Out of the Storm

This is the first time I've actively understood that I was trying to fill some void with junk food. I just got back from the break room and I've got a bagel, a bag of chips and a soda. And I wanted to get more, I just didn't have the money. As I was looking at the selections, I wanted it all. I wanted not just one cheeseburger, but all of them. Looking and the standard vending machine, I wanted ALL of my favorites, chips, chocolate, pastries. ALL of it.

I had a visceral sense of wanting to put all that food inside me. A small part of my brain said that it would mean stuffing the food in. The rest of my brain shouted - FINE, just gimme! It was almost a sense of panic that I couldn't get enough food!

I'm already morbidly obese and not active enough. Alright, truth - I barely move once I get home from work and handle what little household stuff needs handling. I'm also aware of dreading going home tonight. And of having to work late - that's normal and doesn't cause problems at home. Still, I want to hide from the work, hide from my coworkers and crawl into a small, protected corner and EAT and EAT and EAT until I fall asleep. It's taking everything I have to stay where I am, finish this sentence and force myself to return to my job.

What is going on? I didn't think I was a food-soother. I also don't remember getting particularly triggered. The only thing I can think of is that at lunch I ate too much. My coworker had brought bread and chicken salad so we could all make sandwiches. She'd made hers and I made mine. There was some salad left, but not much. There was only a heel slice left on the bread. She mentioned throwing it out and a voice inside me screamed, 'NO! Don't waste this, it's good!'. But, there was so little, it was hard to argue or offer to take it. So, I made a second sandwich out of what was left - and made sure to leave no waste.

I felt like a pig, then. Similarly to how I feel when I finish what my son doesn't want at dinner, or what my husband fixes for himself and decides is too much. I feel like a garbage disposal, but I do it willingly. I can always say no. The dogs at home hope I will, because they will likely get the leftovers. Still, lately, I find myself determined to eat it all. Every morsel. NO WASTE. I MUST eat it all.

The logical side of me knows that's wrong. It knows that I already have a slow metabolism and IBS. I shouldn't be just shoving food in. It knows I feel better when I watch what I eat (not too closely) and make healthy choices. It's just not loud enough to shout down that other part that says - MORE, GIMME, NOW!

I really do feel like Violet on 'Charlie and the Chocolate Factory'. I want it NOW, I want it ALL. And, yet, I know that's not my normal self. ::: shaking head :::

The bagel is gone. The chips were inhaled. I'm drinking the soda. Time to get back to work.

Please don't blame yourself. It sounds like you are suffering from serious hormone imbalance. There are hormones in your gut that tell your brain that YOU ARE STARVING EAT ALL YOU CAN NOW EAT EAT EAT and no amount of talking yourself out of it will stop you. You really need to be kind to yourself about this. Shaming yourself and beating yourself up over something that is taking over your brain is too too cruel to yourself. Are you making yourself go hungry a lot? Because that can cause it. Or have you lately tried to eat less and less to control your weight. This just messes up the gut.  There is a very very good eating program at Curves called Curves Complete (NOT Jenny Craig) where they deal with the hormones . Unfortunately, you have to eat (wouldn't it be great if we could just avoid the food for a bit to get control???). You have to be a member of Curves to do the diet. Just a suggestion.

Also, I know it is hard, but there is a site (free) about self-compassion online. We need to be kind to ourselves. There are meditations and exercises that may help you be kinder to yourself and less likely to be harmful. They are short and not hard to do.

Please know that you are worthy of your own love and compassion. :)

Wife#2, I do this too.  :hug: Usually it's telling me something in my emotions is unbalanced. I doN't know about hormones. The idea is new to me - I really ahve no idea there. At the moment I'm mostly allowing myself to over-eat. At least I'm doing some exercise, but not much. Nothing like sport or anything but I do walk and cycle places.

It was a eureka moment for me years ago in therapy when I realised: I'm more than just my body! You too are more than just your body and more than just your determination to leave no waste. When you're ready what's behind that might 'surface' and then you can work with it.

wife2, when ii was researching alexithymia, one of the symptoms of coping with unknown emotions was addictions.  i'm not saying you're addicted to food, but it was the idea that when there's some discomfort that we can't identify, and we don't know how to self-soothe, we go for what we can grab for a 'quick-fix' to make that discomfort go away.  i'm familiar with this, cuz i do it, too.

i agree that yelling at yourself neg. will not help.   one way i've been changing my brain is by gentle, soothing, nurturing self-talk, or rather brain-talk.  talking to my brain, sometimes out loud, like it's a small child who had been mis-taught, given false messages, so it gives me false messages, especially about pain.  i do believe it's helping. 

i've also begun asking what is making me feel uncomfortable when it comes to wanting to eat in order to force that discomfort out of the way, distract myself from it.  that's a little more difficult, but it, too, is helping.  identifying fear, for example.  what am i afraid of?  what do i think might happen?  why do i think i can't deal with it?  etc.  any questions that seem pertinent.

also, some of the physiology, which you might already know, is that when under stress or duress of any kind, the brain craves sugar, salt and grease.  sounds like junk food to me.

bottom line has been the lack of self-soothing, knowing how to do it, what we need to hear, pos. messages that have been missing.  the more of those we put into our mind, the less room there is for the neg. stuff that just continues to hurt us.  just letting you know i hear you!  big hug, my dear friend.

