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Important Days/Holidays => Having an Exceptionally Difficult Day => Topic started by: hereforhope on February 12, 2018, 08:54:56 PM

Title: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 12, 2018, 08:54:56 PM
Sorry that I've written about this before here. But I can't stop thinking about it. After I'd called the local psychiatry saying I've suicidal feelings I was scheduled to meet a doctor. I thought it was about medication but we ended up talking about my life for over an hour. While she said things that I've found helpful, she also said some things that simply scares the crap out of me. I try to say she's overconfident, wrong, but knowing she's an experienced doctor, mentioned having met lots of tragic patients, personality disordered people etc, makes me extremely scared she's right.

I said I think my father probably had symptoms of NPD and showed some of the worst symptoms, like hating mentally challenged, handicapped etc. I then talked about what I think is wrong with me (cptsd, anxiety etc), when she carefully asked "and how do you think you're similar to your father?" I knew she hinted she suspects I have NPD aswell. I was terrified but instead blurted out like a joke "well, I get very, very angry sometimes", which made her laugh loud.

I also mentioned feeling terrified there's something wrong with me that makes me unlovable, that it's my fault it seemed my parents were always ashamed of me, easily angry at me, etc. I remember my father saying how challenged people are "disgusting" and "deserves to die" (which I told the doctor), which I think made me terrified of being a person he'd think that about. I also talked about depersonalisation and the brain fog I've been struggling with for years. She said "well, you don't seem that struggling" (emphasis on "that", as if hinting she thinks I'm a little mentally handicapped or something)

During this meeting she laughed out loud a few times more. When I'm nervous I forget my feelings and starts trying to be funny.

I can't forget that "that" in that sentence though. I'm terrified she somehow knows there's something wrong with me, that I'll never be capable in life, etc... My mother have said she used to "cry all the time" because of how bad my memory was as a child (said to me when I was explaining how scared I am of these things).
Or could it be she thinks I've NPD and wanted to poke at a "grandiose self" or something?

If there's something wrong with me like that I don't think I can ever accept myself. That's why this caused so much anxiety for me.

Sorry that this is long. If someone reads it, know that I really appreciate it. Thank you.  :hug:
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Elphanigh on February 12, 2018, 09:33:08 PM
Hereforhope, can I send along some warm gentle hugs?  :hug:

I am sorry that she treated things like that. She seems a bit flamboyant to me which is odd in a psychiatrist. No matter what it is that you end up disgnosised with you are important and lovable, I promise. I understand worrying that you will be like your dad, it is the same way I was and am scared to be like my mom. You are worried, and constantly a kind compassionate person here you are definitely not disgusting. I promise.

I wish I had better words, but there is no need to be sorry. I am glad you could post about this in here  :hug:

 
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Rainagain on February 13, 2018, 12:55:31 AM
Hi hereforhope,

Can I just suggest that the psych may not have been thinking the way you worry she might have been?

Its hard to take in what is going on during a psych assessment, I've had a few and it tends to wear out my concentration in a matter of minutes.

Also, we don't know what the questions are trying to uncover or what line of thought the psych is pursuing.

My impression is that you are tying yourself in knots trying to second guess. I do the same thing, its not helpful and often wrong but I can't help myself.

Just keep a less damaging possibility in mind as much as you can. Anxiety is always trying to run wild in my experience, I hope you manage to keep it to a level which doesn't upset you so much.

Best wishes
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Kizzie on February 13, 2018, 01:22:27 AM
Hereforhope - can you make another appt with her, share your fears and find out for certain?  I'm not pushing as I know you may not feel up to it, but just wanted to suggest this as it would likely help you to know one way or another what she was/is thinking. 
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 13, 2018, 10:47:49 AM
Thank you for your replies. I appreciate it.  :hug:

Rainagain - those are good tips. I'll keep this in mind. Thank you.

Kizzie - I'll consider it. If I can meet her without having to pay a lot, then I'm up for it. If it's true she suspected I'm NPD then that's very serious thing to suspect. Especially if she's worked with many patients before. As far as I know, people with NPD are usually pretty dishonest and struggle with introspection. I think I'm very honest in psych-meetings and I'm quite an introspective, inverted person.

