. Even as something simple as "who is your emergency contact?" And my list is more like a.. "here's who NOT to contact in an emergency", eep.
I understand the grieving, it can be such a lonely and disheartening sensation.
Regards,
Aphotic.
i can relate, DF. we may have gotten some very basic needs met, like shelter, perhaps, but being able to turn to someone for comfort? i didn't have that, either. and i think getting into the specifics of what went on for us growing up can be extremely painful to face, and can also take some time to grieve. i know i still am.
slowly, at your own pace, ok? i've also learned the hard way that going too fast into this stuff can be overwhelming, which often is not a good thing. love and hugs :hug:
Okay, so before I run out of energy for the day, I really want to write something here. I've been wanting to for some time, but I didn't get round to it.
I've been practicing with these parts and at times it really worked. Like I was driving my car, feeling more and more anxious (not explaining all the details here), but at some point, I took anxiety into my lap and told her okay I know you're here and didn't she know we had done this a thousand times already, we can do this, and she did calm down a little.
And there was something I wanted to write about my former manager, when I told her I was going into therapy, she asked: was this [condition] making me unhappy? Maybe I wrote this before, but it just makes me so mad still, she really didn't get any of it! Yes, it's making me unhappy!!! How would she feel if she was anxious 80% of the time, and sad or tired the rest of the time??? That doesn't feel nice does it? Bloody h***! Just needed to vent that, apologies.
So I've been doing all right this week I think. Practicing being present, feeling my parts when they come up, communicating about what I feel.
My daughter really made me feel good yesterday, she said: Why would you need therapy at all, mum? Meaning, she thinks there's nothing wrong with me (she's not so sensitive, not easily impressed, like my husband too). I like that.
So I had another GREAT therapy session yesterday. Really, I am very impressed and it is so much better than I expected it to be (my earliest experiences with therapy 30 years ago were terrible). We now worked with the experience I wrote about before of being scolded by my m for asking for help.
My therapy is Schematherapy and it is very much working with the inner children (disfunctional or more functional) and inner parents or inner critics. So there's the vulnerable child, the angry child etc, somewhat similar to Parts Work I think.
And in addition we've been doing Imagery or Imaginairy (both terms are used) Rescripting and wow this is powerful! I really feel like were restoring the cracks in my foundation so to speak. I really feel more solid afterwards.
So in yesterday's session we rescripted the asking for help experience, the t stepped in and told the child what she had done was indeed well done and told the m she should not be scolding her children for asking for help. And the t brought in some more adults that we as kids could turn to whenever a situation like that occurred again. And she told my m she needed to get help for herself. And the child really felt supported and okay about herself. Like the adults were now taking care of business. And the child could relax.
Here's some resources about this kind of therapy that I found. Some of the titles are about PTSS, but actually this also goes for C-PTSS, and CSA as well (and apparently beneficial for people with autism too).
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/233667393_Imagery_Rescripting_A_New_Treatment_for_Survivors_of_Childhood_Sexual_Abuse_Suffering_From_Posttraumatic_Stress
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0005791607000651?via%3Dihub
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1077722921001243?via%3Dihub
I really feel therapy has come a long way and I'm very happy about this and hopeful now something can actually be achieved here.
:cheer:
I celebrate with you all the things that are feeling good right now.
And today I know I am gonna be all right.
(Yesterday evening, I took my m to a concert and she actually really liked it and so did I. And last night, it rained ever so softly and that was nice too.)
And I just recently started talking about the most difficult stuff here and I know I will be able to process it now. I know I am strong enough now. I am in a safe and supportive place. I can do this. And I know I can feel better. No, this stuff won't ever go away and maybe I won't even change so much. But I noticed I can start accepting who I am and how I work. And I started taking care of my needs. So what if I'm different. So what If I'm vulnerable. That's okay. Here I am. This is it. And I can do this. Thank you all for the support. :heythere:
DF, that all sounds so wonderful! very glad you're having good therapy sessions - so helpful. and i'm loving that attitude - your strength is shining thru the screen. keep up the good work :thumbup: love and hugs :hug:
I agree DF, you can do this. And your post brought tears to my eyes because I know what you are feeling and that ray of hope when we get it is so HUGE... I feel it too. It's indescribable... I know I'm going to survive... And I feel love around me now. Poop, I'm crying again...
Thank you
:)
And today I just feel awful. Just when I thought I was doing so great. And I know I am doing great work, I do.
But it just became too much today. There's just so much to do, things to be taken care of, job, kids, take the car to the garage, take care of my m somehow. I just don't know how to do all of it. I know rationally I can do all this, all of it usually gets done after all, and still this doens't give me the belief that I can do it. It's just me feeling I can't do it. And I get so stressed out and today I'm just so fed up with feeling this way.
I've been feeling like this all my life it feels. Just stressed out all the time. I just hate it so thoroughly. I want it to go away.
So I called in sick today for work because I have been crying for an hour now at my desk (working from home today). My manager knows I'm in this process and he said no problem. But I just feel like such a failure for not doing everything that everybody else seems to be able to handle.
Although I do think it's good that I am finally crying. I never used to be able to cry at all.
But now I just feel like how am I gonna accept that this is it? This is the way I am. I am such a difficult mother to my kids, I just wish I could do better and not be so stressed out over nothing all the time but I just can't (at the moment). I just hope it's a step in my process and it will get better again.
Hey DF, I've come to regard the amygdala as a massive monster. I actually equate it to a black hole out in deep space. Certain black holes are over 100 times the mass of our sun. You, me, all of us are dealing with our brain, and on the emotional level, specifically, the amygdala. Developmental trauma got it seriously out of whack, and it's a monster. An enormous, unequivocal, devouring monster.
But to my view, you are doing EXACTLY what you need to be doing to begin dealing effectively with your trauma. Perhaps with one caveat, but please don't feel bad when I point it out because it's something we ALL do: You're being really tough on yourself. You think because now you "know" what you have is trauma, it should and will just start to evaporate... It's not easy to evaporate a black hole 100 times more massive than the sun.
Here's how I think it works and what I am doing. I am assembling a tool box. Here are the items in it. I think you are doing the same.
1) Good trauma therapy with a caring therapist, devoted, committed and with lots of different tools and techniques to suggest and do.
2)Writing, writing writing writing... (I see you all over the forum. You write a lot. I know, I'm doing the same :) ) Writing is one of the ways we "process" information. Effective therapeutic "processing" gets it out of the hands of the amygdala, and stored away in a safe place that allows recall without flashback.
3) Learning and gaining consciousness of ourselves. Reading books, online material, watching annoying YouTube videos, not once but over and over... Going to online seminars... and reading and reacting to people on the Forum (or anywhere). You sure are doing that one too. Me too. Right now, writing all this to you I am "processing" the information I already have, but I'm organizing and REINFORCING it. Instead of going to lie down after lunch, I checked the Forum. I read you post. I'm now working on my trauma. (Thank you by the way, you know? :) )
4) Did I mention reading and responding on the Forum :)
5) I do some body work. Breathing and abdominal training (Methode Guillarme). I also do PMR (Progressive Muscle Relaxation). Both of these have improved my sleep. A great deal of "processing" occurs during sleep. Good sleep helps healing (but it's not always easy to do, so working on that with my therapist has been immensely helpful).
5) I also do Cardiac Coherence. Five minutes of timed-breathing. This literally calms the nervous system down. It's rare that I don't feel the effects. Sometimes I repeat another five minutes. I almost 100% of the time feel at least a slight change in the "relief" direction. I reinforce my consciousness of this, as I have a tendency to do things for awhile, then slack off to nothing.
So in one month I'd say I brought myself out of a 90% constant flashback to 40%. I did do intensive therapy during that whole month (3 hours every two days for thirty days). My therapist wants to begin doing intensive therapy like this on a regular basis with her clients. I actually think it's a good idea too. Dina's journal recounts this same sort of thing with MDMA assisted therapy. I'm doing Neurofeedback and will continue along that route.
But maybe the point of all this is that idea of a tool box. There's all sorts of methods, techniques, options, theories, etc. We each build our own toolbox as we go along. We try all sorts of different stuff and try to analyze accurately what actually works (which can be especially tricky with pain and trauma as it seems like NOTHING really works... and this is where we have to be particularly stoic and try to get out of the emotional deluge. What we perceive as "small" progress shouldn't bring us down. I'm convinced there are all sorts of things going on in the brain that do not, if ever, come to our conscious awareness. So we are inevitably very poor judges of "progress". That's where being nice to ourselves really becomes important. For many of us this is totally alien because we've simply NEVER experienced it. If our family wasn't nice to us how could we possibly learn to be nice to ourselves? Makes sense. Lots of people have written about different techniques, like shouting at their inner critic... whatever works. But we have to do it. Be nice to ourselves.
Boy, that was a rant! But I hear you about your kids. I so identify. I want to be a good dad, but I really screwed a lot of stuff up with my kids. And now that I'm on my last one (11 yrs) I'm fighting that tendency to be negative and self-critical. It's working. I'm getting better and I know that I am a good dad. (Dina wrote beautifully about this in her journal...) I will ALWAYS acknowledge the errors I made raising my kids. I will not deny anything. And my kids know this. When the days comes I will not blind myself to my own mistakes.
As it is I have a great relationship with my son and youngest daughter. And there's plenty of time and I will continue healing and I'm positive and optimistic that this life is really worth living.
Sorry to take up your journal space with my history. But the intention is to help by sharing.
Edit : And all that and I'm actually on the downward end of an annoying flashback. I spent all Monday in bed, the whole day. I'm starting to come out of it. Writing all this in your journal has also helped. I actually feel okay. So thanks!!! :)
Big hugs and hang in there!
:hug:
OH Chart you are so great and priceless! Coming to the rescue like that again. I cannot say how much I appreciate it. I'm gonna put YOU in my toolbox!
And you're right, I am being too hard on myself many a times. Like I was just now.
You left only one thing out though, the name of that hospital where they surgically remove the amygdala please. I don't care what it costs. I can really do without.
So yeah, I'll keep it up. I'll get to "I can do it" again. I just arranged for my son to eat at a friends' house (very difficult asking for help but I did it) so I can have a bit of a rest myself.
Thanks so much :hug:
glad you're getting a little rest time for you, DF, and congrats on asking for help! well done! :thumbup:
i hate this roller coaster ride of feeling good one day, horrible the next. it can truly be discouraging. at times i can remember what so many here have said - this, too, shall pass. i hope you can as well. love and hugs :hug:
Thank you sanmagic7 :hug:
Quote from: Desert Flower on September 11, 2024, 12:45:16 PMOH Chart you are so great and priceless! Coming to the rescue like that again. I cannot say how much I appreciate it. I'm gonna put YOU in my toolbox!
I'm only goin in if it's nice and big and there's lots of Legos! :)
Quote from: Desert Flower on September 11, 2024, 12:45:16 PMYou left only one thing out though, the name of that hospital where they surgically remove the amygdala please. I don't care what it costs. I can really do without.
Hey that's an interesting question!
https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/can-i-have-my-amygdala-removed
Quote from: Desert Flower on September 11, 2024, 12:45:16 PMSo yeah, I'll keep it up. I'll get to "I can do it" again. I just arranged for my son to eat at a friends' house (very difficult asking for help but I did it) so I can have a bit of a rest myself.
:cheer:
Quote from: sanmagic7 on September 11, 2024, 02:59:11 PMi hate this roller coaster ride of feeling good one day, horrible the next. it can truly be discouraging. at times i can remember what so many here have said - this, too, shall pass.
I think it's all about getting a certain amount of "control". I'm preparing for the downs for the rest of my life, I just want to manage them so that when they arise they don't overwhelm me. The wiring is in place. I am who I am because of my WHOLE experience, trauma included. Trauma will become a window I've seen through, know intimately and no longer fear to approach when I hear scary sounds outside in the night. I will always feel the fear of what's on the other side, but it will lessen, and I will know deeper and deeper with the passage of time that those things are of the past, and can no longer hurt me now unless I let them.
Wow to have confidence like that is great Chart.
I guess I'm still in the process of accepting that these downs will continue to come (albeit maybe lessened). To accept that this is it. That I'll have to deal with it somehow.
I am calmer today. Not worry-free but calmer at least. I think I'll work half a day today and slow down the rest of the day as much as possible (although I still need to drive the kids to their activities this afternoon too).
I'm glad to read that you are feeling calmer. I hope you can relax well at some point today.
Quote from: Chart on September 12, 2024, 05:40:06 AMI'm only goin in if it's nice and big and there's lots of Legos!
That's settled then.
Quote from: Chart on September 12, 2024, 05:40:06 AMHey that's an interesting question!
https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/can-i-have-my-amygdala-removed (https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/can-i-have-my-amygdala-removed)
Nice article, thank you Chart! Not quite sure anymore. :bigwink:
I'm really really tired now. This is my brains' reaction to yesterdays' big emotions.
What I think started off the EF, or at least contributed to it, was this:
I had a meeting last Sunday with some of my Buddhist group and our elder/teacher. And somehow, we ended up talking about my progress and I told him/them something about how I've been feeling lately (feeling everything instead of nothing - like I used to). And the teacher gave me some advice about meditating less intensely which was quite helpful.
The only thing was, I've had the feeling I wasn't completely clear with him as to why I am feeling this way, that is, the traumas that I've been processing. And the reason I didn't want to tell him/them then and there, was there was an elderly woman present that I don't know very well, but that was in a documentary that aired the other day about how she spent some of her young childhood in an internment camp in the second world war. And although I had been scared to watch the documentary and I hadn't seen it, my thoughts were that her trauma must be far worse than mine. And that's why I was reluctant to share my whole story.
And then afterwards, I've felt that I had not been completely honest with the teacher and I've felt bad about that. And also maybe about letting myself down by not saying what was important to me because I didn't wanna offend someone else :fallingbricks:
- trigger warning maybe -
And I've also been feeling bad because another nice elderly lady I know told me she'd had her grandson living with her for the past three months because his mother, her daughter in law, had been unwell (anorexic and hospitalised for depression) and I thought, well I've not been feeling so great myself these past ten years and nobody's ever come to take care of my kids, we've all been doing that ourselves all the time and it's been really hard. It has made me feel really lonely and little me is feeling it's not fair :fallingbricks:
ya know what, DF? it isn't fair, not at all. and it wasn't fair that other woman had to spend time in an internment camp. this stuff just isn't fair.
fairness, however, doesn't take away the awfulness of any one person's trauma. just like us, it's all different. i think your truth is righteous, and you deserve to speak it. we don't know what kind of, if any, support that woman had, whereas, like you said, you didn't have the help and support you needed while dealing with your own trauma.
i've heard it said here on the forum that comparing what we went thru to what others went thru is not necessarily a healthy thing. i've done it too many times, even brought it up to my T. she reiterated that trauma is trauma, and those of us who have been traumatized have been traumatized, and no one can say which is worse or better.
love and hugs :hug:
You're right sanmagic7, I know you are. Nobody should have their trauma 'measured' against someone else's.