H and I watched the second Fat, Sick and Nearly Dead http://www.rebootwithjoe.com/watch-fat-sick-and-nearly-dead/ last night. We'd seen the first one last year. Joe Cross makes a really good case for juicing, iow taking in lots of micronutrients. The theory is if you do the reboot, you won't crave junk food any more. He also credits it with sorting out all sorts of long-term ailments.

So we weighed ourselves this morning, and I'm horrified and sad at the shape I'm in. We've vowed to do regular Sunday weigh-ins and cut out all the junk.

Today I've been eating a really strange mix of sweet junk and exceedingly healthy greens, raw, directly out of the garden. Dandelions and stuff like that.

I know of and agree with most of what sanmagic says. It's just that I've chosen to allow myself my addiction for the time being.

o, so have i, blueberry!  i'm far from out of the woods with this.  especially during this time.  me and peanut butter have become best friends!!!

it's gotten better than what it was, and for that i'm thankful.  small steps, very small steps.  we'll make it.

I'm still trying to fill the void with junk food. But, I think I got some insight this weekend. I think the void is named - no-intimacy-no-touch. That void is too big for food to fill. I'm not hungry, I am stressed. So, a lot of what you said, San makes very good sense. I'm checked regularly for hormones, because of my thyroid condition. but, I think that thyroid condition is a cart/horse situation.

I've always had minor food issues. I've always been terrified of being fat, like Mom, her mother, her mother, etc. I've always abhorred Mom's horrible eating habits, especially post-divorce. My habits are better, but it's a marginal difference.

See, the thing is, I know I'm not hungry when I do this. I further know that there will be no purge later. It is an awareness that I feel empty - not hungry, that's different - and that I must fill it with SOMETHING. I will sometimes choose the healthy snack or healthy meal or turn down the left-overs or whatever other healthier decision is available. But, when the EMPTY starts screaming at me, I'll fill it with whatever junk food I can get my hands on.

I used to have a candy jar in my office. Some took advantage, taking several pieces of the most expensive option and not helping with the replacement funds. When the EMPTY started screaming at me just before the new year, I used the holidays (and giving to my own children) as my excuse for not filling the candy jar. Now, it's empty as protection from myself. Sure, I blame the greedy coworkers for the empty jar. But, the truth is, I can't trust myself in this office with that candy jar full.

I had a tough emotional weekend. Hubby wasn't mean, just taking completely for granted again and maintaining his expectations as usual. All weekend, I was shoveling in. Junk, what each had got but couldn't finish. I've felt sick all weekend, too. And emotional. And like I had nobody IRL to talk with. Since I don't trust that I have any privacy at home, I can't get here on days when I'm not working.

Pulling it together. I still have a lot to figure out, don't I? Hopefully, I don't just keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again. Not feeling real confident right now.

I've been sucking and even crunching cough drops all day, far more frequently than you'd do for a cold. Till I realised: I need to do some internal sorting-out > > get on OOTS!

 :hug: Blueberry. I do that, too sometimes.

A promise I'm going to make myself - drink more water. Just that one for now. Maybe not enough, but more than I am now.

Maybe you can find something that helps you - stretch every time I want a cough drop.  I don't know.

I feel like the blind trying to lead the blind here. Just, try to find a minute to be kind to yourself, ok? I will, too.

Well, I'm not crunching cough drops at the computer. I have been managing to post, even in my Journal, so I'm sorting a bit and that helps.  :hug: to you too. Thanks for starting this thread.

I was also morbidly obese. It turns out that the bigger you get the more food you crave and the worse the sugar and carb cravings get...you may literally never feel full. I was eating an entire packet of crumpets or muffins in one go to feel full.

If you ever want to try something different, which worked for me, a low carb diet is amazing. I haven't even been doing it for 18 months yet and I have lost 8 and a half stone, and no longer have insatiable hunger. Also the hormone imbalances were making me so emotional, and that's all stabilised. The bigger you get, the more unbalanced your hormones can get and then you end up all over the place. Atkins is good, but I am doing low carb, no dairy or wheat, and almost zero sugar, apart from a little dark chocolate each day. You don't go hungry and your hunger cravings just go.

I'd be careful of juicing as you can overload your liver and it's still sugar  - a lot of sugar. If you want a really interesting film on sugar, 'That Sugar Film' on Amazon is hilarious and fascinating and life changing.