I did catch myself doing some reaction seeking behavior. When she asked if I had a suicide plan, I described it in detail which I think made her uncomfortable, which I caught myself enjoying. She said "you don't scare me". I think it's more that I want to be believed and taken serious that I've really felt as bad as I say. It does look like reaction-seeking PD behavior.

If I'd guess I think I've some of the immaturity symptoms of BPD. I'm 27 but feel emotionally like a teenager.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Eyessoblue on February 13, 2018, 11:39:32 AM
Hi hereforhope, I feel I can really relate to what youíre saying, when I went for my psychiatric assessment, I kept on making light of everything and turning everything into a joke itís always been my way of dealing with things but have since realised itís not helpful to be like that. Iím off to my counselling session soon and my discussion with her today is going to be does she think Iím completely mad, do I have bpd and does she see other people as crazy as me. I feel like I need this validating as I feel Iím soooo different to everyone else and I struggle to fit in due to my disasociating all the time and being permanently on guard for everything. Thereís nothing wrong with you and there probably isnít with me either (I still need to ask the question though) itís just the horrible affects of cptsd, Iím convinced that no one loves me and friends only put up with me, I hate this feeling but unfortunately itís just the way it is.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 13, 2018, 12:25:48 PM
Ditto that. I also feel I'm can't relate to others, that I'm completely weird, etc. For as long as I can remember I've been convinced I'm unlovable and disgusting. I've no friends and never sought intimicy in any shape or form. I'm absolutely disgusted by myself and can't imagine being in a sexual relationship with anyone. I guess that makes me kind of strange to most adults.

Hope your meeting goes well. I'm sure you know we must fight against these feelings. I think we might be a little bit different from others in some ways though because of our experiences, but our anxiety completely snowballs that and turns it into a disaster.

However I'm pretty sure I'm objectively not a very lovable person though. I'm a complete failure as what society expects of a man.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: ah on February 13, 2018, 10:07:47 PM
Well, unfortunately for me I've got far too much experience recognizing people who are narcissistic and nothing you've written here ever seemed that way to me. On the contrary.

Psychiatrists scare me because they have so much power and they aren't as omniscient as some of them seem to think :blink: and feeling powerless is very triggering for me, so talking to one of them is a sure way to feel out of balance, make silly jokes to hide behind, feel threatened even if they're not being threatening on purpose. It definitely snowballs into odd conversations, and knowing I'm being evaluated doesn't help... oh boy can I relate.
Plus she sounds like she could, how shall I put this nicely? Like she could improve her skills.  :bigwink:

I'm not a very lovable person either, society wise. I have my own quirky interests, I'm very introverted, mute when I feel threatened, silent the rest of the time.
A society of people with cptsd would treat us differently, maybe? It wouldn't look at the wound, it would ask "What caused that? What happened? That looks so painful!" and recognize that we're in pain because of painful conditions.

Eyessoblue,
I echo everything hereforhope said.
I hope it goes well and I agree. I feel the same.
On the one hand I now am beginning to understand thanks to OOTS and to all the books on trauma I've been gobbling up that I'm not crazy, this is the natural result of the things I go through. These are the horrible effects of abuse and neglect.
But at the same time, my lifelong conviction that I'm unbearable, unlovable, disgusting, evil... is there too.
I don't know, maybe it's become slightly more ridiculous, sometimes I can almost make fun of it (I try to look it straight in the eye and laugh at it) or say to it "Waaait... I know you're lying to me." for a fraction of a second. Here and there. Then it attacks at full force again and I'm lost.

But I think it really is lying to you too. We're not crazy, we're not disgusting, we're not unlovable.
Well, you're not  :doh: :bigwink: :stars: I need a lot of extra work on myself to be able to think I may not be either  :Idunno: :whistling:
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: sanmagic7 on February 14, 2018, 02:45:13 PM
the npd's that i've known would never worry about being npd.  they've always thought/believed that other people have the problems, they're very manipulative, cunning, believe they're better than everyone else, and lie thru their teeth.  does that sound like you, hfh?   i don't think so for a minute.

i don't like at all that she said she didn't think you were struggling 'that' much.  how would she know?  sounds like minimalization and invalidation to me. 

i agree that too often shrinks believe they know it all, and try to tell you how you're feeling and why.  they're just shooting arrows in the dark.  you've posted about this to people who know a lot about npd,  who have had a lot of experience with it on a personal level.  even tho i'm a therapist, i knew nothing about it (except that it existed) until i began my own recovery. 