But I wanted to write it anyway, because in retrospect I saw I unwittingly did compare, and that contributed to me feeling bad. Just to clarify to myself what works and what doesn't and to acknowledge my feelings about the unfairness of it. So hopefully next time, I will be able to spot it earlier and stop doing it.
I think "comparing" is a big part of cognitive functioning. Our brains "have to" do it. It's part of analytical processing. We do it constantly and it's important even to a survival level.
I find myself comparing people's stories to my own all the time. I think it's part of my integration processing. I don't give it much weight. It's just like another detail. It's my emotions trying to be dramatic (as usual). My cognitive reasoning fully believes (like most here) that comparison is for all intents and purposes, pointless. Pain is pain, the differences in "amount" are absurd to try and quantify. There are far more important things to focus our attention on. What really matters is common understanding. Knowing we're not alone... and not some arbitrary ranking system. But I still do it... and then try to ignore it :doh:
Quote from: Chart on September 13, 2024, 06:50:48 PMWhat really matters is common understanding. Knowing we're not alone...
True Chart, thank you.
-----------
I was quite all right for a few days after a big job at my mothers' place was finally done. She still has a passive aggressive way of asking us to do some more chores, but I'm not gonna do them because she is perfectly capable of doing them herself and they're not important anyway.
And today was another hard day, but also good in a way.
I now have my own reserved desk at work, while the office is supposed to be totally flexible. It was really difficult asking and as it turns out, my manager needed to put in quite some effort to get it done so it's great he did that. And then the sign indicating it was gonna be my desk (I had asked for a specific desk), was put on the wrong desk. So I went and asked the facilities guy where he had put it and then he asked me would the other desk be okay too and that was too much. I was so anxious already about having asked for a big favour and being granted that. And the facilities guy saw my reaction and then went ahead and fixed the original desk for me. Which was great. Only, someone else was already working there and that put me on the spot, feeling I had to explain and I managed to say: "I have an invisible disorder". Which was enough really and fair enough. Only I never said that out loud at any work place before so this was a THING for me. And that sent me into an EF the rest of the day. And the guy at 'my' desk didn't move for the rest of the day. But I ran into the facilities guy again later and he said that Thursday (my next day at the office) I could go sit there first thing. And I think it's gonna be okay. The result counts. Although I'm having a bit of trouble with the emotions at the moment, I can see through it. So okay then.
Well worked through DF!!
DF, i'm glad you were able to clarify for yourself the comparison thing. please forgive me if i seemed 'preachy' or something.
having to stand up for yourself, especially someplace like a work setting, can definitely be anxiety producing. however, you did it, and well done! hopefully you'll have your desk now and everyone else will leave it alone. love and hugs :hug:
No problem at all sanmagic7, it's good to get things clear so thank you, it was helpful!
So I've been away for a while. I've been reading some posts here and there, but it seems I don't know where to start replying or I don't know so many helpful things to say, apologies.
Just some stuff I wanted to get off my chest here. Not coherent maybe.
So the guinnee pig is ill. It makes me sad because it is the most gentle creature in the world and now we have to force feed him.
I was very sad about my yoga teacher retiring after I took her classes for six years. I did find a new yoga place that's quite nice. But it will never be as great as it was. And three weeks without yoga was not good for me.
So I did get my reserved desk at work. And then I told my collegues about it in a team meeting and that went okay.And sitting at the desk I actually got some work done. Yay.
Yesterday, I went to a big horse event with my daughter and the first few hours I was totally overwhelmed. And I knew I was while I was in it. Half way through I took a time out and after that it went better.
And last friday I had my first EMDR session, which turned out great actually. Yes, I do think we're going somewhere with that.
But what's bothering me most is how to deal with this long term. Life is just so different since I'm aware what's going on. Going in and out of EF's and being aware of that. Like that big event and being overwhelmed, while I used to go to parties and festivals all the time and I just never used to feel a thing and I used to be drunk/high at that and I know that's not healthy either but somehow it seemed easier? But will these feelings lessen? Will I get used to them? Or will it just be me trying to cope, just bearing the responsibility myself?
It's an EF writing this I know. Because I was better earlier in the day and earlier I did think the the feelings will get better. And my daughter said something that upset me, we were at the stables and she was walking a horse and I was supposed to open the fence and then at the last minute I got scared and I called someone to come help and my daughter didn't understand and she said what did you do that for? And I went into an EF, sorry sorry sorry I did something wrong. I just feel really stupid about it. And this is my daughter, and she's so stable and better at these things then I am. There I go comparing again, I shouldn't. So I'm crying now. Will crying help? To feel what I'm feeling or just push it away?
I've been reading the School of Life, I really like them. And one of the things was I kept blaming myself for was why did it take me so long to finally see what's going on. And SoL explained that we need to have some measure of security in life and some sense of safety before we can start looking at ourselves for real. So no need to beat myself up for not seeing it for so long. I was in real distress for so long. So I am in a better place now.
And there are days that I am actually feeling very safe and calm. And this is strange too, like I lost my sense of urgency, my edge or my drive. It feels lazy. But I think that's okay.
And another thought I had today, what if I were to 'trust' my brain to send me into dissociation again whenever I would get too scared? So I could try feeling all these feelings without freaking out too much, knowing my brain will save me again if/when it has to? Does that make sense?
So yeah, that was rambling. I wish everyone here well, take care dear friends.
For rambling that was very deep and powerful, DF. I think you're doing great. The answers to your own questions stike me as spot on. Ramble on! :)
It's good to get all these things down sometimes. It didn't feel like rambling when I was reading it.
Sorry to hear about the G pig. I hope he gets better soon. I used to keep them; they are such adorable little creatures.
it makes perfect sense to me, DF, that you can count on your brain to help you. i loved reading that! love and hugs :hug:
Thank you all.
----------------
I just spent the weekend with my old college friends at our holiday home, the six of us. And although I did find it difficult at times, I do think I handled it well.
I told them about my diagnosis, and although they cannot understand completely like people here on the forum, they could relate to some parts and they were really kind and supportive about it.
And I had set some bounderies beforehand that I wanted to keep and I did keep them all! I retreated to my room when I needed to, did my meditations and left the restaurant when I felt overwhelmed there, although that did take me some time and consideration - starting with the thought 'okay I really don't want to be sitting here anymore with all of their stories and the music etc.' and then pushing that away apparently because at some point I began feeling dizzy and I thought 'If I were sitting here with my husband and kids this would be the moment I would say something' and then I did say I wasn't feeling well and one of my friends said do you want to leave and I said yes and she asked do you want to go alone or do you want me to go with you and I said I would like it if she came with me and that was very helpful.
So yes, I am learning to do what is necessary for me to take care of my needs. Even if I don't manage to relax totally (I was sleeping in a room with one of my friends and while sleeping I was aware that I was trying not to bother her with my moving or breathing), that would be asking too much, I am doing better than I used to.
And now I miss my husband and kids so I'll be going home.
And now that I've been home for a few hours, I can feel how anxious I actually was this weekend and how tired I am now. I do feel safe now.
(And I notice I have this opinion about myself that I should be able to feel safe with my best friends from college at our own holiday home, but it turns out I really didn't. It's not that I think they would ever hurt me in any way. But it's this feeling of 'Am I good enough?, Am I doing everything right? Am I not gonna make any mistakes?, Will they think I'm stupid? etc. etc. Even though they tell me I'm so brave taking this on, doing so great, hugging me etc. It's this feeling deep inside me. That's were safety 'should' be. That's what I'm working on.)
HI Desert Flower
It's good to hear how well you held to your boundaries while with your college friends. And great to hear that you enjoyed yourself while balancing your boundaries appropriately.
My experience would have been very similar to yours. When I'm with people I feel tense. I notice it mostly when I get home and suddenly, I relax and all my muscles ache as if I'd just run a marathon. It's exhausting. It's likely much the same experience as yours, where I am on high alert: Watching every facial movement, and every whisper one person does into the ear of another, wondering if they're saying something about how I'm sitting, or what I'm looking at, or how my hair is combed--even when I know they wouldn't do that. Triggers are triggers.
I suppose that's what they call hypervigilance, or at least a version of it. Always on high alert when with friends. It's a conundrum because I love being with friends. I like parties. I like gatherings. But they wear me out. I'm often incredibly worn out afterward, even when I'm the organizer, caterer, and have had a good time with people I trust. It STILL wears me out.
Its really nice that, even though they didn't fully understand your diagnosis the way the forum members do, they still did their best to show you compassion, understanding, and respect. Your friend who asked if you wanted someone to go to the room with...what a nice gesture on her part.
I hope your relaxation at home goes well now.
Thank you Papa Coco. You're so kind. :hug:
Desert Flower, I appreciate what you noticed about safety with your friend. I find safety so confusing and fascinating and helpful to notice. I hope that you find some ease.
always interesting to notice those thoughts that run thru our heads around people who 'should' be safe. i've gone thru that list of questions myself, and it's exhausting. it does feel like hypervigilance. ugh! i'm just glad your friends were supportive. may i just add that you are, indeed, good enough. love and hugs :hug:
Thank you Rainy, I did find some ease actually.
And Thank you too San, I can feel that I am good enough.
:hug:
Hi Desert Flower,
I'm glad you were able to share things with your friends on your weekend away, and that they were supportive. I hope you're doing ok since you got back home - I know you had missed your husband and your children. I wanted to send you a hug, if that's ok :hug:
Hope
:hug:
I think you did really well on the weekend away. I am glad your friends were supportive. As for not feeling safe - I totally get that. I am very reluctant to go away these days, even just with my husband. I was not sure why because we have always enjoyed trips away - or so I thought. Since starting therapy I have started finding some feelings of safety at home and I think that is why I don't like to go away because then I don't feel safe. Before, I never felt truly safe anywhere so going away was not a particular stress.
I think, though, that true safety comes when you know you can trust yourself to keep yourself safe regardless of where you are and who you are with. So it seems to me that your weekend away was a great thing to do. You were able to prove to yourself that you could set and enforce boundaries, and that you could leave the restaurant when you felt bad rather than having to endure it because you thought you "should". Well done. :cheer:
Thank you, all.
And thank you, NarcKiddo, that's an excellent point you made there. This goes for me too.
It's only this past year that I felt a few times what it was like to be truly relaxed and to feel absolutely safe. It's such a strange feeling to me. It feels like I'm really really heavy, really feeling my feet sink into the ground or my body into the chair. And it feels lazy. Like I don't want to do anything. I just wanne be. And also, it's so quiet in my mind then, nothing to worry about. And it's only since this experience, that I know there actually is another state besides being anxious all the time like I was, and this has been the greatest impetus for my renewed journey of recovery. I just never knew it was there. And now I know how 'other' people actually feel. Life could be so much easier.
And knowing this has now brought out the question of how I want to feel. I just never thought I had a choice. I now know that being at home helps me get to this state of relaxation and safety most naturally. So this newly found part of me now just wants to stay at home all the time. Of course I don't, I got too much stuff to do, but still.
And this reminds me of another thing I read from the School of Life. They said that people (kids) become introverts because of the experience of not being able to have their own needs met when they are around other people. They are (were taught to be) too busy taking care of other people's needs. And so, they prefer to be alone. And so this turns out what I have been practicing: being around other people AND getting my needs met (somewhat). :cheer:
And the other day, my therapist said that I had come such a long way already, I have been doing so great, despite the lack of support (to put it mildly) I experienced for such a long time. And this felt like recognition. To have a professional say that I suppose.
And afterwards I thought, how I did this was by being awfully strict with myself. Never allowing myself to feel anything (too dangerous), never allowed to make any mistake, never allowed myself any slack at all. Always being on high alert.
And finally, now, I'm coming to a place where I can actually see the needs that were never met and finally, I'm actually starting to take care of my needs. I knew I needed to before, but I didn't do it. And now I am doing it. :applause:
(My therapist and I did a session with the ladybug-part of me last week). A little kid (5-6 years old) in a ladybug/ carnaval's outfit, terrified of being there, of being at all.
And I was at my mother's the next day, and while I was there, I could actually feel the part struggling and wanting to be heard within. And I heard her and I stayed even so but I was able to make the distinction between the adult me, who had decided to do this (go on this visit) and the kid/part (that really really wanted to get away). And that made it better to handle the situation. Acknowledging my feelings, I suppose.
And here's a big thing that changed in my mind as well.
(I'm a little bit hesitant of writing it here, because I'm still afraid of acting on it and I'm expecting people here to say I should act on it. So just to be up front about it: I might not act upon it. I may not be ready.)
What I thought was this: What if I was not obliged to take my m with us on holidays? What if I just made that up? Where is it written that this is a must? Does everybody with an elderly mother do this? Well, some do. Some don't. And what if it brings so much tension for me to do this? What if I deserve a proper holiday, without this tension? And what if I were to just make up a bunch of excuses for not taking her, because I couldn't possibly say why for real. What if I just said I don't have enough days off from work (although I could buy some) or what if the kids are now at an age that they really need their own rooms so we don't have enough rooms anymore. Or whatever.
What if I just provided her with the bare minimum, just the practical stuff that needs fixing? And I stop trying to save her emotionally. Becuase I can't anyway. And I shouldn't have to. What if I just didn't?
'Cause all I ever got from her (I'm finding this really difficult to write still, big FOG still here) was the bare minimum too wasn't it? I never got any love from her either? Or any help, any encouragement. Nothing.
So that. Just a thought.
Now, those kind of "what if" thoughts are really helpful ones to have, I think. You don't have to act on any "what if" thought but I think it is good that you are reviewing your long-held beliefs. Some may be right and some may be incorrect. Some may once have been right but no longer serve you. Some may once have been a really big deal but now may not be all that important when you really think about it. It's always good to examine them from time to time.
Good for you - both for having the guts to have the thought, and for having the guts to write it here, so you can come back and look at it again if you want to.
:yeahthat:
Absolutely. Every idea begins with a hypothesis... a "whatif".
Wisdom is taking an idea and then letting it evolve in the mind. And I don't believe anyone is going to be so dogmatic as to suggest what you "should" or "shouldn't" do. That's entirely your business, to decide when and how you're ready.
I haven't spoken more than a few words to my mother over the past two years. I'm still mulling so many things over in my mind. And I've prioritized my own healing. And I'm just flat-out angry, so best to keep some distance while I'm still unclear. But that's me and every person and situation is unique.