Also, to cope with emotional voids, meditation can help as it gives you a gap between craving and action. And it can give u a higher tolerance for being with and exploring the discomfort....sometimes if you stay with numbness inside it will turn into something else - like grief or rage. Sometimes it only feels empty because you have shut it down, but it wants to be felt. It's a bit like an inner child who has shut down but is actually very upset or anxious or angry and just wants to be heard. Some good people to read on meditation are Jon Kabat-Zinn (there are lots of lovely meditations on Youtube) and Pema Chodron (author of Places that Scare You). The latter talks about turning towards those scarey, uncomfortable, empty places in ourselves and learning to develop compassion towards them - it's deep healing work. Also just mindfulness meditation can really help.

I've just switched to making my own plate of salad in the evenings instead of eating MIL's overcooked, fat- and carb-laden meals. I was surprised I didn't feel hungry at all, much less having it keep me awake. Here's to micro-nutrients!  :chestbump:

Next step is to get some walking scheduled. I have plenty of wobble, and I've realised the longer I let it go on, the harder it will be to get out there.

I did buy salad ingredients on the last grocery run. I can get the walking done. I can get a better pair of walking shoes and I know I can get my son out walking with me.

I do need to lay it on the line for my husband. If he really loves me and wants me to live a long time, he has got to help me with this dietary change. He's the primary cook during the week and he prefers to cook 'feel-good' comfort foods.

I'm coming to realize that his ability to have a meat and two or more vegetables at EVERY meal is his proof to himself that he can provide for his family better than his mother could provide for him and siblings. The diet is very poor. He eats two meals a day, but they are dinner and before-bed meal. I have to get him on board or he will continue to make these fat-laden meals.

I'm not one to make fancy meals or to expect the kids to eat escargot or calamari (we can't afford those anyway LOL), but I do think having simple meals and encouraging fruit or raw vegetable snacking in the evening could teach our children better habits AND improve our health along the way. I don't know how to break hubby out of this mindset that providing junk food is loving to our children. I can't do that on my own.

What I can do is to buy these things and let DS8 know that I am doing this because I love him and want to set him up for healthier living for the rest of his hopefully long life. I will eat the healthier options - I actually like raw broccoli and carrots and tomatoes! So does DS8! Raw fruit is also fun, but again there are sugars in fruit, so yummier but also not so healthy. I can't get hubby to think of these as snacks.

I'm writing a lot to myself, I know you know these things. Thank you for bearing with me.

It's time to sit down and listen to the empty-feeling spot. It's time to be the grownup and buy groceries responsibly and give hubby the choice, learn to cook healthier meals or stop cooking and I'll fix dinner when I get home. Because I can choose to NOT eat the comfort foods (though I also love them). I can choose to eat for a longer life, for the enjoyment of healthy foods and what they are doing FOR my body.

It takes a turn-around in action. Eat healthier, move more, gain energy, eat even healthier, move even more, gain even more energy. Make a LIFE change that is LIFE AFFIRMING. Break the depression/junk food/overweight/unhealthy/rinse & repeat cycle. Replace it with the enthusiastic/healthy food  snacks/healthy weight/increased energy/rinse & repeat cycle.

Then, it's time to look at why I smoke and love myself enough to quit. And watch my DS8 rejoice and celebrate. First, let me tackle this dietary & emotional hurdle, though. That's going to be big enough!

Way to go wife#2! Don't forget to give yourself a pat on the back every time you make a change and when you continue with that change.

What has helped me is trying to fill the void with completely different things: like concentrating on more senses than just taste.
Wearing perfume or using scented whatever (soap, shower gel, scent diffuser in my home) or going out and smelling some flowers that can all help. Also doing something creative or artistic because that often involves colours.
Even some touch helps. A hug can be a good thing. But I also noticed when I put lipstick on after a meal, it's as if I'm sealing my lips and it's a message of: a) closed for the moment (doesn't stop me talking though) and b) get back in your sensible, rational Adult. It doesn't always work for me because wearing makeup is hard and can be triggering.

These examples are all about giving your body different impulses. Maybe you can find other ones more suitable for you.

wowser, wife2!  way to go!  it really is life-affirming when we make those kinds of decisions.  so happy for you, and, if it's my place, so proud of you as well!!!  you go, girl!

that mind talk really makes a difference.  talking to my daughter this a.m., she was telling me about making herself take some down time, but how much it sucked.  i thought - whoa!  those two messages don't go together!  so  i mentioned that it's like a self-sabotage to do something good for yourself, but in your mind you're saying something bad about it.  i don't think she realized that before.

so, for you to talk about life-affirming changes, your mental messages are matching your physical messages, and i do believe that will get the job done.  it may be enough to focus on you right now, and show your son by example - put out those veggies at night for snacks.   i don't doubt he'll join you.

well done, my dear.  happy happy happy!  big hug!!!

Quote from: Wife#2 on May 02, 2017, 12:28:19 PM
I'm not one to make fancy meals

Me neither. Nobody would call me a good cook, or even a cook. When I lived alone, which has been most of my adult life, I used to fill my fridge with fruit and veg + cheese (I love cheeses of all kinds) and I'd have tins of fish, seeds, nuts, olives etc to hand. An hour or so after I got in from work I'd start chopping and dicing.