clinicians usually don't see very much npd because those who suffer from it rarely seek help for it.   we usually just don't come into contact with it, per se, and it's so well hidden and defended by npd's, we rarely see it for what it is. clinicians, including shrinks, don't often see it or recognize it because they've had so little experience with it.   altho my ex and d1 have been in therapy for decades, they've both either dismissed therapists, lied to them, or talked about different issues.  same with my sister and former t.  it's always someone else's fault.

i believe your issues are valid and are symptoms of your c-ptsd, your traumatization, your history, and your experience.  i'm very sorry you're in so much pain right now that you have a plan ready, and i hope the responses you've gotten here have afforded some kind of hope and truth to you that you are not horrible or unlovable as a person.  just wounded.

this is one place where i've been helped time and time again to tend to my wounds, to experience kindness and caring in ways i've never known, and to be validated and valued.  may i extend the same to you.  safe caring gentle hug to you, hfh.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 16, 2018, 02:36:55 AM
Thank you Sanmagic. It means a lot to hear from you.

I worry about different diagnoses a lot and easily get anxious about such things.

I didn't write it very clearly but what the doctor talked about was me having some kind of brain defect, intellectual problem etc. I'd just described how all my life I'd been terrified of having a problem like that which I think comes from my father clearly hating people with those struggles. My mother have also treated me as if I'm stupid, everything I think is wrong. She said she used to cry all the time when I was a child because of how poor my memory was, which was terrifying to hear and I can't stop worrying about that. I have a learning disability, dyscalculia, which I felt both parents were very ashamed of. I had to take an IQ test at 12 to figure that out and was called gifted by the testers. I actually think taking that test caused me some trauma because of how awful my anxiety was then I took it.

I'm very sure I've depersonalisation and had thick brain fog since late teens. I often feel like I simply can't think, thoughts are standing still all the time. I try to use that test to tell myself I'm fine and it's all just symptoms of anxiety, but now and then I feel pure terror about being born with some disorder.

I told my doctor all this and at that time said I felt I would end my life if I had some disorder (since that's what my father said such people deserve). She said "well, you don't seem THAT struggling"- struggling meaning as if having a brain defect. So it sounded like she thinks I have something wrong with me. So now I obsess about that. I've absolutely no self preservation and if I'm convinced I can't make a future worth to live I think I could make a final choice. I think it was very unnecessary to say that of her when it's LITERALLY a life and death question for me. It's NOT because I agree with my father at all (his view on life seems like nazism), it's that I don't have much fight in me, and if I found out something about me that I knew will always lower my quality of life I probably would end my life.

I'm NOT promoting this for others at all! This is my very personal, and I realise, extremely weak and cowardly choice- I admire people who fight for a better life.

 
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Kizzie on February 16, 2018, 05:22:10 PM
Hereforhope - Your parents' views are not how healthy people think/feel, it's how two people with whatever problems they had saw things and they foisted it on you.  Maybe it's time to talk to someone who will show you another way  and listen with compassion and caring?  It could help you to regain more will to fight.  I like these two organizations because of their names -- I feel like you would connect with just that kind of someone if you were to call, a friendly soul who believes your life does count and will share another perspective with you that may help. 


I hope you'll consider calling  :hug:
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: ah on February 17, 2018, 07:42:12 PM
Hereforhope - Your parents' views are not how healthy people think/feel, it's how two people with whatever problems they had saw things and they foisted it on you. 

 :yeahthat:

I'm so sorry your parents treated you this way. It's painful to imagine from a distance, so I can't imagine what it was like for you to get the weight of all these ideas and views and to have to make sense of what they're telling you.

I think your parents' views say very little about who you are, and a lot about them.
From the depths of my heart, having lived with similar parents, I feel it isn't an indication of your own weakness, it's their weakness and limitation that shows right through.

The way you write here seems to me so crisp and clear, smart, coherent, and in undeserved pain.
I see the same pain in me and I know how deep it goes, but it's not your fault... it's never been your fault.

Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 17, 2018, 07:56:43 PM
Thanks Kizzie, but I don't feel very trusting of people and think my only option now is trying to get better on my own. I'm think that this "narcissistic elitistic" way of viewing people is pretty common, whether someone admits to themselves or not. I wouldn't be surprised one second if the person meant to help me actually tries to (sub-consciously) make me worse. Life for all species on earth is a genetic competition. Evidence of this is when (most likely completely normal) people in crowds starts shouting at suicide-jumpers to jump, which is very common and one of the main reasons cops always tries to dissolve crowds. I'm quite convinced this instinct of "elimination of the struggling" is deeply ingrained in us- including someone working with helping the struggling. We with mental health issues should be extremely careful when connecting with people.

If my therapist tried to suicide-goad me I wouldn't be surprised or complain. Sorry if I sound salty. I think emotionally I'm giving up on humanity.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Rainagain on February 17, 2018, 09:32:21 PM
Wow,

You have made me think hereforhope.

I have a similar opinion to yours but keep hoping I'm wrong.

The way you describe it makes me realise there could very well be an unconscious biological imperative in 'elimination of the struggling'.

In nature animals try not to show illness (such as lameness) as predators cue in on anything that indicates catchable prey.

If an animal is clearly unwell it puts the group at risk as it might draw predators. The group doesn't slow down for the injured, it gets left behind.

There is evidence of caring for the sick in humans all the way back to the stone age, (such as incapacitating injuries that have healed due to support from others) but that doesn't mean there isn't also a deep human instinct to protect the healthy over the sick.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: sanmagic7 on February 18, 2018, 09:47:07 PM
hfh, my own personal hope for humanity lies within this forum, and a very few select people outside of it.  i hear you.

i keep battling because of my d, my hub, and the good people here.  they are my crutches when i come up lame, my healers when i'm so sick and tired i don't think i can move another step.

survival of the fittest and all that aside, i still have something worthwhile to contribute, and i believe you do as well.  that's what makes our lives valid and valuable, no matter what the rest of humankind might think.

just your being here, posting, even when you're in pain, shows others that it can be done, that the battle is worth it.  our community here, our corner of the world, is worth fighting for to my mind.  we are talented and gifted people here, caring and compassionate, willing even when we don't always feel able.

this community may contain the hope for humankind, and you're part of it, you beautiful thing, you.  warm, loving hug to you, sweetie.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Kizzie on February 19, 2018, 12:59:41 AM
Based on the name you chose to use at OOTS, you seem to be saying you want to feel hope and are have come here to find some.  Myself I do think the responses have been kind and warm and that members are trying to reach out and help. IMO that alone is reason to feel a degree of hope for humanity. This doesn't seem to be the case for you though so perhaps you could post a bit more about what you are looking for and perhaps members will be able to share experiences/feelings/etc that do resonate with you.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 19, 2018, 02:31:50 AM
I'm very sorry. I struggle with controlling anger. I realise I'm wasting the freely given time and effort of people here. I promise that from now on I'll try my best to refrain from writing useless posts.

I definitely do not think like that about humanity and available help most of the time, but those thoughts often come when I get very, very angry, along with everything else I'm scared could be true. And every time it happen I can't, or just don't care, to remember when I didn't think like that. Saying that, I'm not excusing myself though, as I still let myself engage in an immature behavior. I need to grow up...

I've found a lot of hope here, but I realise I'm closed off to it, because I'm scared of caring about my life.

Sanmagic, Rainagain: thank you for your replies and very caring words. I'm sorry you also have these thoughts. When I calmed down I went to look for something positive about these questions, maybe some of these answers on Quora can give you something positive too? 

This question caught my eye with it's provocative tone. I think the first answer is very good. 
https://www.quora.com/Is-bullying-natural-selection-at-its-best
 
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: sanmagic7 on February 19, 2018, 11:43:35 AM
hfh, i think that today's world is scary in general now.  i remember back in the 50's, the whole cold war thing going on.  that was also a scary time on a global scale.  still, tho we lived under that umbrella of fear, we simply kept on keeping on.  it's one of the things we do as humans.

the link you posted talked about natural selection as compared to survival of the fittest, and put them in two different categories.  i get it.  whatever might be going on in our world, i have no control over it.  i can only look to my little corner of it and do the best i can.

that's why i care about my life.   

i don't think you have to apologize or put yourself down in any way about what you posted.  i didn't think your posting was useless.  it was honest, full of pain, and grasping for something to hang onto.  i do hope that you let us in, even a little.  we all struggle at times, with big and little worries, big and little fears, but they're all valid.  so are yours.  so are you, whether you want to believe that or not.