:hug:
Dessert Flower,
As I'm reading your questions, they all sort of lead to one master question in my mind: "What if I stop doing what I've been doing for M, and change things up a bit to make life fairer for me?"
When you said that all the help you give her doesn't seem to help, so you keep trying, the words that came across my inner movie screen was Dr. Phil's "So how's that workin' for ya?" You've been trying to help someone who doesn't appreciate your help, nor have your efforts changed her for the better at all.
I only know what I've read here about how your relationship with M works. But from what you said, it sounds like you are an amazing, caring child who is lovingly still trying to help her find happiness and nothing you're doing is working, so you're asking if it's okay for you to change things up a bit.
My wife and I took her mom in to live with us when she was recently widowed at age 72. She lived with us in our house for 14 years until she finally passed of old age and from lung problems after a life of smoking and eating poorly. Mom was a good one. She was very happy. She wasn't a lot of work, but as she aged, we found ourselves trapped at home more and more for fear of leaving her alone. This is a case of something we felt compelled to do, and she was very appreciative. MANY TIMES I told my wife that I was happy to be giving her mom this help, but if it were my mom, she'd be put in a home. I would NEVER do for my mother what I did for my MIL. My mom would have driven me insane. Never happy. Afraid of everything. A control freak. Always treating me like I'm too fragile to take care of myself, so how could I take care of her? ...
I guess I'm just thinking that if taking M on trips ruins the trip for you and doesn't help her feel any joy anyway, then why do it? If anyone treats me with contempt, why the h*ll would I want to take them on vacation with me?
I know this is all much easier said than done. I'm only offering a viewpoint for consideration. I'm not a fan of CBT, which is what Dr. Phil is, but "How's that workin' for ya'?" Can be a helpful question to answer once in a while.
My caution is that if you were to leave her behind, you need to be sure you can endure the aftermath. For me, anytime I didn't give someone what they wanted, I spent the next decades regretting, or at least questioning, whether I should have done what I'd done. That's sad. We give up our freedom so as to people-please. But if we stand up for ourselves, we then have to go to therapy to try and recover from having not given our lunch money to the bully. It's kind of a trauma-trap that grips us.
Remember the old saying, Love our neighbors AS ourselves. NOT instead of ourselves. The word "as" implies that we need to love ourselves with the same compassion that we love others with. Again: easier said than done, but with practice, it's doable. When someone doesn't want help, and we help them anyway at the cost of our own happiness, and then they just return to their own sad bitterness afterward anyway, then the only thing we really did was put ourselves into misery for no good reason.
BUT! If we aren't ready to live with our decision to let go of helping someone, we'll trade one misery for another.
I think it's GENIUS that you brought this to the forum asking for thoughts, but admitting you might not be ready to do what you wish you could do. That's stepping into the pool one toe at a time, and I think it's VERY wise what you're doing. You don't have to stop helping your mom, but you ARE allowing yourself to think about whether you could or not.
That right there is the next step that will lead to the next one. You can at least contemplate what it would be like to free yourself from trying to help someone who doesn't respond to help. No harm, no foul. Nobody gets hurt by you at least contemplating it. Allowing yourself the freedom to want to break free from her will lead you to some sort of better place. Whether it helps you let go in the future, or it helps you to adjust to a new win/win way of helping Mom WHILE honoring yourself, then that's a good next step to hope for.
It's been my experience that when I start holding my boundaries and giving myself gifts that don't include the people whom I feel tied to, that I go into a precarious state of anxiety. My Therapist works with me on that. He helps me to put boundaries up. He warns me that it's going to really freak me out. He helps me weather the internal storms of guilt and fear that pound on me after I've put up a boundary and have to bring up the courage to continue holding that boundary. It was horrifyingly painful at first, but with his help, I'm beginning to feel safe saying no to people now. It takes time, and we are wise to not push it too fast. But by putting a toe in one at a time, I was able to survive the first few months of forcing myself to say no to people. So be cautious of that. Saying no to people is really scary at first. It's best done slowly and with the help of people who are on your side.
These are just my opinions. DON'T do anything until you're ready but DO give yourself full permission to think about future options.
I think you're a very awesome person to be so willing to help the m who probably doesn't really deserve it. It says truly wonderful things about what a caring and loving person you are.
It's okay to ponder your questions. I'm honored to be one of the people you bounced these thoughts off of.
Thank you Papa Coco, for taking the time and the consideration to write your kind words. They're very precious to me.
To answer Dr. Phill: It's not working out quite so well, actually.
Thank you for pointing out you would not have considered taking your m in, I won't either. The sooner she goes to a home, the better. But she's too good for that still.
I'm not ready for the guilt and the anxiety of stopping to take care of her completely. But I do hear what you're saying about dippping my toe in, and then maybe taking small steps next. I may not have to visit her every week, maybe I can change that to once every two weeks. Just so I will feel better. Maybe I can go from being the Perfect Daughter (which doesn't actually get me anything anyway) to being a little less perfect daughter, and then being a good daughter, to being a so so daughter. Maybe that's doable. I like it. I'll let that simmer.
The questions you are asking resonate with me and I am trying to stop over performing in some situations. I hope you find a way forward that feels right to you.
Today I feel terrible physically. I wrote some emotional posts these past few days that I'm sure caused this. Just for coherence for myself, I'll put some links here.
https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?topic=16361.0
about finding the old file
and
https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?topic=16362.msg147586#new
about wanting Justice
And now everything in my body is telling me I need to take a break and take it easy. I've been pushing myself too hard and my brain/CNS is afraid I will not be able to handle this. I know I can but I'll need to pace myself and will pause here for a bit and rest now. Called in sick today for work.
Hey DF, ditto, me the same. But in my case I'm praying for rain so that I can stay in bed all day. Good rest to you.
:hug:
I'm going through a rough period. I'm reading 'Life, reinvented' and this sums up exactly every thing I've experienced in this respect. It is bringing me a great deal of relief actually. I'm almost happy about this.
-Triggger Warning-
But in the process another instance of rape/SA has arisen that I had totally dissociated, but that I'm now sure actually happened too. There were many other instances, so my mind really just wants to put this one on the existing pile quickly and be over with it. But I've learned that I will indeed have to look at it for real if I want to make any progress in dealing with my anxiety etc. That's why I'm putting it here now. It's real. I don't like it (to put it mildly), but it is in fact real.
I'm going out to dinner with my husband tonight and the sun is shining but this has now spoiled my day. :fallingbricks:
Desert Flower, I hope you find some rest and ease from the challenging feelings coming up.
Desert Flower
My heart is with yours as you wade through this current EF period. The SA memories come back on me when I least expect them to, and it sounds like that's happening to you right now too. I am glad you are reaching out to the forum for support. Using the friendship of others who know a bit about the same stressors as you, is a good way to mitigate the EFs. We can't seem to stop them, but we can use our friends to help us weather them. I put my EFs into the same category as weather storm fronts. They come over us whenever THEY want to. We can't control their timing nor their strength. Our best chance at surviving them is accepting them as being part of the CPTSD condition, hunkering down in a nice warm house, knowing that these EF storms leave just as quickly as they come.
One of the things I dislike most about having CPTSD is that it keeps coming back on me. I have good weeks and bad weeks. I hate that. I wish I could make the EFs stay away from me altogether. Much of it comes predictably on certain dates or times of the year. Fall, for example, still smells of the trauma and fear that I lived through as a child. School was a terrifying place for me, and this time of year makes my anxiety crash with my depression. I don't know how to explain it, but I can be deeply depressed and wildly anxious at the same exact time. I can be happy and sad at the same time. I can be loving my friends and wanting to be alone at the same time. But certain times of year, I can't seem to climb up out of the trauma-drama.
I'm in the throws of remembering some violent sexual abuse I endured at age 6-8. It is coming back on me like bad food. I didn't go out looking for this EF that I'm falling into right now. IT found ME!
To pull up about 40,000 feet, and look down at the world from a distance, I guess I can more easily see that my unwelcome depression/anxiety/memory flashback EF storms are just part of how to live with CPTSD for the long run. I hate that these EFs come on me without my permission, but I love that I now know they leave just as quickly as they come. So, I don't sit and worry that my happy life is over anymore. I now see that I'm in a temporary emotional storm that all I have to do is shelter myself until it passes. That's a big improvement for me. I used to be like a teenager who believed one bad day meant my life was ruined. As an elder now who has been through so many of these storms that I couldn't count them all if I tried, I now know that the storms come and then they go. And I will feel better when the storm just sort of dissipates and lets me enjoy my life again for a little while.
I guess that while I'm in the EFs, that's the time to work on myself. My therapist is always glad that we have session on days when my EFs are in bloom. He tells me that they are the best sessions because he can work real-time with my unhappy parts. I don't get a lot of benefit from sessions when I go in feeling great. That's like going to the doctor when I'm not sick. What can he do for me if I'm not sick that day?
One of the attributes of human life is that we learn best while we suffer. Again, if we're feeling happy and satisfied, why would we work to improve? Why fix what isn't broken? We fight for our mental and emotional health because we need to improve it. I hate this but it's true: We learn through our suffering, not through our joy. I hate that rule. But I understand it. So when I suffer like I am right now, I reach out for support, and I try to be grateful that the unseen powers of fate and circumstance care enough for me to keep me growing in a learning state.
These EFs happen but we are not helpless in them. We have support through OOTS, therapists, myriad authors, emerging therapies and medications... They say that when we smile the world smiles with us, but when we cry, we cry alone. I don't agree. Here on the forum, when we are under distress, we can reach out and others do respond with love and kindness and emoji hugs.
We don't cry alone here.
Here's a hug to help you get through today's EF struggle. :hug:
PC
Thank you Rainy and Papa Coco.
I really do feel surrounded by friends here and that helps.
I am in a crappy state still.
I am consiously turning myself to some niceties of life.
Dinner with my husband turned out to be really nice. We watched a great sunset over our city from the lake and enjoyed that together. At the restaurant, we were seated nicely in the corner, and I was facing the entrance so that helped. Although we were seated in between a young girl with her grandpa apparently, grandpa was a little deaf so she was speaking loudly and she was talking about her patients in the psychiatric hospital ???
And on the other side was a bully/criminal with his family it seemed, of whom the mother/grandma had some body language that did not look good to me. :stars:
So the next day, I decided to come along to my nieces' birthday party, which turned out quite nice too. Although I had to withstand my sister-in-law again, as soon as I said something about how I felt, she started off on the menopause again and I had to tell her quite firmly (I did) that that really wasn't my biggest problem right now. And she backed off. And I went to sit down when I felt I needed to because my back was still acting up. And after that I did have some nice conversations with some people I had not met before and I was distracted from my troubles for a while.
And today I decided that we as a family are gonna go see some kids' movie and I'm looking forward to that.
In the mean time, like I said, my body is acting up like it hasn't in quite a while. I'm really not feeling so good.
I should have been taking it easy with all this processing, like I said a few days ago, but I haven't at all. So my brain is still scared I'll hurt myself and it is bringing in all the physical stuff.
Finding the file, wanting justice and reading 'Life, Reinvented' really has been a lot for me to process. Reading 'Life, Reinvented' was monumental for me, I should really say. I've not gotten close to the abuse like that in a very long time. I've really not gotten to terms with that at all, although I may act knowledgeable around this stuff here and tough, I'm not at all really.
And what you wrote Papa Coco about these EF's returning when they will, is very valuable. I think I had been trying to just work through all of it at once now, and be over with it once and for all. And that's not how this is gonna work. It's a Process and it will continue to be a Process and it will not ever be over probably. And I'm finding that really hard to accept actually. I would just like this to be over with so much.
There's three big parts to my Trauma: the Neglectful m, the Abuse and Losing my dad suddenly and without him ever being spoken about again. So I've got two really good books about the first two parts now, and I already ordered a book about the third part now. Reading books is also how I process things. But I really need to be taking it easier and just feel for a while even though I don't want to.
Gently, slowly, just sit with it. Just sit with what is and not try to run from it (like I used to) or push through it like I have been doing. Stay here with it for a while. :fallingbricks:
I hope you feel able to do what you need to get through this current tough spot.
:grouphug:
Efs all around... tis the season apparently. But the advice and ideas are solid. Holding in line with you and all your work and suggestions. Doing my best to do the same. Love and hugs.
:grouphug:
:grouphug:
Thinking of you as I think I just put myself into an EF without meaning to. I hope that you find some ease.
I found some new Parts. For future reference for myself:
https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?topic=16377.msg147747#new
Hi Desert Flower. I'm sorry I have not been in any of the "newer" recovery journals. I just wanted to comment here so I'll be able to follow yours more easily with notifications.
I'm sorry it's been real difficult lately. Do take it easy, please. It is very possible to over do it as you know and then we go backward instead of forward. You know this but I'm repeating it as a friend and someone who has been there too. We need to see and feel these things but we can only take so much at a time before it backfires.
Thank you Armee. You're right, I feel that I should be taking it slower, I will try to slow down.
Doing okay today. Went to work and my reserved desk is so helpful. Keeping it together and that'll suffice for now.
glad you're doing ok at the moment, DF. i hope you get a few days of respite, at least. love and hugs :hug:
Desert Flower, I am just stopping by to say I am thinking of you.
Thank you dear friends. I am okay and taking it easy.
:grouphug:
So glad to hear this. It is difficult stuff. :grouphug:
:grouphug:
:grouphug:
I've not been writing much these past few days. Last Tuesday, I started to feel better after I went to the office, managed to be there and do some work and then in the evening did the very gentle yoga because the back pain was still lingering a bit. I don't usually 'allow' myself to do anything gentle, I usually do the most energetic yoga there is, just to wear myself out and then be able to relax a little bit. But it felt good to be gentle with myself.
And last Thursday, I told my t about the really hard stuff I'd been processing and we did EMDR with some of that and that really calmed me down.
I now feel kind of strange actually, because I've been calm ever since. Is this how regular people feel then? Almost boring ... Almost waiting for the next shoe/bomb/EF to drop.
I ordered some books about Dads and Father Loss because I now want to know the specifics of that.
Yesterday, my brother stopped by for dinner and he didn't ask about my therapy and I found that a little difficult, because he does know about it. Maybe he's afraid to ask. (I do know he's suffering too.)
And today we went swimming with the kids. I usually don't go because it's too much for me, all that noise and so many nearly naked people and my body being visible to all, all of it is so triggering. But I did okay, I accepted this is how it is mostly and the kids really liked it. (I read something about the Thalamus of traumatised people letting in much more information coming from the senses, just to be sure nothing dangerous is missed and this knowledge has made it easier for me to accept that for me, it really is difficult to be in such a situation with so many stimuli. So okay.)
Hey DF, me too I've always hated the pool. And for pretty much the exact same reasons you mentioned. Thanks for the thalamus info, I didn't know that. And me too I've done the pool but only for the kids sake...