After eight months on MIL's 'traditional' evening meals I've gone over 11 stone and called a halt in desperation. I've had just two days back on salad stuffs and I feel better already.

QuoteI do think having simple meals and encouraging fruit or raw vegetable snacking in the evening could teach our children better habits AND improve our health along the way. I don't know how to break hubby out of this mindset that providing junk food is loving to our children. I can't do that on my own.

I thought I wouldn't be able to either. Now to persuade MIL to get more variety in the 'fresh' department.

QuoteI actually like raw broccoli and carrots and tomatoes!

Yeah, me too.

H and I have fresh fruit salad as breakfast. I got the idea from Fit For Life by Harvey and Marilyn Diamond. They make a promise in the intro that you can drop 10lbs in 10 days, and that's exactly what happened for me just by having nothing but fruit before noon, as recommended. Oh okay, I had fags and cups of coffee as well, and it still worked.

QuoteI can choose to NOT eat the comfort foods (though I also love them).

I'll take a night off occasionally for a take-out pizza or a restaurant meal. I love eating out, and it frustrates me when H says why would we do that, it's cheaper to eat at home. :roll:

QuoteEat healthier, move more, gain energy, eat even healthier, move even more, gain even more energy.

:yahoo:

I am so grateful for your encouragement, everyone.

Hubby was willing to go to fish sticks for tonight's dinner - hey, baby steps in the right direction. Tonight, I'll remind him that I have salad fixings. We can have that with the oven baked fish sticks and it's healthier than the canned beef stew from the other night! Once a week, then twice a week, then maybe take over with healthy stuff - and the 'night off' to savor that comfort food once in a while.

I'm not sure what a stone is in weight (yup, 'dumb' American LOL), but I'm pretty sure we were in the same neighborhood - I haven't crossed 200 lbs yet, but it's mighty close. Then, I saw myself in the mirror last weekend. AACCKKK. Yes, more fruits/veggies/fish/healthy stuff is a health requirement!

A stone is 14 lbs.

I saw myself in a shop window recently and could no longer deny the struggle I have finding things in my wardrobe to wear. The answer is NOT bigger clothes.

Awesome that you are making healthy changes...well done! It will make such a difference. Good luck!

Quote from: sanmagic7 on May 02, 2017, 05:07:29 PM
that mind talk really makes a difference.  talking to my daughter this a.m., she was telling me about making herself take some down time, but how much it sucked.  i thought - whoa!  those two messages don't go together!  so  i mentioned that it's like a self-sabotage to do something good for yourself, but in your mind you're saying something bad about it.  i don't think she realized that before.

I still have trouble with this, giving myself very mixed messages. In fact I've been told I tend to give myself messages like: "If you get up every day at your alarm, then you are not allowed to read books any more."  :doh: Punish yourself for making good steps. It's pretty deeply ingrained. Especially in the areas of eating and exercising.

I can definitely relate to this. Mine is exaggerating the resistance I'll get from hubby, because he usually does resist anything that changes the schedule he prefers - unless he's the one doing the changes. So, I catastrophise his response before I've even TOLD him what changes I'd like. He then sounds supportive. Granted, I will get PA resistance later (whining, complaining about being put out or excluded or lonely) if history predicts future. Still, I typically have sat on the sofa being the reliable lump of a woman - ready for their beck & call.

The idea of being as strong at home as I type here online daunts me. I know how it could look in our family if I just started DOING what I speak of here. I don't know where my courage disappears to so often.

Drifiting... forcing myself back to the act of typing so I can come back from that place I just wandered to. Hm..... Gonna go explore that a bit. No anger, just sadness and .... BACK WIfe2, BACK to the now! Too much to do to drift away now.

Got left in the lurch today and instead of resorting to filling the void, I had a normal breakfast, since it was time anyway, and I made myself two different types of tea. One is very healthy and the other quite delicious, but time-consuming to make. So bothering to make myself this delicious tea was a much better compensation than filling the void...

"Bothering to do something" good for me is hard. But I know why: FOO often didn't bother. F had depression himself and codependent/enabling and M had her reasons, albeit rather skewed and having nothing to do with me really. I think the only way through this is to keep on keeping on. Keep bothering myself to do good things for me.

Sometimes it's hard for me when there's been a change in plans. It's not as if there aren't 3000 things to do and it's not as if I don't have lists of these to look at, but it still seems difficult to change my plans and do something constructive in the time now left empty. So the time itself is a void; the void doesn't just refer to feelings.

Quote from: Blueberry on May 04, 2017, 12:45:16 PM
Sometimes it's hard for me when there's been a change in plans. It's not as if there aren't 3000 things to do and it's not as if I don't have lists of these to look at, but it still seems difficult to change my plans and do something constructive in the time now left empty. So the time itself is a void; the void doesn't just refer to feelings.