we're here for you if you'll let us.  sending a warm hug to you, if that's ok.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Blueberry on February 19, 2018, 04:33:48 PM
Thanks for the link hereforhope, it's an interesting discussion. And validating for me that people can see something 'wrong' with Darwinism, which was quoted a lot in FOO.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Kizzie on February 19, 2018, 07:14:43 PM
Tks for explaining more HFH. I think it will help members to know more about what you are struggling with (fear of being hopeful). It also helps that you know you need to risk feeling some hope to lift up out of the deep despair you are feeling. 

I also struggle with despair (daily now that Donald Trump got into office in the US), and have to work at looking at both the positive and negative sides of humanity.  Complex PTSD diminishes faith and trust in others, we have to learn/relearn it. Unfortunately that takes work on our part.  I wish we had not been dealt these cards but there it is.  The good news in my experience is that it does pay off and I hope the same will be true for you. 
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Kizzie on February 19, 2018, 07:50:33 PM
Here's an example of one of the things I do HFH, which is to actively look for evidence of the positive side of human beings.

I've been following a young Canadian woman facing brain cancer who started a campaign to inspire acts of kindness after she learned of her diagnosis.  It took off over the last year and a half as you can see from this site (see https://beccatoldmeto.ca/). Those who committed acts of kindness would tell others they had done so because "Becca Told Me To." 

Sadly Becca passed away this week, but she left behind such a wonderful, amazing legacy of hope and kindness that I find so inspiring (and in the context of this thread, reassuring).    Just wanted to share this.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 20, 2018, 08:37:51 AM
Thank you.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: ah on February 20, 2018, 07:10:14 PM
Hereforhope,

To me, nothing you've written here has ever been useless. I hope you don't refrain from writing when you're feeling anxious, it's exactly what these forums are here for.
But I think for me, another huge benefit I get from OOTS is learning about cptsd. I've started noticing in the past few months that when I'm overwhelmed by intense anger, I'm in an emotional flashback. Maybe you are too?

Do you have Pete Walker's list for EF management? It helps me when I catch myself feeling completely overwhelmed by anger:

http://www.pete-walker.com/13StepsManageFlashbacks.htm

It's anything but easy, and I'm so sorry you have to go through these waves of anxiety.  :no:
I get them too, you're not alone. Something triggers my fear and all of a sudden I'm burning on the inside and it takes superhuman powers to stop it.

And this is just my two cents, based on my personal experience:

My FOO loved social darwinism and kept confusing it with evolution. I don't think they had the faintest I idea what evolution actually meant, they just warped and twisted and used it for their own means.
Your mention that your F's views were Nazi rang very true and close to home for me. That's exactly what it felt like growing up in my FOO, and it left me with a deep confusion: I learned that Nazi views are "normal". But they're not. We know they're not, and we know social darwinism is... a bit flawed  :bigwink:

Also,
Maybe people get too much credit for being intentionally, purposefully mean and not enough for being, well... just plain selfish, blind and stupid. We're probably not as wise as we think, and not nearly as smart.
Plus, we behave very differently in a crowd, all it takes for violence to take place is just one violent charismatic person to be surrounded by confused people.

Then there are truly cruel, evil people. All of us here on OOTS have met some of those  :'(
But I know that for me, most of the people who cooperated with my abusers weren't cruel themselves, not at all. They go where they're led, never asking questions or rocking the boat. 

You have every right to feel angry. And, the one thing you have a right to most of all is to respect yourself and be kind to yourself. I know how hard it is to do, but you don't deserve any cruelty. You deserve friendliness and empathy.

You're not alone.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 21, 2018, 08:31:04 PM
Thank you for your reply, Ah. It meant a lot to read that your narc family had the same views on people, makes it easier to remind myself its a symptom of the narcissism. Also your words against such a view is something Ill remember for whenever I get despair and wonder if it could be true and I cant trust anyone.

I have Surviving to Thriving and printed out EF management. A lot of EF-feelings are what I deserve. I think Ive made my new contact at a clinic hate me.

If anyone want to hear me out, Id appreciate it very much.