I'm feeling better too and have been having similar thoughts about "when's the next EF?" As I now know full well I'm still far from being out of the woods.
The only thing that gives me hope is that through the cycle of EFs since a year ago, they have reduced in intensity each time they've sprung back up. It still sucks bigtime, and it's still horribly painful, but they're nonetheless slightly less intense each time back through. I see the downtime as pure vacation.
I'm glad you're feeling better too Chart. :hug:
Somebody pinch me, I feel normal!
:stars:
:bigwink:
:Idunno:
:whistling:
Just a little note to myself today because this is my (deceased) father's birthday. It's strange because most of my life I didn't have a father, since I was eight. And I do not remember much at all about him. I remember he used to take me on little rides on his scooter/motor bike and we would wear these ridiculous helmets, I remember those very clearly. And I remember being on some vacation and a tent at the campsite (not ours) was on fire and I stood beside him watching the fire. I don't remember being scared, more like fascinated. And I remember another vacation when we were swimming in a river with big round boulders on the ground and ice cold water and him saying: come on, you can do it. And I remember leaving church one time and me as a kid taking an adults' hand and walking out the church until the sudden realisation that I'd made a mistake, this wasn't my fathers hand. And I remember going shopping for new bedding with both my parents and me being afraid to say which kind of bedding I actually wanted and ending up with something I didn't really want. And him working at the printing factory. That's about it as far as memories of my dad go.
When I was a teenager, a lousy period of my life being abused and all, I was really good at English at school and when I graduated, I was awarded a prize for being the best at English. And the English teacher gave me book that was titled 'Dad'. That was awkward, I'm sure the teacher didn't know I didn't have a dad, he liked me actually (in a good way) and he wouldn't do this on purpose I think. So I never read the book and I threw it out at some point. But now I thought I'd like to read the book after all and I ordered it and it arrived today, on my dad's birthday, I like the synchronicity of that.
That sounds like a pleasant miscellany of memories of your father. And how nice the book arrived on his birthday. I'm glad you were able to find a copy and order it - especially since you got the original as a prize. Well done, you.
I'm sorry for the loss of your father, both the initial and final loss. I think it's really cool that you remembered that book from your teacher and have ordered it to see what they were trying to share with you now. I'll be curious to hear what the book is about, as another fatherless survivor.
I appreciate you sharing the memories here.
:hug:
i like the synchronicity of that book coming on his birthday as well, DF. like you made the right choice for yourself. i like it when things happen like that. love and hugs :hug:
I've got some more writing to do, some things have been on my mind. 'Everyday' things?
The setting is I'm away by myself for the weekend. This is a strange experience. It's not often I'm totally alone. Since I've gotten more aware of my needs some years ago, I've felt that I just need to be alone sometimes. The constant availability for the kids and organising everything in the home strains me sometimes and then I'm ready to snap. And I don't want to be so stressed all the time. So the thing is, being alone means no demands being made.
The idea is I should be able to relax now. And it's a very nice holiday home we've got that I can now go to (it's fairly new that we have this). But the funny thing is, lately, I've already been taking care of my needs better, and I don't feel totally strained all the time at home, there are times at home that I can relax too and now, being alone at the holiday home, I feel my feelings and hear my thoughts almost constantly. A constant stream of consciousness. (And a few weeks ago, with the big EF, I wouldn't have wanted to be alone at all.)
I'm okay though, it's a gentle way of getting more and more in touch with my feelings and thoughts. It's been good being here too. I did get to go over the things I'd read again, to consolidate the understanding and recognition of what has been going on with me all these years. That's good and calming and reassuring.
And having no stimuli is nice too. And I took a long walk by the sea yesterday, and the weather was perfect so that was really nice.
And it's very good to notice, the tension and anxiety come from within (mostly?). So here's what I've been anxious about. When I arrived I saw two men having a chat across our house. Possible residents, I don't know them. And they saw me arrive on my own. So they know there's a woman alone in here. No need to say more here. Keeping all the doors locked all the time.
Second, I eat snacks for comfort. And yesterday I'd decided to get some of my favourite snacks down the village. Regular people would not find it a big deal at all. But I've been anxious about it all day yesterday. Because it involves me driving to the village and parking my car there. I've got this very specific fear of driving. It's not so much the driving at all, I actually like the machinery and the speed and all that. And I'm good at anticipating traffic actually ha ha. But I didn't know this village yet, the other times my h had been driving there, and I wasn't sure I'd be able to find a parking space so I had been going over Google maps and street view endlessly. The thing about doing the actual parking is that I may be in people's way. They may have to wait for a bit. Which is totally fine of course, when you look at it from a regular person's perspective. But me, I just never want anyone to be the least bit hassled by me. It's a really big deal for me to not bother anyone. And I know this. And I still went and everything went smoothly, it always does. I know this too. And still, I can be so anxious about these things. I really feel silly about it, in the real world I wouldn't tell anybody, but here I think I can share it.
Third, there's always m in the back of my mind. It's annoying the * out of me. And interesting too in a way. I had planned to visit her last Friday, before going off for the weekend. But I had quite a bit of a cold and I didn't want to infect her, her being 82 and fragile. So I thought, maybe when I would feel better on Sunday, I could still go and visit her. This is duty calling, it's not for me, I don't like going. And she always sees problems arising everywhere. So this time she said there's some event in town and I may not be able to get into town. And any of these problems that arise in her head are never any actual problem (see a pattern here?, ugh!) And she's passively asking for help all the time, but not being too obvious about it. So she said there's 'no need' for me to come. I wrote this before, this phrase just drives me crazy. 'There's no need' means don't bother on my account in this case. Just leave me be, being lonely. And I'm supposed to say: no mom I really wanna come, it's no hassle at all, I enjoy coming too (I don't) etc. etc. And then go anyway. Cause she does really want me to come. And I'm just so sick of these dynamics. And I thought: okay mom, if you keep communicating like this, this is what you get. I won't press on. I really don't want to anyway. And I said: okay better then that I don't come. There.
And now I'm tired because of not sleeping so well on my own, feeling not quite safe like I said. I'm okay though. And it's been interesting.
:grouphug:
And another thing that's bugging me. In this conversation I had with my m, she also said (something like, hard to translate) I don't want you to be stressing. And this just really struck me. For multiple reasons. First, she's the reason I'm stressing all the time in the first place!!! Her upbringing and neglect and never comforting me. And second, it implies it's my fault. And it's NOT. Just really needed to stress that here. [swear words] :pissed:
Hey Desert Flower,
Your commentary on being alone and how that feels makes a lot of sense. The good and the bad, the ability to process things without distractions, but then also... having so many things to think about because there's nobody there to distract you.
Quote from: Desert Flower on October 27, 2024, 08:18:15 AMNo need to say more here. Keeping all the doors locked all the time.
I hate to be the sharer of potential paranoia but don't forget to lock your windows too. :)
Quote from: Desert Flower on October 27, 2024, 08:18:15 AMand I wasn't sure I'd be able to find a parking space so I had been going over Google maps and street view endlessly.
I thought it was just me who did this, hah. New or unfamiliar locations are quite anxiety-inducing, indeed. But going over the planning of it all can be so comforting, knowing exactly where you'll park, where you'll walk, what the building entrance looks like - it all becomes... expected; becomes safer.
Quote from: Desert Flower on October 27, 2024, 08:18:15 AMAnd she always sees problems arising everywhere. So this time she said there's some event in town and I may not be able to get into town. And any of these problems that arise in her head are never any actual problem (see a pattern here?, ugh!)
My M is a bit like this too. It is very frustrating to deal with. Like yeah, sometimes you just wish they'd communicate what they want more clearly, rather than dancing around it or giving confusing mixed messages.
I haven't read any older entries but I hope you've been well the past few months.
Regards,
Aphotic.
Thank you Aphotic.
Quote from: Desert Flower on October 27, 2024, 10:11:56 AMQuote from: AphoticAtramentous on October 27, 2024, 09:16:56 AMI hate to be the sharer of potential paranoia but don't forget to lock your windows too.
;)
Yes. Definitely. They are locked.
Quote from: Armee on October 22, 2024, 04:17:51 PMI'll be curious to hear what the book is about, as another fatherless survivor.
It's interesting what you said about not having a father either. I read on a (non English) website for grown ups who lost a parent as a kid, that children who lose a parent end up in abusive situations more often than others.
- Trigger warning -
So. This book. Yes, it's about a Dad. That's expected. But it's also about a very narc mom, traumatised and all. And there's a scene in there with a two year old and it's not pretty. (So think twice before reading it, I'd say. I'm serious.)
That triggered me enough to want to go home immediately, so that's what I did. Home now with h and kids and very happy to be. Being alone had made me anxious for long enough. So being alone doesn't necessarily help, it turns out. You bring yourself with you, they say, and now I experienced it. That was educational.
And now part of me wants to I apologise to my h and kids for being away and not even having had a good time at that, because I am the way I am. But I also know it is an accomplishment, being the way I am.
And the sea was so still when I was there, amazingly calm. My daughter says it was too still. She's a wise girl. And when I got home, my darling son had made me a plate with a raspberry from our garden and apple slices and flower decorations, waiting for me. Ever so sweet of him, it warms my heart.
I have this thing while driving, if someone's behind me I feel guilty and responsible that I'm going too slow and "inconveniencing" them. But then sometimes this transforms to anger, especially if they get dangerously close (which is most of the time in France) and then I actually slow down just to annoy them in return.
I'm pretty confident BOTH reactions are unhealthy :)
But it's like you mentioned about "consciousness". That's what counts, becoming aware of all these little thoughts and reactions...
Nonetheless sounds like a nice "self"holiday by the sea. And coming home to the pure love of two small children just fills me with warmth. There's nothing more beautiful... almost makes the sad absence worth it all.
:hug:
Also too, I could give buckets of co-dependent advice about you're mom... but I imagine you know all that already... logic vs emotions, etc.
So I'll just send good, strong self-actualizing positive energy. I'm feeling your doing good work around all that, certainly very aware and breaking it down in a good way. Keep on keeping on.
:cheer:
hey, DF, that passive-aggressive stuff is soooo frustrating! very sorry you have to deal w/ that w/ your M.
i think you've given me an insight into my anxieties about driving that i've been having of late - not quite knowing or being familiar w/ a place, not wanting to get in someone else's way. that rings true for me right now as well, so thank you for writing about it. it helps a lot.
i would feel a little skittish in that situation myself. glad you're taking precautions. love and hugs :hug:
Oh my gosh! I'm shocked your teacher had given you that book! Well i guess he had some insight into what was really going on to some degree. Thanks for the warning about the book. Now I am a bit curious as well but I do tend to be rather self punishing with triggering material.
Interesting comment you made about children who lost a parent and the propensity for future harm. I think if my father had been around my future would have been even worse (addict, violent, criminal, prison). But the intergenerational trauma it just sets us up for a rough go.
I so much understand what you mean when you wrote (paraphrasing) that you felt guilty for taking time alone but ended up triggered and not "using the time right." Oh I would have the same thoughts. But this is equally valid for time away, needing to process things in a space where you are not also managing everything of day to day life for a family. Processing is also important toward the end goal of being more healed for yourself and family. But I totally get it. :grouphug:
Quote from: Armee on October 28, 2024, 01:49:09 PMI think if my father had been around my future would have been even worse (addict, violent, criminal, prison)
Well, that's hard either way Armee. I'm sorry for that.
-----------
And thank you all for the kind and supportive comments. I really appreciate it. I'm so glad we're here together.
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I've been feeling a bit wobbly, wanting to cry but not quite getting round to it. But okay enough mostly.
The book turned out to be quite the page turner. And it is just remarkable. The main character is also aged 52, like me. And it is almost like the teacher that gave me the book back then did have a feeling about what was going on in my life, although I don't see how he could possibly have. Because the book turned out to be about the kind of troubles all of us here had and why we ended up here. And about taking care of these parents somehow anyway now they're old. I really do think there is a reason why I read it now.
And I had been having trouble with myself going to work in my 'new' state, that is with the vulnerable and feeling 'me' (a 'me' with feelings that is). I had somehow gotten this idea that I should now be feeling everything all the time. And that was too much to handle obviously. And this week, I made acquaintance with a new colleague and I felt bad about it, because the 'old'/detached/not feeling anything/professional/fun-me took over completely. And after our meeting, walking through the corridors, I distinctly felt the new/feeling-me return.
And I had another very helpful session with my therapist yesterday. And after that, yesterday evening, something my T had said made me realise that this detached part actually also needs be allowed to be here. It turns out that since I have allowed my vulnerable me to emerge (a few months ago?), I didn't want the detached me to return anymore, but yesterday I realised it's okay that she's here too, that she comes out many times still, it's a very old pattern AND it has kept me alive, she totally saved me! I would not still be around if it weren't for my detached me. So I feel better when I accept her as well and allow her to be here too.
And I've been feeling bad about myself because I have a very good and dear friend who has also been taking care of her difficult mother for many years (a lot longer than I have) and she just seems to have this endless love to give to her mother still. And I know this friend is actually traumatised by her mother too and other things that happened, and I don't know how she can keep it up. I just don't have it in me to even put an arm around my mother, even though she is so fragile and needy. I just don't know how to do it. And I hate that she's so needy, the way she is needy. And I feel so bad about it.
Because she IS most of the reason I can't do it. And everyday she texts me 'good morning' and 'good night', we arranged this so we know she is all right, she's living alone and this is so we know she didn't fall or hurt herself or whatever. We arranged this because her neighbor had suggested it actually. And I think she likes it actually. It's like she's got two opportunities every day to let me know how lonely she is. Just the passive aggressive way she likes it. And that puts me back in the situation when we were young and we had to make it better for her - twice every day. And when I don't visit her every week, she says just to call her sometimes and I just can't get myself to do it. I just feel this huge resistance. I just don't
want to. And I feel really bad about that.
Maybe when I'll start feeling better about myself, I will have more to give? To her? I don't know.
Well anyway, after yesterday's insight on the detached part being allowed to be around, I did feel a lot better today, also at work.
So what I'm learning is, it is so important to allow ALL my parts to be here.
And I'm really tired too today. I've really been working hard on all of this stuff. I think I still just wanna get through it all and have it over with. Which won't work.
Long post. Sorry about that.
And I said to my T I would have wanted to have made some 'progress' by now (I'm also feeling pressed for time, since I only got coverage for so many sessions), that is feeling better instead of just all this feeling. And she reassured me we are making progress, but we are still in the middle of unraveling it all. I guess I want too much too soon. I really have a hard time accepting what it is. It'll be a lifelong journey won't it. :'(
I resonate with you on being able to recognize progress and this feeling like a lifelong journey. I don't have anything to offer but wanted to say you aren't alone in this.