Oh, how true, how true!!! Such wise words, my friend, Blueberry.  :yes:

I've had many moments like that, wanting EVERYTHING .. for me it comes from trying to gain back control of food since my narc. parents were (and still are) health nuts to the absolute extreme. I was often deprived in high school and developed an eating disorder (compulsive overeating) in college. I have been known to swing from all-out junk food to health food because of this. It's a battle I know very well.

I find it helps me now to cook for myself and prepare things in a way that pleases ME. Add nice spices & flavors, make dishes look appealing, etc.
I subscribed to Dashing Dish website to give me recipes which are amazing because they replicate a lot of favorites but in a healthy way. I also learned that deprivation doesn't get me anywhere. I try to have SOMETHING around that makes me feel happy, even if it's just some chocolate.

I also recently started taking Almased for weight loss. It helps diabetics which I'm not, but I have another condition that requires balanced eating so I think it will work for me. Shakes with protein powder, almond milk, vanilla flavorings, stevia, (sometimes fruit) and ice, coconut/olive oils, peanut butter help A LOT!

talked with my daughter this morning, she said that her shoulder pain is beginning to change, move, and that's a good sign.  she told me that she's been changing her self-talk and grudgingly admits it might be making a difference.

there's an exercise i learned, very simple, very powerful.  have someone raise an arm to shoulder height and say to themselves, 'i can keep my arm up.'  when you push down on it at the wrist with 2 fingers, it's strong and won't budge.

same or different arm, raise it, but this time say to themselves 'i should keep my arm up'.  then, push down on their wrist with 2 fingers.  usually, there is no resistance at all, and the arm goes down immediately.

just that one word 'should' and the connotations behind it strip us of our power.  the mind is indeed mightier than the body.   this can be used with all sorts of words, like 'can't', 'i wish i could hold my arm up', etc.  the messages we tell ourselves make all the difference.

when i was working with cons, i really blew their minds with this exercise.  these guys were all pumped up, working out every day, and they couldn't believe that as much as they wanted to, as much as they believed they were strong enough to resist a 'girl', their arms would go down with no effort on my part at all.  this has only failed one time, and after the demonstration didn't work, the woman admitted that she had continued to say 'i can keep my arm up' to herself.  we did it again, and she was convinced.

so, mind over matter, over brain, over brainwashing, over erroneous thought processes that we were taught when we were too young to dodge them or shove them aside.  as we keep finding our own true voice of encouragement, support, and love, we will make more progress.  you are doing so good wife2.  as are you, candid and blueberry.  we can do this.  little steps, they all count.

and, se7, you were posting while i was writing.  i've had the same experience as you.  when i lived by myself, the food i made was delicious to me, healthier than ever.  funny how that can change when another person comes into the picture. 

Quote from: SE7 on May 04, 2017, 11:39:55 PM
my narc. parents were (and still are) health nuts to the absolute extreme. I was often deprived in high school and developed an eating disorder (compulsive overeating) in college. I have been known to swing from all-out junk food to health food because of this. 

I also learned that deprivation doesn't get me anywhere. I try to have SOMETHING around that makes me feel happy, even if it's just some chocolate.

I can relate to some of this. My parents, especially my M used to be a health nut, not any more though. It kind of backfired though, in my case. We weren't allowed all sorts of things so I ate sweet stuff on the sly, as a teenager. I developed quite a few strange and unhealthy eating habits, and there is of course 'healthy' junkfood, like raisins and honey etc, especially if you eat them/it by the handful/spoonful.   

Deprivation doesn't do me any good either.  On the other hand, having something around that makes me happy if it's edible is difficult for me at the moment. Sometimes perfume makes me happy, and if I'm in that kind of phase, it's good!

Today I feel longer and thinner. I'm not of course, no perceptible change really. It just shows me how messed up I am in regard to everything to do with eating and my body sense.

TRIGGER WARNING for people with eating disorders, possibly


15-25 years ago I was 'anorexic without significant weight loss', partly because if I went below a certain not-particularly-low weight, I got dizzy and couldn't function at all. Since at that time I was still active in normal life, being dizzy wasn't a good idea. So I thought and felt and even acted anorexic, but not really bad. I was just mostly really strict with myself, and of course I thought I was fat.

I know it can swing the other way, and it has in my case. I now eat too much, mostly, though sometimes I don't eat at all or drink water at all. I've lost the habit of being so strict with myself, and haven't yet managed to get back in a mindset where I can be a bit strict. That is probably partly because I haven't yet found a way to avoid setting my goals way too high. Something I notice in the area of physical fitness. I can't allow myself to just enjoy some form of exercise, there's usually some voice going on about losing weight or strengthening my muscles or taking the activity up once/twice a week, and then I get so exhausted that I can't. Or maybe I don't even want to.