On the first meeting I felt bitter about my past experiences in therapy, and ended saying I wouldnt be surprised if she abuses me. She seemed to think I was ridiculous. I said that I think its just human instincts to abuse the weak. She seemed very offended. Later I mentioned my fathers human views and talked about my fear and paranoia it was true, how I read answers about such questions online to get answers for myself. Now it seems like she thinks I like those views like a narc. I most likely expressed myself extremely clumsy. I met her again and I apologized for being angry last time and said I regretted it. She seemed convinced I view people in a hierarchy, and also "wonder where I am in it." I said, I think about such things because Im paranoid people actually think like that, in secret, and that love isnt true. She said we then had a misunderstanding, but I think she still thinks I get something out of it, like a narc.

Shes now decided Ill have a psych-evaluation, Im very worried about what shes written about me.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: Rainagain on February 22, 2018, 06:25:20 AM
Hey

Your T's attitude doesn't seem right to me.

Surely the setting is one of safe exploration of your feelings, it's not for them to get offended, they are meant to be working with you.

It sounds like they are responding to you as if you two are just having a conversation, its meant to have more value than that.

I would try not to worry about her opinion of you, she doesn't seem to understand what you've said and she doesn't sound professional.

Imagine a doctor hating a patient because they turn up with a broken leg, its just odd.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: sanmagic7 on February 22, 2018, 12:57:50 PM
i agree with rain, that meeting didn't feel right to me, either.  i don't like her attitude toward you at all.  she has no reason to be offended - you're a client expressing your feelings and opinions.  there should be nothing taken personally by a t - a t should be noticing your process, your perspective, and your perceptions as coming from a place of wounding. 

2 meetings is not enough time to get to know you and your 'tendencies', as in saying she thinks you're getting something out of this like a narc would.  how could she possibly come to such a conclusion in so short a time?  narcissism is very difficult to spot because it is covered up so skillfully by the true narcs.  not by those who have been abused by narcs.

i hope you get someone more in tune with trauma for your psych eval.  i can't tell you how sick i'm getting of hearing about incompetent (my opinion only) t's.  i know there are good ones out there, and i've heard of some on this forum who have been really helpful.  that t that you met didn't seem helpful to me at all.  warm hug full of caring and concern - i hope your eval goes more smoothly for you.

Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: ah on February 22, 2018, 05:11:56 PM
I agree too.

Sounds to me like you were far more brave and mature than she gave you credit for. You tried to talk openly (how else can she help you, unless you're sincere?) and she didn't reciprocate. If she can't handle her own feelings, she's not mature enough to help others.

Besides, if she takes your own feelings personally she's not fit to treat people in pain.
She can't expect you to come talk to her when you're totally composed, sure of what you're going through and what everything means to you. If we felt that way when we went asking for psych's help, they'd be out of a job. We go to them when we're hurting.

And she can be totally wrong. As San said, she doesn't know you. She doesn't sound too competent.

What's missing the most from your conversations with her, to my mind, is the question: "Why?"
Which might lead to the perfectly logical, normal, sensible reason why: because we were told these things over and over again, we grew up with them and lived with them, scared by them, by people we depended on.
As young kids we can't afford to say to ourselves "My parents are lying to me". We have to believe them to survive.

(My F thinks I'm a waste of oxygen, and I still believe him. Part of me knows with 100% that he lied but... well, I still believe him, I know he's a psychopath but I still believe him. It doesn't make you or me crazy or bad or weak, it just means we've been in battles we can't even remember anymore.)

I wish t's and psychiatrists learned to ask themselves "What is this fear in reaction to?"
I guess I think of it this way: we're all walking around with an allergic reaction, but instead of looking for the allergen many t's and psychiatrists focus on the reaction. I can't imagine an allergy specialist shaming a patient instead of treating the problem. And of course, the allergic reaction can escalate if the doctor only stands there looking curiously at the rash, tsk'ing and saying distractedly "Oh, what an interesting rash... how impressive." Well yes, but why is it there?

I can totally understand how talking to her left you feeling anxious. You were scared of being misjudged, being called a freak, and then she insensitively and bluntly gave you just that impression. Well, she sounds a bit clueless to me.

I think I might leave her and her suggestions behind, and look for someone better.
If she writes a letter about you, if necessary, can you get a second opinion from someone who knows more about trauma?
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 23, 2018, 02:23:29 AM
Thank you for the replies, it means a lot.