I'm sorry. I really feel what you are going through. It sounds so similar to what I went through with caregivng for my very difficult passive aggressive needy push-pull attention seeking mom too. It very nearly killed me. Please know that what you are doing is so hard. Caregiving even when it is for "easy" parents is so difficult. But add on the trauma and personality disorders of the parents it is nearly deadly. No joke.
Really interesting about the book and the timing. I think now if we saw a kid with parents like ours, we'd recognize it immediately too. It was probably way obvious to your teacher. I'm curious the author of the book?
Thank you Rainy and Armee.
Quote from: Armee on November 01, 2024, 03:09:36 AMthe author of the book?
is William Wharton and it's titled 'Dad'.
:grouphug:
Quote from: Chart on October 28, 2024, 10:21:17 AMAlso too, I could give buckets of co-dependent advice about you're mom... but I imagine you know all that already... logic vs emotions, etc.
I'm not so sure Chart. I've not studied this very much so far. So feel free to share any advice you have on this. ???
Your long post on 31 Oct really resonates with me Desert Flower. Especially the parts about simply not having it in you to care for you mother in the way you perceive your friend caring for hers. I would suggest you try not to compare yourself to your friend. Even though you have known her for a long time you cannot know every facet of why and how she treats her mother like she does. Or how she presents that situation to others. Maybe you are the more honest one, to yourself, admitting what your limitations are and trying to work within them. Your statement that you don't have it in you to put an arm round your mother resonates hugely. I feel that, too. It is really hard to navigate. You say that when you feel better about yourself you may have more to give. Maybe, but it seems to me that maybe you have given enough already. If she has emptied the well and is now doing nothing to help it refill - I don't really know how to finish the sentence but it's not my sentence to finish. I'll leave it there in case it's helpful.
It really does sound as though you have made progress, though. And your T sounds good and helpful. Given you feel pressed for time and have limited coverage I wonder whether you might consider concentrating particularly on building strong foundations with the support of your T. I think you are right that this is a lifelong project, although it should get easier as you get more adept at handling things. Which is happening, as far as I can see. I mean, look at your recent recognition of the detached part. But maybe focusing less on the progress and more on the foundations while you have your T to assist will give you more "oomph" during times you may not have the support of T. I guess that may be something to discuss with your T if you think it might be helpful. And please ignore if not.
I agree with Armee it's really interesting how you have come to read that book right now and what you are finding. I may check it out, too.
hey, DF,
along w/ the warmth of everyone else here, one thought came to mind as i read your stuff. maybe, when you feel better about yourself, you'll have more to give to you, more awareness of what's ok or not ok for you (regardless of how anyone else deals w/ a situation similar to yours), more acceptance of how you want to caretake or not, etc.
it sounds to me like you're making good progress - the idea of allowing the distant you to continue to be is a lot, to my mind. acceptance of ourselves, as we are, is huge, no matter what form that takes. love and hugs :hug:
Thank you NarcKiddo and San for your thoughtful comments.
What strikes me most is I realise now that when I'm writing these things initially, part of me still thinks I'm 'overreacting', making a big deal out of nothing, seeking 'too much' attention. And then when I see your comments, I see that I'm not. It really is 'something'. I need the validation so much. So thank you.
I'm still surprised sometimes by the recognition I get here. Also from my T. And from the stuff I read.
And from the company social worker a while ago. She actually gave me quite a nudge to really get onto this path. She had worked with PTSS before and she told me what I had been feeling all these years, this continuous stress, was in fact not normal, although it was feeling normal to me. And she was quite alarmed by the things I told her. And how some people never get over this kind of stuff. And that helped me see.
I've also been reading about some people who recently got diagnosed as well (with different stuff but that's irrelevant here) and how life and their feelings over all these years now finally made sense to them. I just cannot seem to get over it.
Sometimes I'm still getting used to 'the way things are', with this diagnosis and all. How it just explains everything. I just keep sighing with relief all day long these days. Almost makes me wanna cry.
How I coped all these years, I almost don't know.
Here I am.
:heythere:
Quote from: Armee on November 01, 2024, 03:09:36 AMabout the book
and
Quote from: NarcKiddo on November 01, 2024, 01:25:32 PMI may check it out, too.
I just wanted to add it contains some words we would not want to use anymore nowadays.
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Quote from: sanmagic7 on November 01, 2024, 01:42:46 PMwhen you feel better about yourself, you'll have more to give to you, more awareness of what's ok or not ok for you (regardless of how anyone else deals w/ a situation similar to yours), more acceptance of how you want to caretake or not, etc.
Yes, that's where it starts. I still find it really hard chosing me first.
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Quote from: NarcKiddo on November 01, 2024, 01:25:32 PMIf she has emptied the well and is now doing nothing to help it refill -
In my (sparse) angry moments, I would say: 'well, forget it then.' But most days, I still feel obliged to help her. The biggest problem is she is old now. I feel I'm too late to let her be on her own. If it had been twenty years ago, she could have found some other people to make her feel less alone, but now I feel I cannot expect her to anymore.
Quote from: NarcKiddo on November 01, 2024, 01:25:32 PMfocusing [less on the progress] and more on the foundations
That sounds reasonable indeed. But how would this be done in practice? I think actually we are mainly focussing on the foundations. The therapist will ask me what has been troubling me the most the past few weeks and then we look into whatever trauma is underneath those troubles. Then, we are working through some of the most traumatic events, rescripting them or doing EMDR, which makes them a little less likely to trigger me as much now. These sessions do make me a lot calmer.
DF, yep, i know the feeling of near tears still when something nice/kind is said to me or done for me. i'm not sure what they represent - an overflow of gratitude? or grieving all the time we didn't get that from others? or something else? at any rate, i don't think they're a bad thing, but an acknowledgment of something for your life.
i'm glad your T sessions help make you feel calmer. to me, that shows progress. keep going!
as far as obligation to your M, would you regret not helping her out if it meant you were helping yourself out? and, yeah, choosing self over others is a tough one, for sure. love and hugs :hug:
Quote from: Desert Flower on November 01, 2024, 10:46:08 AMQuote from: Chart on October 28, 2024, 10:21:17 AMAlso too, I could give buckets of co-dependent advice about you're mom... but I imagine you know all that already... logic vs emotions, etc.
I'm not so sure Chart. I've not studied this very much so far. So feel free to share any advice you have on this. ???
Error number one: Don't give me permission to give my advice! I'll probably leap at the chance!!!
:))
I'm actually taking my "studies" of narcissists (the principal "creators" of co-dependent behavior) to some interesting places (for me). Here's part of some of the stuff that I'm thinking about:
https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?msg=148304
I'm not a motivational speaker at all but sending you some inspiration if I can because I read you need it Chart.
:umbrella:
I hope you're reading this.
So, well, I was away for a while. Not a conscious choice but just being really busy, it's always like this, this time of year. For the most part, I've been doing quite well though. Long post, apologies.
Some important stuff that happened:
My husband's 50th birthday party
My husband celebrated his 50th birthday with a big party at our place. I knew this was gonna be immensely triggering (I'm not good enough, I don't fit it in, they don't want me etc. etc.) and it was. But I'm really proud of myself the way I dealt with it. I felt when it triggered. The thing is, he has these friends he's known practically all his life. I'm the last one to have joined, 15 years ago. But I still feel like 'the new girl'. And his friends did this quiz titled; "Who knows [...] best?" And they had all these questions about times long past that I didn't know the answer to. So I felt that, and I felt my reaction (fawning - "Oh, this is so much fun!") and thinking okay, I'll hang in there. And I didn't blame myself for my (inner) reactions. That was fair enough.
And I spoke about my diagnosis with many people at the party and it turned out many of them said they were having issues too and they applauded me for taking it on.
And there's this sister-in-law who's quite self-absorbed and her youngest was hanging out with my daughter and when my daughter really needed to get to bed, I was able to tell the in-law she really had to take her kid away.
And I myself went to bed when I'd really had enough even though the party was still going on.
And I'm glad my h had a good time, and I didn't bother him with my troubles that day.
Compensation for attachment disorders
I heard a podcast about attachment disorders. And I just wanted to share what they said can compensate for them:
- being in a safe relationship
- having kids yourself
- a god (a different one than your parents)
- society (participating)
- (schema-)therapy
Visiting my mother
I used to think I had to visit my mother every week. I wrote about it here. But recently she said: Oh, but you really don't need to (passive aggressiveness) and I thought: Okay, so I won't anymore. So I changed it to once every two weeks. She thinks it's because I'm busy, but I know it's because she's so triggering to me.
The other day, it was enough for her just to say 'How are you?' to send me into an EF lasting two days. Because her tone (to me) implies I cannot possibly be well, I'm probably struggling again/still, because there's something wrong with me. Even though, I was actually doing fine at that moment, but I couldn't even say that out loud to her because I was down the rabbit hole already. And everything is always hopeless and heavy with her, I just don't know what to say.
And I talked about this with my T and I started practicing 'being okay, I am okay - even though my mother is not'. My T and I looked into what exactly is triggered here. It's a scene from way back, sitting at the dinner table after my dad past away (something that was never talked about) and my M is laying the table for four, instead of the three we are now, and that was soooo uncomfortable and awkward a situation to be in, we kids just froze and had no idea what to do. We felt we had to make her feel better, but we couldn't. And my T and I rescripted this situation and sent the kids to leave the dinner table and go play and I practiced acknowledging 'this is indeed uncomfortable'. As it still is, sitting at her dinner table these days with her being alone again, now that her second husband died.
But the next time I went to see her, I was actually able to sit there and acknowledge (silently, to myself) this was indeed awkward and that felt slightly better, at least I felt there's nothing wrong with me for feeling this. And I managed to get through it without an EF. Yay.
Being rejected
And my T and I also rescripted a scene of being rejected by my abuser, and that has made me feel less alone there.
My hearing/Tinnitus
And I got my ears/hearing tested. This was important to me. Because up until three years ago, I used to have all sorts of physical complaints that had no apparent cause. And when I started acknowledging my feelings/emotions, all these physical symptoms evaporated. Except for the Tinnitus. So I still had these doubts that something was wrong with my ears/hearing. And it turns there's nothing wrong, my ears/hearing are absolutely fine. So from now on I'm gonna treat this as entirely psycho-somatic.
Some things that didn't help either
And I thought of some things from the past that didn't help either with feeling 'not good enough'. I used to be a gymnast as a kid/teenager. And I was in the top team actually. But I was really scared at that and I had no self esteem or courage for it. And at competitions, I would always be a bench-warmer, I was never good enough to be in the competition.
And also, within our family, our cousins would always hang out together a lot and my brother and I were never a part of that.
Business trip
And this week, I had to go on a business trip by train and there were pickpockets around and the train had a fire smell and then didn't go any further because of a defect with the brakes and I was really anxious about it and I dissociated during a good part of it but I didn't blame myself for doing so.
A picture of me for my mom
And I had my picture taken at work and they photoshopped it to make it look 'better' (I suppose). And I didn't think it looked quite like me anymore. They did something to make me look more tanned than I am and they removed the dark parts under my eyes. These parts show my troubles I think.
But my mom liked the photo a lot and she wanted it printed and framed and that feels confusing. Apparently, she wants a picture of me looking happy. She wants me to be happy. But part of me wishes she would like a picture of me not looking perfect, looking the way I am, showing the way I feel. It's too much to wish for I suppose.
Desert Flower, I read your updates. I resonate with mom stuff. My mom always wants me to be happy too. I hate her saying that to me. I hope you are hanging in there.
That's a lot to read Rainy, thank you. I am definitely hanging in. :yes:
I do feel I need to clarify the situation with my mom and me being happy or not. Because in a reply to Papa Coco's journal I wrote:
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 12, 2024, 07:04:22 PMAnd to me what you wrote about your mother not wanting you to be happy and not wanting you to be unhappy either, and her making it all about her, resonates very strongly. Where would that leave us and our feelings, I'm wondering. I'll think about that.
So that may seem to be contradictory to what I wrote here. It's a little more complicated/nuanced I think.
I think my mom wants me to LOOK happy so she can feel like she did all right raising us and she can show other people how well I'm doing. But she doesn't really seem to want me to BE happy, because she's convinced (she's dystymic) every happy thing in life will always be taken away from us so better not get your hopes up. And at the same time, she would not want me to be visibly miserable because that would show SHE did not do a good job raising us.
So the solution here is to just feel what I'm really feeling without caring what she might think about any of that. It's like what Blueberry pointed out somewhere else on the forum:
Quote from: Blueberry on December 12, 2024, 12:58:33 AMAnd I try to employ Medium Chill and Grey Rock https://outofthefog.website/what-to-do-2/2015/12/3/medium-chill (https://outofthefog.website/what-to-do-2/2015/12/3/medium-chill)
Thank you big time Blueberry! That made me read about 'Medium Chill' and that was very helpful. To disengage from my mother mentally while engaging with her. That might actually be a very good strategy for me.
And actually, I do have truly happy moments and they occur when I can just BE, just feel what I need to feel in that moment and not care the least bit about what anybody thinks about it, especially my mom.
I'm okay, even if/when she's not.
Just as a reminder to myself.
And something Mathilde wrote also feels important to me. It made me realise (again) that dissociation is designed to keep us safe, it's not 'wrong'. Whereas sometimes I only feel I shouldn't be doing it anymore, that it should go away. So here's a reminder to myself to allow my detached part to be here when it needs to.
Wow you are really doing well managing the different triggers and EFs!!!
:cheer:
Regarding the photo...an artist would definitely prefer the more interesting looking version of your photo. Lived in. Real. Authentic.
Re tinnitus...For what it is worth...1. The same thing happened to me with having lots of physical symptoms that I had thought were medical problems that all dissipated after getting into therapy finally. I think that is fairly common for trauma; And 2. The tinnitus happens for me as an anxiety/ dissociative thing. The trigger can be barely perceptible, but once I notice that feeling I can usually trace back to the trigger. It can be as tiny as reading a single word in an otherwise nontriggering news article that sets my brain buzzing and my ears ringing.
It was my first clear sign I caught onto that I was dissociating, when I felt like my head was in a vacuum cleaner or like I was standing in the middle of a 5 lane freeway. I even said it to my therapist in the early days of therapy before I knew about trauma and dissociation. He must have asked something about childhood and everything got super loud and I asked him why does it feel like there's a 5 lane freeway between us? He said "you mean you feel like your distanced from me?" "No. It is literally as loud as a 5 lane freeway in here right now."
It's good this is happening because it can help you identify triggers and get grounded, if indeed this is the same thing for you.