FOO was always going on about me not being physically fit enough and not taking enough exercise, when I was growing up. And B1 who had way more say and input in the family than he deserved would mimic my body position or stance, and my parents were either not interested in encouraging me to do sport, or they'd tie it to food. You can have a cookie if you go for a run. OK, no cookie. So taking exercise doesn't exactly have good connotations in my life. I remember once M asked me if I wouldn't like to try out aerobics. I was about 12. I declined. She didn't ask why, but I remember. I thought I was too fat and unfit already.  :stars: I wasn't. But that's the state of mind FOO'd got me in already.

Looking back on it, when I wasn't in a major period of depression, I actually did take quite a lot of exercise, but it wasn't competitive sport. I was definitely better keeping going long distance rather than short speedy bursts. And I've just never been a super slim person, or angular. It wasn't till I was in therapy as a 30-odd year old that I was told that some women have rounded arms and others have angular arms, and it's just the way they are. Rounded arms doesn't mean they're fat. FOO used to even pinch me, even when I was in my late teens, early 20s, and say I was getting fatter, including once when I'd been away for a year, and came home. That was part of my welcome home.  I wasn't fat. I am now. But my body appearance bothers me far, far less than it did then. Partly because I realise that the way I feel in my body seems to have not much to do with the weight in numbers on the scale or the my clothing size.
With all these topics in the background, I'm not surprised that for the moment I'm not managing to stop my weight increasing.

**** Trigger warning: Bigoted attitudes about fat and food ****


My GC brother's wife is the type you describe. Nothing overtly said like *you're fat*, but every not-so-subtle indication that even chubbiness is to be fought against at every cost. I disagree with their message and their methods, but have always kept my mouth shut around them or their kids. They are the goldens. And I'm already on the outs - considering I've become fat.

I was very thin in high school and college, though I didn't work at it on purpose. I just was thin. Maybe even scrawny, now that I see pictures of those years. My father and stepmother fully expected me to put on the 'Freshman Fifteen'. When I didn't, Dad acted like that was a problem. The campus was hilly and I had been in the habit of walking everywhere anyway, so walking a mile to cross the full campus was no big deal. Walking the three miles out to the mall (because the dismal bus service never ran at convenient times) was just another way to kill an afternoon.

After college, during the poverty years, my relationship with food started to be strained. I was still very active, still walking everywhere, but money was very tight. And bad foods are cheaper than good foods. And choices had to be made.

** Now I have to also be brutally honest here. I was one of the ones making fun of our mother behind her back, just like Dad and my siblings. They all had comments about her weight. She was a little round at 30, chubby at 40, heavy at 50 and fat at 60. And, she had a thyroid condition diagnosed between 50 & 60. Now, her lifestyle was never one that was going to keep her in shape. Her diet plan stank. There was no plan, therefore every diet she tried, failed. My thyroid was diagnosed at 33 and the weight started climbing on board not long after. Suddenly, it occurred to me why I didn't hear the jokes about Mom's weight anymore (at 40). Because *I* was now as fat as Mom had been at 40! I was in the 'fat old lady' camp.  **

My husband and his children are overweight. If we're all honest, we're all morbidly obese. It's odd for me being the fattest in my FOO and the thinnest in my FOC (except for DS8). I know how I feel about weight comments from FOO. My stepkids feel them and feel the judgment even without a word from my relatives. I feel it, too, so I understand how judgment can happen without a word being spoken. It's the nervous cough from the GC brother when DSD or I request desert at a meal. It's the look down a nose at the soda I'm drinking, that can't see the beer below one's own nose. It's the raised eyebrow at the choice of food in the restaurant or in the fridge at home. It's a thousand silent communications shouting 'WHAT? ARE YOU SURE? WHAT ABOUT YOUR WEIGHT?'

So, I grew up surrounded by this 'ok to make fun of the fat kid' mentality in my family, never comfortable with that. Especially when it included one of our own (Mom). It's one of the few bigotries I can easily admit to - because it's still true to this day. People are judged by their weight in my FOO. And weight increases seem to be equated to IQ decreases by these active, thin people.

And my dealings with food are all wrapped up in self-image, defeating the IC voice that tells me I'm already fat and shouldn't have that <fill in blank>. It's shouting at me every time I go to the grocery store. And I know if I shop the way IC tells me to, my husband and sons will rise up in revolution. But, if I don't, I get a week of IC telling me why every purchase is wrong and I'm a bad person for allowing this junk in my house and to **** with what anyone else wants, you KNOW what is healthy and why not just buy it and tell them to eat or starve, their choice. Shoot, even Mom never tried that with me. True, when she was on a health kick, she'd just get a bunch of low calorie frozen dinners. Yes, I was already thin, but I liked the flavor of those meals, so often, dinner was just a selection from the freezer. There wasn't any bullying about that. I'm not about to bully myself or anyone else with enforced 'healthy or nothing' food choices.