I'm not sure what to think. She does seem offended, but I also did behave badly during the 1st session- when I said I thought she'd be abusive I was being disrespectful. In any case, I think I'll refrain from bringing up these kinds of topics again as it just makes people uncomfortable.

Ah, thanks for telling me that. From what I've read, things we're taught, even terrible things, about ourselves or others, simply get stuck inside our minds. So like you, I have a constant shame for who I am.

And good idea about getting a second opinion, I'll consider that if she still seems upset.
Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: DecimalRocket on February 24, 2018, 11:01:28 AM
Hey hereforhope. Sorry if this is too long. I got rather . . . focused.

Many people here have already said the same thing to you, hereforhope. But I do believe you matter. And that you arenít some disgusting monster. Iíve felt that too ó for too much of a very long time since an age that was way too young to experience that level of self hatred.

Yes, there are certainly evil people in the world. Iím not denying that. But there are certainly good people too ó the news tend to enjoy oversensationizaling how bad the world is to get some views when for example, The United Nations Millenium Goals have been reached. Poverty has lowered, educational access has increased, gender equality is doing better in countries known for its discrimination and many others.

If youíre going to argue against it evolutionarily, then humans are both kind and cruel. Early research did point to human cruelty in their evolution but research has been updated. Research from Frans de Waal for example, have shown that apes have a ďcultureĒ. When they were trained to be more kind towards each other, many of them changed. They were different attitudes around different tribes along with different individuals. Natural instincts can be changed.

I usually deal with this fear by a site called Positive News ó where they show human kindness at its best and brightest. Sunny skyz is another alternative, with less grand scales of kindness, but everyday simple kindness.

I understand if that still doesnít seem comforting. I can read all kinds of things that would help, but when flashbacks are there, you often canít get the feeling of safety at all. It has to be repeated ó over and over again, without knowing if it will ever end.

I hear you have a fear of having some kind of mental disability hereforhope ó with dyscalculia. Iím familiar of it as a type of dyslexia thatís a math disability. I donít have that, but I do have Aspergerís syndrome. Not really obvious here since I understand people more when they tell their feelings directly with words, and I get the chance to be able to more deeply take my time to understand people ó unlike real life where you have to improvise as you go. But I do have it, and damn has it attracted bullies for much of my life.

Lots of people with some kind of disability tend to only emphasize their weaknesses. In the neurodiverse community, thereís this worrying trend going on where people only try to fix their problems in their life without trying to strengthen or notice whatís good.

But as research piles up, thereís this new trend that many of these disabilites have some form of strengths. ADHD people lack focus for example, but their lack of focus allows them to adapt to novel events and improvise in them can make that a strength. Aspies are seen as being too inflexible in their interests, but their obsessive focus on certain things is what allows them to understand certain areas of life very deeply. Dyslexia also tends to have research showing strengths. People with dyscalculia may lack the attention to detail for numbers, but that lack also means an ability to understand the bigger picture ideas so much better.

In a way, itís a new fight against discrimination ó like theyíve done with racism or LGBT hate. Different doesnít mean. And even if it was all weaknesses and no strengths, youíd still be valuable as a human being. Just as you are.

Take care, hereforhope. See you. :)







Title: Re: Struggling with anxiety
Post by: hereforhope on February 26, 2018, 12:14:49 PM
Thank you for the long reply. I appreciate it very much. You said a lot of interesting things, especially about apes having cultures.
I saved those websites.

I sometimes suspect I've asperger's too. It seems I often make people very angry and annoyed and can't really understand why. I can read faces well (did an online test) but can absolutely relate to many other symptoms of it. I suspect my extreme childishness could come from some of the asperger's-traits a long with arrested emotional development. I'm sick of being afraid of truths about myself and instead am trying to be brutally honest. It feels like I can think a bit clearer now about myself, and posting a bunch of angry messages on a forum full of struggling people who try to be optimistic, makes me not like myself very much (i'll refrain from using curse-words). I can also see that I've definitely acted-out in therapy so it makes sense for a therapist (who's probably unused at meeting people as weird as I) to get angry. I'm also selfish, a mix of immaturity and fear of people's life-stories.
I realise that my life is a wreck and only a complete transformation can fix it.

Thanks to everyone who posted.