Thank you so much, Armee, appreciate it. That's a fascinating angle, this connection between the Tinnitus and Dissociation. Since I'm looking into this dissociation-thing already, I'll definitely take this into account.
wow, DF, so many realizations, connections, awarenesses! that's a lot to be going on with. very glad you were able to go to sleep when you needed to, stood up for yourself, took care of yourself. i think that's a biggie. i remember doing something similar and an ex-H really coming down on me for it, so it seems very brave to me that you were able to do that.
keep going! love and hugs :hug:
Thank you San!
Just a few notes. There's some awareness around the dissociation too. Strange realisation I must say. Some instances:
- Just now, for just one second, I did not recognise my own house. It looked so strange to me.
- And earlier today, I was riding my bycicle and for a minute, I couldn't remember where I was going. It was just me cycling and the rest was gone.
(And some weeks ago, I felt myself dissociate as I drove into my mother's street for a visit. And I remember looking at myself like I was one of the neighbours: "Here comes the daughter for a visit." - I used to be like this a LOT as a kid. Seeing myself walking down the street.)
My brain is so trying to protect me.
i agree, DF. protection at its finest. it's a strange sensation, tho, to look at yourself and not recognize you. been there. love and hugs :hug:
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 13, 2024, 08:05:47 AMI'm not a motivational speaker at all but sending you some inspiration if I can because I read you need it Chart.
:umbrella:
I hope you're reading this.
Thanks DF! I've been away from the Forum for awhile, but I am reading this! :)
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 16, 2024, 06:37:19 PM- Just now, for just one second, I did not recognise my own house. It looked so strange to me.
I just had a thought... are you sure this is dissociation? Maybe internal changes are happening such that your house is the same, but you are subtly changing, thus familiar things are not quite so familiar anymore... just something that popped in my head when I read this.
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 16, 2024, 06:37:19 PM(And some weeks ago, I felt myself dissociate as I drove into my mother's street for a visit. And I remember looking at myself like I was one of the neighbours: "Here comes the daughter for a visit." - I used to be like this a LOT as a kid. Seeing myself walking down the street.)
I have a thing where I see myself through the eyes of others ALL THE TIME. I'm incessantly imagining how I appear and what others might be thinking about me. Maybe not exactly the same but this made me think...
Thanks for sharing DF! :hug:
I'm so scared right now. I got myself into a very stressful situation. I can't write any specifics because I'm too scared the person I'm scared of will read this (this is totally unrealistic, but I cannot think straight. I feel so stupid, it's my fault). Maybe I'll write the whole story when I'm through this EF. It's just overwhelming right now.
This is a big EF that started yesterday. I'm hoping writing about it will help, I'm not sure. I was actually supposed to take it easy for a few days before Christmas, as the company doctor (very gentle person) told me I could take more time on sick leave to process things, which should have been good. But first, my manager didn't quite understand what was going on and how long I'd be away, and I don't know myself and I had a hard time explaining. And then, I started worrying about spending Christmas time with my M and so I was already not relaxing.
So then the thing happened that I'm really scared of the most and that I'm trying to avoid all the time. Someone got really angry with me, while I was (consciously) trying to be nice to her. And this to me feels life-threatening. That's all I'll say for now.
by your side, DF. love and hugs :hug:
Thank you, San :hug:
Take care yourself. Thinking of you and your D.
:hug:
I'm gonna put this out there and it will feel impossible especially in the midst of the EF:
You do not have to be with your mom for Christmas. You could take the holidays to rest and recover. I understand that it feels like you have to see her. I've been there. I lived between 5 and 20 minutes away from my mom - who was very similar to yours - my whole adult life until she died.
But you can make a choice about what you do and don't want to do for the holidays. It doesn't have to cater to her every year. You can call in sick for the holidays, too. You ARE sick. You DO need to rest and recover. This IS what your body and mind need. Don't react right away just let the thought sink in a bit. You can put your needs first. That would be healthy.
Aside from that I am so very sorry for your current very strong EF. I hope it passes soon and you can find some things to help yourself feel more present. :grouphug:
Thank you too Armee, very kind of you. :hug: I'll think about it when I can think clearly again. I'm trying to distract myself with chores and activities.
Just a little clarification: I have called in sick and the person that was angry was not my mother.
I understood that. I was noticing that you need to take this time to rest, but can't because your nervous system is gearing up to have to spend time with your mom.
Right, okay.
I'm feeling a little better after my son's Christmas singing at school just now. It was so sweet and innocent.
Not quite there yet though. Barricaded my door again (!) just to be sure. :spooked: I'll be alright though, I feel.
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 18, 2024, 05:00:38 PM...I'll be alright though, I feel.
I love it when trust is there despite difficult emotions. Like a bit of solid ground to stand on. :cheer:
Feeling better now. Very tired though. Had a good therapy session/ EMDR on the situation that was underneath this EF. Now, I need to rest.
DF, i agree w/ armee about the holidays. it sounds like some rest would be a lovely gift to yourself. glad therapy was helpful as well. keep taking care of you, ok? love and hugs :hug:
Not quite out of the woods. Although I slept okay last night. But I feel I'm very easily triggered still. Keep apologising to people for things I did 'wrong' and when they don't respond, my first thought is 'see, they're angry with me (too)'. But I try to keep it in check, thinking: 'okay, my body/central nervous system is giving me all these alarm signals for nothing. Forget it. I'm okay. I probably apologised too much already.' And I'm taking care where I go, not to crowded places but to the beach.
I still can't write about what happened to trigger this EF, I'm still too scared. Today started off with being really scared, and now, this being the fifth day of this EF, I'm just wrung out, so tired, I can't do anything but simple chores, can't think.
-Trigger warning-
I can write about what got triggered. It was some events with the step father we had. He was a violent person. He beat me up and raped my mom in the room next to mine while I could hear and I was afraid to move and do anything about it. And after so many incidents, when my mom had finally decided he should go, he didn't. And when he was out running some errands, and my mom had bolted the doors, he broke through the bolts and I was so scared. He was so angry. And when the police came to remove him, he was ever so collected and civil, the police let him stay for a few more hours to pack his things! That felt like no help again.
And then, after my T and I had worked through this experiece with rescripting and EMDR last Thursday, on Friday I was scared again and now I'm reliving the fear of having had a stalker for 6 months which ended in a court case. Back in the EF I am.
And now I'm so tired, feeling so guilty for my kids having this kind of mom, I can't even remember how I got through these past days but apparently I did and I'm still not looking forward to spending time with my mom this Christmas. I know what you guys said here but I can't bring myself to not take her. Although I do not know how I'm gonna drive to pick her up, being in the state I'm in. I didn't take any walks, I didn't do my meditations, I didn't do my breathing excercises. Just some chores is all I did. Not feeling well at all. Wanting to apologise for not being a good cheer.
:bighug:
DF, I hear you so clearly. Me too. Things have just been getting steadily worse. I've been off the forum struggling in my past experiences of witnessing violence. Anyway, I am so sorry for you. Just wanted to say I empathize and think I know exactly how you feel and what you're experiencing. It sucks. Here's to breathing... slowly slowly getting our sympathetic nervous systems calmed down... You are NOT a bad mother, to the contrary, you are trying and working 100 times harder to give to your children. I am proud of you for that. It is immeasurably admirable. Please be kind to yourself. Sending love and hugs...
:hug:
I'm sorry you're reliving those horrible events Desert Flower. It's very hard to believe EF's do end when having them. But they do. The guilt you feel reminds me of a line by Thom Yorke: "The best you can is good enough".
Much love. :hug:
oh, DF, i could relate to so much of what you said about being a messed-up mom, apologizing and wondering if it's enough, and just feeling bad in general. ugh! i know you're a good parent, know you're doing your best w/ your M situation. i also know that these kinds of thoughts hit me harder when i'm overly stressed, and i don't doubt you are right now.
i hope you can take a breath, give yourself some gentleness. i'm sending love and a hug filled w/ both for you. :hug:
Thank you my dear friends. I'm so glad you are here and you understand. I did not dare tell my 'real' friends, because I felt so stupid.
I'm a little bit better now. We're at the holiday home and it's really quiet here. And all the chores are done. So I felt I could finally take some time for me, I did my breathing, I went for a walk on my one and I did some online yoga. I feel a little calmer, albeit very tired.
:hug: :hug: :hug: :hug:
So here's what caused the EF. This is what I wrote last Wednesday, but was afraid to post because I was afraid the person concerning would read it. But chances of that are really, really small.
----------------
I'm so scared - Wednesday 18 december 2024
I'm in a real tough spot at the moment. This is a big EF that started yesterday. I'm hoping writing about it will help, I'm not sure. I was actually supposed to take it easy for a few days before Christmas, as the company doctor (very gentle person) told me I could take more time on sick leave to process things, which should have been good. But first, my manager didn't quite understand what was going on and how long I'd be away, and I don't know myself and I had a hard time explaining. And then, I started worrying about spending Christmas time with my M and so I was already not relaxing.
Long story, apologies. So then the thing happened that I'm really scared of the most and that I'm trying to avoid all the time. My cleaning lady got really angry with me, while I was (consciously) trying to be nice to her. And this to me feels life-threatening. People being angry with me.
The thing is, this is not a stable person, she has issues (too). And that's why I had been trying very hard to accommodate her, take care of her needs, so she would be able to do the cleaning at our house. She had said before that the cleaning was therapeutic to her and also that her father was murdered. Say no more. So one of the things was, she could't work when we were around. So I had been sending my dear h away to work elsewhere (he works from home a lot these days), this was actually a bit of a hassle for him and he really felt he was being sent away too, but he still went, for me. And she has these funny habits with the cleaning and I never dared say anything about them because I knew she would not take that.
Because she had also told me she's the aggressive type whenever she feels bad. So I'm really scared of her. And I thought (hoped?) she liked me because she said other houses she worked at gave her headaches and ours didn't, she liked the atmosphere here. And my husband had proposed to let her go earlier, because something was always up with her. But I really needed someone to do the cleaning as I'm always so busy and I also need some time to myself. And she asked for quite a lot of money and we gave her what she asked.
And the last few weeks, every week something was up with her, either she had to take her grandpa to the hospital, or she had a migraine or she had a bruised wrist and I was still trying to accommodate all of it, shifting her working days around and saying 'no problem'. While actually, it was troubling to me. And the thing is, it's hard for me to trust her, especially because she wouldn't tell us her last name or where she lives, said we just had to trust her or she wouldn't come work, and I really needed it done, so we went along with that. And she has a key to our house! (This is customary in my country. But still.)
So yesterday, again, she said something was up, she needed to press charges against someone and she had had some kind of a blow out with her neighbour and she said she had had a slight concussion for a few days. And she said she needed to change her working day again. And so, I was trying to be nice, saying how annoying this was for her, and apparently this was not enough sympathy (that may have been so) because then she texted: "I quit. Good luck with your life. I think you're really cold. Not even asking how I am! I'll put your house key in your mailbox this weekend." So that really hit me. She's a borderline personality (I looked into this, also on the forum), without any awareness about herself. What she needs is more than I have to give. And so I was scared. So I said: Okay, that's fine. And from her perspective, that probably looked cold indeed. But I just wanted her out of my life now, I was so scared. But it was not the reaction she wanted of course, she probably wanted me to say: Oh I'm so sorry, please stay, etc. etc. but I just didn't have it in me anymore. This was my limit. And then she went all out saying I should have been happy with her and I didn't deserve her respect and everybody gets what they deserve etc. And I felt so horrible.
Because she has our house key! Oh how stupid I feel about this. And she did say she is gonna bring the key 'round next weekend but that's four days! And I'm afraid she will come into our house and yell at me or worse. And my h ordered new locks, but he won't be able to install them until Friday. So I actually had my h barricade the door for me, because otherwise I would not be able to sleep at all and I was kind of okay after that. And now, I'm afraid to sit close to the door/front window, because I'm home alone and I don't want her so see me. And I'm also afraid she will read this although I don't know how she could know about it. I can't think straight. I feel so stupid!
And I've been thinking: it IS a lot.
As I was in the EF I also became aware that there is indeed a lot for me to process. Every time I've 'dealt with' one thing, the next comes up. That's how it works I suppose.
- trigger warning -
Some part of me wants to write here what the big stuff is, so I know I'm not crazy feeling the way I do. So I know it is a lot indeed. I need to validate my feelings:
- growing up with emotionally neglectful and invalidating and dystymic m
- dad dying when I was eight years old and him never being spoken about ever again
- step dad beating me up, raping M, breaking into the house etc.
- SA
- being stalked for six months by a former colleague (who heard voices), ending in a court case
- another toxic relationship with a classic narcissist just to be sure
--------------------------------
And so it's a real condition isn't it. I learned a lot though. Last year around this time, I was feeling just as bad but had really no idea why, no idea what an EF is.
What bothers me though is while I know I'm in an EF, all I seem to be able to do is grit my teeth and operate in survival mode.
Well, with this last EF, I did feel VERY unsafe. I really did have my husband barricade the door. Maybe waiting it out was all I could do at that moment.
-----------------------------------
And just another little thing that I realised is: my uncles are bullies. Yesterday, my m told me over the phone that her brother, my uncle, was being harassed at his house, some people were smearing pudding or whatever on his windows, for the sixth time in a row now. And he said he had no idea who would do such a thing. But it was only him they were targeting, no one else in the neighbourhood was hit. So I thought: this has to be something personal. And it dawned on me, they are always bullying people around, and they don't even notice! They are just so thick. And someone apparently has had enough of that. And my m apparently thinks this behaviour is normal and so did we when we were growing up.
Quote from: Chart on December 23, 2024, 10:15:26 AMMe too. Things have just been getting steadily worse. I've been off the forum struggling in my past experiences of witnessing violence.
Just wanted to give you a big hug too Chart, since you're also struggling. Your kind words may also be directed to you, dear Chart. Here's to breathing. :hug:
And San, SenseOrgan and Armee, thank you, thank you, thank you too.
DF, I'm glad you validated your own situation. I'd like to second that validation. You are dealing with a very difficult situation. And given your traumatic past it is infinitely compounded.
I'd also like to sadly confirm that just knowing about ef's doesn't necessarily diminish their intensity. Knowledge and experience helps, but from my perceptions and understanding, hardened warriors are brought just as low as naive newbies when a core ef is triggered. All the evidence I've come across is that they majorly suck for a long time. The amygdala is an extremely impolite region of the brain, he simply refuses to shut up no matter what we say or do. This has nothing to do with intelligence, you are NOT stupid, this is Trauma.