OK, I'm going to stop writing now. My inner critic woke up and realized that I'm not going to listen about food, so IC is blasting me about my writing style. Nothing really bad. Just a habit I have that IC is trying to convince me to erase EVERYTHING I just wrote and re-write it better this time. Not to change a single idea, just to fit the 'perfect' format for everyone's reading enjoyment. IC is about to win. Later...

but, ic didn't win, and you let your post lie.  you did great, wife2!  hurray!  you go, girl!

wow, so many messages about food, eating, body size, what's right, what's wrong, what should or shouldn't be.   the newest thing is big butts.  those used to be laughed, ridiculed, but now, it's like the bigger the better.  implants and all that.  i saw a foto of a celebrity who i thought looked misshapen because of the size of her hips/butt, and the guys on the program were going on and on about how great she looked?  has someone added kool-aid to the water system?  i just don't get it.

i've been big, small, in between.  big right now,  working on not making it matter.  eat healthy, what's best for my body and how it reacts needs to be my focus.  screw the rest.  it's no wonder we struggle with body image so profoundly.  ugh!!!

gotta go back to packing!

Quote from: sanmagic7 on May 04, 2017, 11:49:25 PM
there's an exercise i learned, very simple, very powerful.  have someone raise an arm to shoulder height and say to themselves, 'i can keep my arm up.'  when you push down on it at the wrist with 2 fingers, it's strong and won't budge.

same or different arm, raise it, but this time say to themselves 'i should keep my arm up'.  then, push down on their wrist with 2 fingers.  usually, there is no resistance at all, and the arm goes down immediately.

just that one word 'should' and the connotations behind it strip us of our power.  the mind is indeed mightier than the body.   this can be used with all sorts of words, like 'can't', 'i wish i could hold my arm up', etc.  the messages we tell ourselves make all the difference.

hey sanmagic7, so glad you mentioned this arm thing ... it REALLY helped me notice the 'inner critic' problem I have, which is probably my absolute worst symptom from narc. abuse syndrome/CPTSD.

This prompted me to print out a list I have of cognitive distortions and I want to go over it and see what is broken in my psychology.

I've noticed that in the areas of health & finances, where I was abused the most psychologically, this is where I am most frozen right now. I am working on fixing & rebuilding my broken foundation so that I have a chance of moving through those areas. I am so tired of having goals related to health and career but not being able to complete because of this fractured foundation. Starts with my thoughts and emotions.

This may be going off on a tangent for this post topic, but it is related to the whole health/diet thing for sure (at least for me!) Thanks all :)

the mind is, indeed, mightier than the brain, the body, or the past.  we can do this.

SE7 - it might be in the right hand lane instead of the left hand lane, but it's still on the subject, at least to me.

Because, it was the thoughts behind my desire to gorge that caused the first post! I knew it was my thought process that was off. And, even catching it in action, I lost that battle. Yes, I won the later post or erase battle. But, you are so right! It's the thinking behind the action or non-action that bind us up and leave us feeling captive.

We can overcome it. Even though we sometimes feel like we've just been in a battle to work to overcome, still we can succeed. Then, the next time we hear that same IC foulness and lies, we can point back to that time we won. Hopefully, it'll help us win the next battle. Sometimes, it's no help at all.

My small victory for myself this weekend? I bought some flavored water and drank that alternating with the soda I love. My body LOVED it and wants more water. So, I may move to a 2/3 ration - three waters for every two sodas. Next step, 1/3 favoring water.

We can start re-writing the script. It may take a few edits or a few lost battles, but we CAN get there. I feel it! Even while my body is overly tired from too much sugar and starch. Even while my kidneys hurt from too much soda and coffee. We can, as long as we are still breathing, rewrite the critic part of our inner script. Change it's tone from belittling and nagging to encouraging and helpful. Change the words from insults to constructive criticism or better, wise words chosen to help us on our journey.

Right now, I can say that I'm taking every healthier choice as a victory. It's a small one, and accidental to boot, but I chose a sugar-free flavored creamer for my coffee. It's just as delicious as the sugar variety. So, future note to self- it's OK to buy the sugar free stuff. One less source of sugar. It matters. It's a change I can make permanent. Ha- take that, inner critic! I'm one step closer to my goal.

What is my goal? To place myself in charge of my inner life and to tell inner critic to take a hike. To be responsible for my own actions and inactions, not abdicate that responsibility to my abusers and their cruelties. To WIN by living for my own sake and my own reasons, not to please or appease or impress them. To do or say things because they are right and good and improve my life. To do or say them because they support my truth.

This is actually my hope for all of us. To move into a place of victory, where we learn who we are and what we are about, so we can live that reality with integrity and consistency.

What is my truth? That I abhor being lazy, even though that's how I've been living my life. That I miss the years when I was active and eating right, because of how good my body felt. That I want that good feeling back and that there is work to be done to get there. Work I can't keep putting off.

Just to show that I'm not all that, and certainly not a cookie, too - I asked DS to go for a walk with me the other night. 'No, thanks, Mom. But you have fun.' And, so, I just sat on the sofa instead. I let that gentle rejection derail my desire to go walking for my health.

To quote a 70's movie - 'We've got a long way to go and a short time to get there. We've got to do what they say can't be done.'

Today I wrote on a card which I keep on my table what I can do when the urge to eat unhealthy things comes. Things like: do EFT tapping, stamp my feet (helps ground me), smell nice scents.
So I put perfume on. :cheer: But when I went shopping, I went and bought some not too healthy things and ate half of them. (But not all!). I'm still smelling the perfume and that's good. Even though I ate which means strengthening the unhealthy route in my brain, I put perfume on as well  which means strengthening a healthy route .  :cheer:

#wife#2:
I was never overweight but I did not eat when I was being abused and I went to a place called Overeaters Anonymous which was for Anorexics and Bulimics too.  It didn't really fit my situation since once I got out of my abusive FOO, I ate normally.  It might be helpful to you.  The people I met there were very kind and supportive even though I felt the content of the texts did not apply to Me.. 
We all emotionally eat from time to time but when it becomes central to our health and lives is when it could be an addiction.
It is awesome that you are aware of the desire to eat when emotionally stressed.  I know that most of us when stressed would like to bury our heads in chocolate.:)  But I refrain because I know I won't be as fit and energetic if I eat it all the time.  I limit myself to a delicious chocolate dessert once every two weeks and I have a square of dark chocolate 75% every day as it is filled with magnesium and rich in A,C, and E(antioxidants). It also releases dopamine and oxytocin the feel good endorphins into the blood stream.
If you feel it is out of control I would check out OA.  They have an online site and even telephone meetings if there is no meeting in your area.

Thank you, alchemist. That is wise and caring information.

I was too thin in my youth, now I'm too fat. It seems food has been an issue more than I realized all my life.

The odd thing, that I'm going to have to look at, is how my brain 'drew back' and wanted to hide from your words. I literally had to force myself to read your whole post!

There is something going on in there that I definitely need to identify. Do I really ENJOY being this overweight, cravings-driven, lump sitting on my sofa at home? Is that who I've become? That kind words from a fellow traveler, with really good advice, should cause me to shrink and look away?

I've got some thinking to do......

wife2, i absolutely love your goals, your definition of victory in all this.  brilliant!

very interesting that it was difficult for you to read a post that suggests a positive action to take.  i have to admit, it doesn't sound like a bad idea.  since you don't have a t or other face to face support, an eating group may be a positive step for you.

if you decide to go to a meeting, when you're ready, of course, we'll all be waiting on the porch to welcome you back with hugs, eager to hear what kind of experience it was for you.  if you're not ready, or don't think it's what you want to do, i support you completely.  it sounds like this is getting to be an issue you're becoming ready to look at with more depth.  cheers to you, dear friend.  big hug!

wife#2 I only want to help everyone like Me.  The love and support that you will get in a group like that is wonderful.  It really helped me even though that wasn't my issue.  Yo will not be judged for your size. You will be welcomed. You seem like a good person and I hope you will let me know how you are doing regardless of whether you decide to go to a meeting. :hug:

Also, Wife#2 You are no less valuable because of your size.  The only reason I mentioned the group was for support and to get rid of an addiction-not to get skinny.  That isn't their goal. Their goal is to support one another in eating healthfully and ending self-destructive eating behavior as I recall it.
You are lovable just as oyou are wife#2 :hug:

Oh, Alchemist, I am so thankful and was not offended in the least. Really! That's why I need to examine why it was so hard to read your post. Not because I was insulted or felt bad about my body size. OK, I do feel some disappointment that I am the size I am, but it's not about that. It was about not wanting to be proactive, I think. I've struggled with that a lot in my entire life. Stepping up and being proactive for myself.

You are so sweet to suggest OA, and it's a real thing that I hadn't even thought about. Hubby and I have both discussed how age and weight have crept up on us. My town is big enough that we could go to separate meetings if we wanted, so that he could honestly discuss his issues and I could honestly discuss mine. I've been thinking about that since reading your post.

I was only saying that I want to investigate what inside my brain didn't want to read helpful, kind advice. Why did I resist that? I'm still not sure what's going on about that. I do want to get deeper into that before I try meetings. I believe that I'd not get out of them what I should if I'm resisting the proactive nature of meetings like OA.
:hug:  :hug: Please understand, I'm grateful for the suggestion AND for the kindness in your follow-up posts. My resistance is tapping something way deeper that I need to understand. That 'trigger' if you will, is a good one and I'm thankful even for that!  :hug:

Lots of Love Wife#2 :applause: :hug:

Quote from: sanmagic7 on April 30, 2017, 01:01:50 AM
the idea that when there's some discomfort that we can't identify, and we don't know how to self-soothe, we go for what we can grab for a 'quick-fix' to make that discomfort go away.  i'm familiar with this, cuz i do it, too.

I know this is an old thread, and I am thankful to Wife2 for this thread, as I've found things that people have said here to be very helpful.  I am just quoting you SanMagic - as this makes sense to me.

Hope  :)