(And thanks for the hugs! :)
:hug:
trauma, indeed, DF. not your intelligence, not in the least. i'm sorry you lost a cleaning lady, and i hope you are able to find another, but, personally, because you're someone i care about, i'm glad she's out of your life. the idea of being scared of someone who works for you is awful! and, as far as i'm concerned, those new locks can't go on fast enough!
hopefully, you'll be able to have some peace soon. EF's are soooo frustrating, so horrible. sending love and hugs :hug:
Thank you too, San. :hug:
And yes, the locks are changed! :spooked:
So. Well. I survived Christmas with m (and h and kids) at the holiday home.
Today, I took her back home.
And as I set my feet down on the park grounds again, I could feel myself sink into my feet. Sink into my body. I had not felt my body at all these past days. Now starting to relax.
It was hard. About as hard as I thought it would be. When I was halfway through, I started feeling a little better, knowing I was gonna make it.
And yesterday, we went to the ice skating rink with the kids and for a moment there I just felt FREE. It felt so great. And the restaurant we went to yesterday was GREAT too, they had this mamachi dish that was just heavenly. So that helped for a moment.
And now that it's all done, there's this part of me yelling: Hey, I did so great! Everybody liked their gifts, I organised the whole thing, I packed all of the stuff and didn't forget any essentials (thats quite an achievement considering the state I was in!)!!! And why is nobody saying; Well done! You did so great! It's such an achiement indeed. Trying to be perfect and pulling it off. And nobody notices. Well, I notice. So I'm giving this organising/trying to be perfect part some recognition. Well done. You did great. Even if nobody thinks it's a big deal at all. And you were (I was/I am) okay even without the organising and the being perfect. Although I couln't feel that for one bit.
It's so strange. All of the trouble seems to be with me. It's all in my head it seems. Nobody else seems bothered as much. Well, my mom was anxious like she always is, breathing fast and high, but she seems 'all right'. It's almost like I'm making the whole thing up. This tension I have.
Before, I used to be seperated from myself all the time and not even notice it, and I felt closer to my mom then. Now, I feel a whole lot closer to myself, I can feel my feelings and it's like I've now distanced myself from her. And it's hard for me to feel compassion for her. (And I feel I should.) Everything she does or says annoys the h* out of me. And when you look at it from an 'objective' perspective, there isn't anything she does 'wrong'. It's just that tons of teeny, tiny things she does trigger me. Things that I had too much of growing up and I can't stand anything remotely alike anymore. And it makes me miss the things I didn't have (love, encouragement, safety etc.) so much. And I don't have any way to talk to her about it. Which makes it entirely my thing, my problem, my tension.
And I imagined she could see the tension. She keeps looking at me with this puzzled look, as if to say: what's going on. And I want want to say: Nothing's going on!!!! Leave me the h* alone. Leave me be.
And since I can't talk about what's really going on with me, I do not know what to talk to her about at all.
And it's like, since I started recognising what happened and what is going on, the compassionate part of me (that feels compassion for her) is not allowed to be here anymore. Because, if I would let it be here, the hurting children inside would be rebuffed again and I couldn't let that happen anymore. But I noticed, this compassionate part of me also wants to be here. She was here all along and was not 'wrong' either. It's just that it had pushed away some of the hurting children too far. And I feel my way to heal is to acknowledge all of these parts and reconcile them somehow.
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 27, 2024, 04:38:58 PMAnd I feel my way to heal is to acknowledge all of these parts and reconcile them somehow.
That seems to be the winning ticket for many of us. :)
And here's a :cheer: for surviving Christmas.
Regards,
Aphotic.
you did do great, DF! absolutely, and i'm glad you can recognize that for yourself.
i think it's interesting that you are feeling closer to yourself, at the same time feeling more removed from your M. close enough to be able to tell yourself what a great job you did. very cool.
.
QuoteAll of the trouble seems to be with me. It's all in my head it seems. Nobody else seems bothered as much
i've recognized this in myself. my expectations for me are much higher and stricter than for others. a double standard that i'm guessing has been put on me by my parents, F especially. easy to let others slide, but not myself. all these types of things always seemed to mean more to me than to others. something seems askew here.
i'm glad you survived, and have come thru to the other side. well done! love and hugs :hug:
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
The change feels its way through. No one steps into the same river twice.
:hug:
Thank you Aphotic, San and Chart.
----------
Something happened. Today my friends (dear group of friends since college) were sending each other wishes for the new year and thanking each other for the friendship we have.
And something in me thought: well, I would like to share what's really been going on with me these past weeks. So I told them, very shortly. I just don't want to hide anymore who I am. I did that for long enough. No matter what anyone else thinks about it.
So their reactions were like: 'Wow, that's difficult' or something. And one of my friends' daughters are also going through some really difficult times and she said 'Better not talk about this with them around', I understand that and it's fine. And another said: 'Not all of us can remain calm'. Well, that was triggering. As I might have expected, they are friends and they're being nice but they cannot really understand how this works.
And here's what I was thinking: No, not all of us can remain calm. And that's actually normal. Considering what's happend and where I came from. We should not remain calm. We should run and scream and rage. They cannot know this. But I do. I am actually normal. Even if they now think I've lost it completely. I'm actually saner then I ever was. As long as I know this, I'm fine.
It's actually these times past, when I acted 'normal', that I was much more disturbed. Now, at least I know what's going on. And I'm talking about it. It might sound crazy to an outsider. But I finally feel sane. I know.
And I wish everyone here all the best for the new year! :grouphug:
I'm afraid of fireworks. :fireworks:
Desert Flower
You did one heck of a great job! Kudo's to you.
I'm with you, I dislike with a purple with pink polka dot intensity others having any type of access to where I live. It's a good thing that you changed the locks.
Thank you for your kind wishes for the new year! I wish you doubly the same.
Yeah, the booming fireworks suck.
and a lovely new year to you, too, DF.
i agree - it is 'normal' to rant and rage against what happened, and i also agree w/ the feeling of being more 'normal' now than i had been in the past. i coped well, but that was surviving rather than living a 'normal' life.
friends can be well-meaning, and i have one like that who is truly a doll to me, but they can't know if they haven't gone thru it. so glad you're here. love and hugs :hug:
I think selfishness comes really hard to us... it's something we have to learn, and at first it must be forced. Personally I'm scared of how others will react. But I'm getting better. I hope I got the gist of this right... if not please ignore :-)
A while ago, I wrote:
Quote from: Desert Flower on December 23, 2024, 08:00:23 PM- trigger warning -
Some part of me wants to write here what the big stuff is, so I know I'm not crazy feeling the way I do. So I know it is a lot indeed. I need to validate my feelings:
- growing up with emotionally neglectful and invalidating, and dystymic and anxious m
- dad dying when I was eight years old and him never being spoken about ever again
- step dad beating me up, raping M, breaking into the house etc.
- SA for three-and-a-half years
- being stalked for six months by a former colleague (who heard voices), ending in a court case
- another toxic relationship with a classic narcissist just to be sure
And it's almost unbelievable: I forgot a major thing:
- being bullied for ten years by some kid who pretended to be my friend
And I also didn't include:
- the 'only one time' rapes by different guys
:pissed:
DF, I witness and validate your anger (and perhaps anguish) at having had to suffer all theses things. Your doubtless overwhelming memories have caused you to struggle, trying to live in the present moment yet with all these past events hanging on you. It is absolutely understandable that the memories should often get jumbled and lost in the tumult. That you have temporarily misplaced certain traumatic events and situations is absolutely par for the course. It is for you and you alone to decide and accept what remains to be remembered and when and how you choose to recall and deal with. Your anger is entirely valid and your own pace at recalling these things in no way diminishes their affect on you. Do what is best for you, recalling or letting go when you want and feel you are ready.
Sending love and support.
:hug:
I have been reading some posts but I've not been quite sure how to respond. But I just wanted to say I'm so glad you're here. It's just such a relief not having to explain how I feel here. :grouphug:
And I've been away for a little bit again. I've been in survival mode mostly. But taking some steps too. Here's some updates.
Long post again, apologies.
------------ Possible trigger warning
There was a documentary that I felt I needed to watch. It was about a woman I wrote about before who had been in an internment camp (held captive by Japanese forces) during the second world war. I had formed this idea in my head about how she was 'really' traumatised (as opposed to me just being overly sensitive or something) and she was apparently coping very well. And I had been comparing traumas and hers seemed much worse than mine. But however severe it will have been for her, it's not helpful for me to compare. So stop that.
So now, I felt ready to watch it so I could learn how to cope better maybe. Only, in this respect, it didn't turn out so helpful because what she said was she just totally couldn't remember any of the bad stuff that had happened. We know this response. She also said her m (who was probably merely surviving herself) had not liked her much anymore ever since the time she had contracted polio and she wasn't perfect or whole anymore. And I felt really sad for her.
--------------------- Another possible trigger warning
Last weekend I spoke to an acquaintance whose m is similar to mine with respect to wanting to die, not wanting to live and not taking responsibility for her life. This was very helpful conversation, if only for being able to speak my mind freely and not be judged for it. This acquaintance had continued to take care of practical matters for her m until she died, but at some point she had 'cut the cord' emotionally. And that sounded sensible.
And I have also written here before about one of my friends who is also traumatised by her m and still she is lovingly taking care of her m in old age. And I had been feeling so bad about myself not being able to do so. Feeling I should be more compassionate with my m. I had really been struggling with this.
And what I got out of the aforementioned conversation is: it is not a crime not taking your m for holidays. This may sound really silly, but to me it was a realisation. I'm not taking her for any sleepovers anymore. The cost for myself is just too high. I'm doing what I can and that's just it. I just get triggered so immensely being around my m, I have to reduce time with her and take more time to recover. Take care of me. And I can be a volunteer who visits mrs. T once in a while, instead of a daughter visiting her m.
------------------------
I tried going back to work last week and I couldn't. I was too tense and crying at the office so I went home again and called in sick. It sucks.
-----------------------
And I talked to my Buddhist practice instructor too. The conversation was not so much about my (sadly decreasing) Buddhist practice but mostly about my m. And at some point, my PI said: so this is actually all a play you're performing? This referred to me being with my m and not telling her I'm actually not doing well at all. Just pretending everything's okay. Which is killing me and is not working at all. And I had to admit: yes, that's what I'm doing.
And some Buddhist quotes stuck with me, saying:
- don't act with a twist (and the explanation given by one of my teachers was: don't act like everything is okay when it is not)
- don't put an ox's load onto a cow (me being the cow here ;-))
- don't be so predictable (i.e. don't keep repeating the same patterns)
The problem with my m is: it has not been her intention to harm me. Only she did. And she doesn't know she did. And I don't have the heart to tell her now she's 82.
BUT
I want to LIVE, instead of survive. And some things will need to change in order for me to be able to. So. Finally.
I told her I'm not well. I told her I've been having psychological problems. Told her I have CPTSD, that I've known this since June. Told her I'm in therapy. That I've probably been anxious all my life.
And after I really felt better, at least initially. I want to be congruent. I am the way I am. Good. So what if it worries her. She's worried all the time anyway.
The next day, I felt bad again for not being able to do 'everything everybody else can apparently'. I felt like a failure.
During the following day, I started feeling better. Maybe because the sun came out. And I've been noticing whenever I go down the rabbit hole again and stopping myself there. The two big rabbit holes these days are:
1. My m feels sad because she is alone and I'm responsible for making her feel better. NO I AM NOT.
2. I may not feel any negative feelings because it will make my m feel bad. YES I MAY REGARDLESS.
So here's my mantras to practice:
1. I'm okay, also/even when my m is not.
2. I may feel any feelings, whatever my m thinks or feels about them/me.
Overarching theme: Let her be miserable if she wants to. I am going to try to be HAPPY!
Forget about compassion with her. First, I have to get better myself.
Thank you for the validation Chart, much needed. :hug:
DF, it sounds to me like you are working very very hard, making difficult but conscious decisions, and moving a lot of paradigms into places where you see them much more clearly.
I heartily congratulate you. And thank you so much for sharing.
:hug:
Thank you for being here Chart.
I hope you are well.
:hug:
And I ordered a necklace for myself that says: 'Desert Flower', to celebrate (all of) me. :cheer:
Quote from: Desert Flower on January 12, 2025, 06:49:59 PMThank you for being here Chart.
I hope you are well.
:hug:
DF, as a child I didn't make a difference... not to my mother or my father. Now if I can do any little thing that makes a difference for someone else (especially people struggling like me) the joy is truly euphoric. Sometimes this takes me too far, but I risk it anyway. I believe we have to take risks and be prepared for mistakes. No one knows what we are up against. Cptsd is truly horrible. Very few overall seem to understand this. We are on the front line struggling so much.
Thank you so much for hoping I'm well, but honestly I'm not. Like you and so many of us here I'm struggling terribly. I detest beyond description the cold. I'm insanely sensitive to cold and wear six layers when others put on three. But yesterday I took my first ice-cold shower out of pure desperation to get my sympathic nervous system to ratchet down. It worked pretty darn well. I was actually able to get moving today and accomplish quite a few things. I took another cold shower tonight. It's horrible, but it's got me down maybe 60%. I've been at my extreme maximum right through the holidays. It's taken me two weeks now to just begin to feel like I can cope.
We absolutely have to look out for ourselves. And I'm so happy when I share and connect. Being understood is that lifeboat coming up when your strength is starting to go and you just can't tread water much longer.
So happy you treated yourself to a necklace! Me I recently treated myself to a new cordless drill! :-) How's that for gender stereotypes!!! :))
Okay, here's another risk, this may be too much, if that's the case I do apologise, but you make a difference to me Chart. I've said this before: you are a big big support to me. And I'm sure you are for many of us here on the forum. I cannot fathom how your mother and father could not appreciate a person as good as you. I am sorry.
I'm sorry you're struggling so too Chart. Thank you for sharing.
Quote from: Chart on January 12, 2025, 07:59:21 PMI've been at my extreme maximum right through the holidays. It's taken me two weeks now to just begin to feel like I can cope.
Me too.
And you're an absolute hero for the shower challenge! I would definitely not dare. I'm glad that helped you a bit at least.
And I'm happy for your cordless drill too, ha ha! :yahoo:
DF, your realizations about you and your M are inspiring! i especially love the last bit about having to get better yourself first. we do need to take care of us first and foremost, and allow others to do the same. it came as a big surprise to me when one day i realized and understood that others have had the same time as me to sort thru things, realize things about myself and others, and do something about it. not everyone does that, tho, and i believe it's ok to allow them their reality concerning that.
keep going, DF. i think you're doing great! love and hugs :hug:
Thank you so much, DF. We're gonna make it. I have faith in the healing that we so hope for. The love and support I feel from others helps me continue moving forward.
:hug:
Quote from: sanmagic7 on January 13, 2025, 01:50:52 PMand i believe it's ok to allow them their reality concerning that
That's wise San, very helpful, thank you.
Quote from: Desert Flower on January 12, 2025, 08:22:02 PMAnd you're an absolute hero for the shower challenge! I would definitely not dare. I'm glad that helped you a bit at least.
Hero, no. Desperate. I was so bad I was ready to try anything. I think we are capable of extreme actions if necessary. Like doing impossible things for our kids. For me it's reassuring to know that the cold shower really works. Emergency re-regulation. 30 seconds is all it takes and my system was easily 50% better.
Hi Desert Flower,
I hope the necklace you ordered arrives soon. It is lovely that you ordered that to celebrate all of you. Sending you a hug, if that's ok :hug:
Hope
Hi again,
Thank you Hope, been wearing the necklace every day since it arrived. :cheer:
There certainly are some things I would like to share but somehow I haven't gotten round to it for a while.
I've been doing pretty good lately. I've become more aware of the little and big patterns I've got in my mind. The ways I start going down the rabbit holes and stopping myself early on. Much of it is related to the feeling of not being seen, not being heard. Like when I'm cleaning up the house all day and nobody seems to notice. Or it is related to feeling I'm not good enough. Like the way I get stressed out on the mornings when every family member needs to leave the house at different times and I'm trying to keep track of things and everybody having to take the things they'll need for the day and at some point I start thinking 'I cannot do this, how am I going to get this done'.
(For those who were still wondering: Schema Therapy turns out to be working with the inner children and the inner critic.)
So now, when I'm at work, I don't only feel when I'm anxious but I can hear the thoughts that bring on the anxiety. It's still hard to get myself out of it, but I do feel I'm making progress here. And now, I may start feeling okay with not every day feeling okay. ;-)
I've been getting better at dealing with my M, when she asks me how I am, I now know this question has nothing to do with how I feel for real, it has to do with her wanting to be reassured. I feel saner knowing this.
So I did have an EF after I told my SIL what I think is actually the matter with my M (being on the spectrum), and SIL said something like: Yes, don't we all have difficulties with our mothers. And she meant well saying this but it really got me off. NO, this is not like everyone's mother (I did not feel heard), this is about mine and there is definitely something truly different about her and I really was insufficiently cared for!
And some other things did not send me into an EF whereas they would have some months ago.
Like my colleagues making jokes about being stalked and some months ago I would have fawned and laughed with them; ha ha being stalked, that's so funny (not). And last week, I didn't laugh at this 'joke' and I thought to myself: I don't like this comment and that way, I stayed with who I am.
And when I told another colleague about dealing with my M (on the spectrum) he said: well it isn't so bad dealing with a person like that when you know how the person wants to be treated. And I thought: well, that may be so but that was NOT my point, my point was about the way I was treated. So there you go.
But the BIGGEST thing is, I'm so proud. My M was asking me about the next summer holidays and I distinctly thought: this is my cue. I have to tell her NOW. And I did it!!! I told my M that next summer, I will NOT be taking her on any sleepovers at our holiday home (like I had been doing, triggering myself terribly). I will only be picking her up in the morning and dropping her off back home in the evening of the same day. And I told her this was because otherwise, it will be too much for me. And she said: and the children each need a room of their own by now. And I left it at that. And I felt so relieved. I am now starting to take care of myself. And I will only do for her what I can.
:heythere:
DF, wow! Incredible and thank you. I'm touched and impressed by your work and decisions and determination. You are changing. The reactions are different and you are re-aligning, more and more orienting inward. Giving out only what is healthily aligned with what you think, want and need. And all that is truly awesome!
:hug:
This is awesome Desert Flower! It makes me happy to know you are stepping into your power and standing up for yourself. It's really painful sometimes when people blurt out all sorts of nonsense about stuff they have no clue about. Like growing up with
your M. This is the type of stuff that often hurts me too. That "not being seen place" is vast, and a lot in daily life ties into that. Massively on difficult days, and not even so much on good days. I'm afraid that the level of my reactivity indicates the amount of unprocessed trauma. That part I own. And there's the reality of having to deal with people that (often unintended) rub salt in very deep wounds. To me, people who survive in a workplace with these, are emotional athletes. Much respect! :applause:
I'm just wondering (and it's none of my business!) if changing the priority of your own needs and views brings up more shame/guilt? There was a period of several years in which my motto was something like "if you're feeling guilty/ashamed, you're doing the right thing". I used this because I knew I wasn't doing anything wrong, but I was acting full force against the voice of the inner critic. It's message became a reverse cue. This works nicely with this, I think:
QuoteAnd now, I may start feeling okay with not every day feeling okay. ;-)
I hope you're making a couple of victory laps (in your mind). I'm rooting for you! :cheer:
DF,
Congratulations on your progress. That's so great that you're able to start talking to your M like this. And you're taking care of yourself while taking care of your family. And what a great feeling it must be that your SIL didn't send you into an EF. That's a sign of real progress.
Because you're right: Your M has a very unique brand of causing you a unique brand of distress and you have the right to reach out and want support with it.
Thank you Chart, SenseOrgan and Papa Coco. It's so nice to have people supporting me here.
Quote from: SenseOrgan on February 24, 2025, 10:02:40 AMI'm just wondering (and it's none of my business!) if changing the priority of your own needs and views brings up more shame/guilt?
SenseOrgan, I think I actually went through the guilt first, if that's possible. I had been going through an awful time knowing I was gonna have to change something for me to feel better and feeling I couldn't do that to her (guilt). But then I had this realisation about what is actually the matter with my M and how she is never gonna get any better and how I can never fix this so in a way, it doesn't matter so much what I do. She's unhappy whatever I do. And also, she won't understand me either, no matter what I do or say. And in a strange way, knowing that gave me some room for manoeuver. So when I actually did what I needed to do, the dominant feeling turned out to be relief.
well done, DF. taking care of ourselves is such a biggie! that's so wonderful! proud of you, my dear.
i'm glad you got the guilt out of the way already so you can now just be. such a big step. keep up the good work. love and hugs :hug:
Great! It's paradoxically liberating to see so clearly there's absolutely nothing you can do about something, isn't it? It's brave you went for it nevertheless.
There are so many situations where we give our power to people who just aren't going to change. I find poignant meaning in the idea that confronting my powerlessness in certain situations actually empowers me beyond and out of the situation. I can gain, (what DollyVee as mentioned recently to me, and I'm still trying to get a solid hold on the idea) Agency. I'm not giving up, I'm just putting the bar where it belongs and acknowledging a spectrum of perceiving that doesn't have to be linear. I can opt out, or shortcut, all the while allowing myself to search for the aspect that is best for me and by that I can actually be more present in those situations where I do want to give. (I hope that made sense :)
I think too that SenseOrgan does well to bring up Shame and Guilt. I don't want to underestimate those f-ers. Their sneaky ones and I know myself and my codependent ways too well.
:grouphug:
Quote from: Chart on February 26, 2025, 06:34:45 PMI hope that made sense :)
Yes it did. Thank you Chart. :hug:
And thank you too, San and SenseOrgan, for your support. :hug:
Back in an EF. Oh I feel so horrible. I don't even really dare to come on the forum because I feel so ashamed, I messed up again. How am I ever gonna make it if I keep falling again and again. Literally fell off my bike today. That set it off. And I could just hear my inner child crying: I'm only trying to do everything right! I'm trying so hard. And I can't. I feel so stupid and ashamed. I feel like such a f***-up.
What happened was, this week had been a little rough already, my car had broken down, my ebike as well, and the guinee pig was ill again and had to be taken to the vet. And I have all these activities for the kids to organise. And I feel so utterly alone doing all this. I'm not alone actually, my husband is here too, but I feel everything is my responsibility. And in addition, I've been trying to get back to work, worrying about how I'm ever gonna return to my official working hours, all I'm thinking is: I cannot do it, how am I gonna get this done, I can't, I just can't.
So today, at my daughters school, they had a fundraiser, and I was bringing two bags of used clothes they were collecting. And the bags were too large to carry by bike actually. But I just really wanted to do this for my D. And I was riding my husband's bike doing that, which is too big for me. And this was quite the balancing act already and then some kid coming from behind hit me and there I was. And the kid just rode on. And I saw some other kid passing me laughing, I'm not even sure he was laughing but it was just too much. I managed to ride on to school not crying.
It was exactly like the way I felt in highschool. Not just in my mind, but I was literally on my way to school being the laughing stock again. I cannot believe it.
And I've been crying here at home ever since. Called in sick again. Oh I hate this so thoroughly. I don't wanna be a mother who cannot handle normal daily stuff. I just feel like such a .... well, you know.
And I know it's an EF. And I know it will pass. I will feel better again. I don't know when though. Tomorrow's another therapy session which is well timed ha ha.
And I just really honestly don't know if I'm ever gonna get back to my regular working hours and that just scares the h*** out of me too.
So there you go.
Ah Desert Flower, that's a terrible place to be in. I'm sorry this perfect storm hit you. I know that feeling all too well, like everything is lined up against you and has been forever. You're also welcome here if you feel stupid and ashamed. Especially than. Very welcome just as you feel. I'm currently also in an EF. You'll be in my thoughts today. Big hug :hug:
Thank you SenseOrgan, it's good to know you're here. And I wish you will feel better soon too. Big hugs to you as well.
:hug:
I feel I must thank you again SenseOrgan. This is interesting. Somehow your message calmed down my inner child. I still don't feel great, I feel down as a matter of fact, but I do feel a lot calmer. I had been messaging some other people in 'real' life and they had in fact responded in a kind way, and I was still upset, but somehow knowing you understand from actual experience is truly validating. So thank you. And some more wishes for you to feel better. :hug:
dang, DF, what a horrible thing to have happened to you. i, too, get it. try, try, try, and something comes unraveled. not fair, not right, and it hurts so much. sending love and a hug filled w/ care and and injection of some courtesy for those disrespectful kids who didn't have an ounce of compassion. :hug:
Thank you too San, I appreciate it. :hug:
Desert Flower,
I can really feel the distress in your post. I'm so sorry to hear that you're having one of those weeks where a lot of little things are creating an overwhelming pile of problems. And I do understand the EF. Being laughed at on the bike ride to school is an extremely triggering thing to happen to a person whose past was built on that kind of unfriendliness.
I imagine that riding a bike that was too big for you only added to feeling small and vulnerable.
And I am glad to read that you are aware that this is a trauma EF. That doesn't make it easier, but at least you know this is related to trauma. Chart, another member of the forum, once said to me that neurotypical people, those not hampered with traumatic pasts, start every day at stress levels 1 or 2. So when overwhelming car and eBike problems all happen at once, they rise up to a stress level of 5 or 6. But we here on the OOTS forum, never get below a 5 or 6. So when overwhelming problems occur, we shoot up to a 9 or 10, so our distress is a lot harder to manage.
Just knowing that helps me when I'm hit with too much at once. The EF is still painful and difficult, but knowing it is trauma induced helps me to not feel completely defeated. EFs are temporary. I didn't used to know that. But I do now. It helps.
It was an act of intelligence for you to share your EF on the forum. My therapist tells me often that opening up at the right times and asking for help and comfort when needed is wisdom. Functional intelligence. Posting this on the forum was you asking your peers to understand what you're going through, and that's how you get support from your peers. As we heal from our traumatic pasts, sharing the journey with others on the same road is how we gain strength and support. We truly are all in this together.
For now, I hope you are able to find some calm. When my EFs get too severe, my wife and I intentionally call it "the flu" to help us both deal with my emotional distress without thinking of it as a permanent problem. The flu comes and goes, and so do EFs. At least that's how Coco and I deal with my EFs. We just let them happen.
For me, EFs are made worse when I am afraid of them. For me, accepting them and trusting that my family will support me while I'm feeling like a tormented school kid again, helps me to at least lose the fear while I'm miserable. I can't speak for everyone, but in my own trauma-life, accepting the EFs as if they are a debilitating medical condition in a temporary flair up, gets me through the EFs faster. Accepting them for what they are helps me get through them faster.
I certainly don't know what works best for others, so I'm only speaking for myself. I guess I share it just in case it can help. We're all in this together. We care about each other on this forum.
I hope the storm of problems starts to calm down soon for you. I really feel the pain you're describing, and I truly hope it starts to wane away now.
Hi Papa Coco and thank you for taking the time to respond so extensively. These are some wise, kind and helpful things you wrote. Thank you for caring.
I'm glad you understand, as we do on this forum. I'm also glad I did reach out, 'cause you're right, it's good to get some support when we need it.
It's funny you and your wife call it 'the flu', because I had years of flu-like symptoms whenever I would get too stressed out. And now also, after the crying I feel feverish, cold and very tired. And I know these symptoms will go away again. Like the flu.
And you're touching on a very important point here too. These EF's they will keep coming and going. And I've been wanting for them to go away and stay away most of all. That's what I want therapy to do too. And it's important to accept things as they are. This is a condition that comes with EF's. I will have to accept that. Especially whenever I feel I'm doing okay again, I want to forget that there's gonna be new EF's. It will be like the times before when I had all these physical complaints on and off, varying with my stress levels, they will come (and go). So that's my task for the coming period: to accept that there will be EF's. However much that sucks.
:fallingbricks:
DF, Falling off a bike is a terrifying experience. It comes out of nowhere, happens at lightning speed, and we lose all control. What better synopsis of an abused child's experience?
Please don't judge yourself too harshly. Accidents happen. Our past continues to rise up in us. You're aware of so much now. Give yourself some time. Feel what you need to feel. You know you're not alone. We're here with you. We're all contributing and becoming part of the cycle of ascendency over our fear-driven brains. We are getting better at this stuff, together, as all the fantastic and wonderful responses show. Your "accident" gave rise to a shower of understanding, yours and ours. It's so encouraging and forward moving. Thank you so much for sharing. (Please read my post directly to the Shame part of your brain :-)
:grouphug:
hey, DF, i have actually experienced years of those 'flu-like' symptoms when i've gotten overly stressed, and one day i actually discovered it's a real thing and it's called 'stress flue'. just letting you know, it's not made up or anything like that. you're not the only one who's experienced it. and it's awful, miserable feeling, just like the flu is only one day away. you're right, it eventually goes away, but i still hate it when it's around.
keep taking care of you, ok? love and hugs :hug:
Thank you everyone, for the wonderful responses indeed.
:grouphug:
Chart, you made my heart smile again, thank you. :hug:
And thank you too San, for pointing that out, I did not know it was called that. My temperature is definitely off: hot - cold - hot - etc.
Take care you too. :hug:
It's wonderful you're inner child calmed down yesterday. I think everybody here gets the flavor of what you went trough. It's hard to believe in an EF, and scary to open up when so vulnerable and age regressed. Even here that can be the case. I hope you lost some of the aloneness by taking this step. Your openness about what you go through is also validating for me (and others, I presume). Thank you for that, and for your kind words. :hug: