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@arpy I know what you mean about worrying for the knock-on effect on the kids. Since I think my Ex's issues are to do with BPD, there's a good chance my daughter has the genetic precursors (overactiva amygdala) and I'm desperate that she doesn't develop the same coping mechanisms as her mum (reality distortion, projection of self-hatred, emotional abuse as a means of control) as it will destroy her life and relationships too.

Are you worried that either of the kids would model what he did? My FOO NPD stepmother (who I fortunately only saw for about a month each year) had a similar impact on her daughter, (my half-sister has a lot of the same behaviours), but her son (my half-brother) came out apparently unscathed. Similarly I have a friend whose sister was likely NPD but her child grew up without seeming to suffer from the same, so there's good news too.

I thought I'd come through unscathed, but finding my Ex managed to put me right back in it until I cracked.

Thanks, arpy1

It certainly resonates...

"If their significant others (spouses, siblings, children) attempt to assert their needs, this sort of narcissist is skilled at making such efforts out to be shameful, hurtful, and selfish."

...and that's the projected self-hatred I accepted into myself all the time until I had almost disappeared as a person... 

The weird thing was that I hadn't noticed that I was subjugating everything of myself to allow her identity to control everything. The impression I was somehow left with was that the reverse was true (of course). I'm really glad to have had some enduring hobbies and interests which I began to realise had totally gone from my life, and after the 20th time of asking for some space for those things in my life, it became clear that there was payback for me attempting to have a life of my own, or to expect support of my own identity. Of course as a parent, we needed to coordinate if I was to go out and do any of my outward-bound hobbies. Shockingly Ex was going out up to 6 nights a week with me looking after daughter, while any attempt for me doing something for myself one day a fortnight led to recriminations, blame, withdrawal, threats.

It took all that before it became clear to me what was going on! Suggests there's something wrong with me that I wasn't sensitive to it, to be honest. She somehow positioned herself as deserving of forgiveness and that criticising her was never acceptable, all the while that I couldn't take a breath without being blamed for something.

Taking a step back I wonder if there was a time when Ex just thought she could get away with anything at and I wouldn't even notice, simply because she had nothing but contempt for me and couldn't care less what I felt or did. Hence things got escalated until a point I really couldn't possibly accept it any more. I think at that point she wanted to tone things down and get back together - to fined the maximum-exploitation she could put me through without me leaving, but I'd got wise to her problems by that point.

I am looking forward to participating in the group but am a little concerned that it might simply be a forum where everybody says something like "well if you think you had it bad, my story is worse,"

For me it's the reverse. Hearing other people's stories on here makes me feel like a whinging minny given how easy my life is, really

My daughter is 3, and I've been very affected by a free book given to every parent in our nursery called "Their name is today". It underlines how this very moment means everything to a child, as they are negotiating who they are in these most valuable years. It sounds like taken this sentiment on board and made it central to your choices which is the very best you can do as a parent. The fact you have insight makes all the difference. Even if you have difficulties a child can be led to understand that it isn't their fault, and maybe even learn something from you modelling the skills of self-soothing which everyone needs in their life.

In my view the most destructive thing in my daughter's parental triangle is Ex's denial of her mental health issues and it's the thing I'm most worried about from consequences when daughter develops her own independence of mind, or possibly sides with me on some issue and becomes the target for her mum's projection and reality distortion. That's because I don't think mum will ever be able to acknowledge or mitigate what she does given denial that she has mental health issues has become so core to her identity, so daughter will get it full-force and have nowhere to turn.

It's certainly a cruel principle with CPTSD when it seems each generation passes on the trauma while they're struggling with the consequences of their own parents' choices and you have the chance to break the chain. You're on the right track! It's taken a whole load of effort and presence of mind to get to the point you're at and it sounds like you have exactly the right momentum.

"If you're going through *, don't stop"

[now I've sent the letter]

Thanks everyone for coming back to me. I really needed to share where I was.

I'm not sure I'm making a lot of progress, but at least I've scheduled some counselling sessions to get my Ex out of my head, thanks @boatsetsailrose. Also thanks to @DutchUncle for validating and @steamy for challenging.

Relative to some difficulties others have, the fact my life has flatlined is hard to see as any real drama. However, I'm really not used to having anything positive in my life or my future. I'm not that kind of person. Usually I'm super-busy moving towards a million things that I'm heavily motivated to do. For the past few weeks, my default setting is closer to self-sabotage - avoiding things which need doing, and not doing anything towards my own identity.

@boatsetsailrose sounds like you've had a difficult series of relationships. It's weird that the kind of loving and supportive relationship we want to have steers us towards damaged people. It can't just be bad luck. Eventually we're bound to meet another person who wants to be good to their partner too, but will we be attracted to them? Probably not. Perhaps all the good ones are already taken. Well done for seeing what was happening in your last relationship and having the strength to get out. 4 years is a long time and you must feel a lot towards them.

@steamy I could sense myself reacting negatively towards your post. Although I agree with you in general that we should focus on ourselves, and the Three C's advice is good and emphasises this, the point of view you shared is extremely close to the character of the original abuse, (though I'm sure this isn't intended). My Ex has been gaslighting me for years, seeking to project her self-hatred onto me ( http://outofthefog.net/CommonBehaviors/Gaslighting.html ) .

Her approach to reality is to censor, edit and entirely fabricate as a means of making me believe that the abuse I have experienced is a merry-go-round of 'never happened', 'you deserved it', 'get over it', 'you did this to me!' and so on. I believe it's therefore really important at this stage that I don't focus on myself as that's where I've been for years.

Instead, I need to establish the reality of what has been done to me, the lies which have been forced into my heart about my alleged responsibility, and the actual character of the person who did it (it's hard for me not to feel love and positivity for my Ex even now, but I can't fall into the trap of thinking she's a nice person any more - if I am open to my Ex meaning well, she twists my own self-image into being a terrible villain to explain why she is behaving this way).

In normal relationships this isn't a problem, because someone can behave a certain way and you both have at least some kind of ground truth to rely upon as to what was said and done to get through it. Equally, the other person is likely to be inclined towards resolving the situation. You can therefore both come to terms with things and move onwards, however, in our case reality is endlessly distorted and the other person's contributions systematically create conflict and problems because she is not motivated by trying to have a good life. The opposite is true.

A long-running example illustrates this...

Ex says I want to have daughter tonight because Ex reports she is feeling intensely emotional and needs our 3-year-old's presence as a support [seems pretty crazy to begin with, and typical BPD]
I say, OK, but when will I see her again
Ex refuses that this is a valid question because she self-reports as being in such an emotional state that I should not be thinking of myself
I say can I look at the calendar (I was trying to recall which days I was meant to have her in our regular calendar [chosen up by Ex], and come to a negotiated agreement of how many more nights daughter would be with Ex)
Ex tells me I am being controlling because I want to call her back in 10 minutes then puts the phone down on me

I call back Ex (who is sobbing) 3 minutes later to say she can have daughter in principle but...[ex says "thanks fine" and puts phone down]

I leave it 10 minutes then call back Ex to continue to say I wanted reassurance that daughter wouldn't be affected by Ex's emotional turmoil if I give up my parental time to her
Ex releases a torrent of abuse within which she then denies being in emotional turmoil (even though that's why she originally called) and that I'm making it up. She threatens to get a solicitor and take my daughter away from me 'if I talk to Ex like that'. She asserts that she is only upset because of my controlling behaviour, and finally puts the phone down on me

Ex refuses to take daughter (as originally requested) regardless of me making plans for daughter to be with Ex. [Ex recalls this later that same week as me refusing her parental time with her daughter]

Given her repeated threats I visit a solicitor and they advise for me to write a letter clarifying our shared care arrangement (shared care has been mutual and voluntary until now), the clarification includes an indication that a holiday of up to 2 weeks would be agreed as standard. It made no threat of court, simply a statement of our care arrangement, and a request for her to cease her abusive language and threats.

Ex has a panic attack on receiving the letter, and cannot believe I would do such a thing 'out of the blue'. She denies ever threatening to get a solicitor and take my daughter away from me. However, now I've sent the letter, she will take me to court and take my daughter away from me. [She also later says she didn't realise that a solicitor's letter was just a letter you have received advice about. However, it doesn't in any way change the blame I should feel for how she felt, and it doesn't change that her taking my daughter is still justified]

Ex announces to family, friends, the nursery that she is moving away with our daughter, citing that I had sent her a solicitor's letter out of the blue and she can't bear to live in the same town as me if I am doing things like that.

I finally meet with Ex (who seems at this point to be using this whole thing as a way of reversing my Non Contact) and she says she will agree not to fabricate domestic abuse in court as long as I agree to 4 week holidays instead of 2 week holidays and not to share my stories of her behaviour with daughter's nursery [I was advised to give the nursery the heads-up by child protection because of her BPD so they could monitor on my behalf].

Throughout this, she can't believe that I'm not being friendly to her, as she's a lovely person, and that it's me that is mentally ill because I'm making claims of things which never happened. I actually need to go back to the audio recordings to confirm for my own sanity.


This is a clear sequence of events in which nothing was wrong, and then out of the starting gate we have a series of unnecessary escalations, denials and almost the total breakup of the family (me not having access to my daughter), just because Ex felt like causing a drama and every turn is flipped onto me as being my fault.

Now wind back to a situation when this was happening every minute of every day when we were living together, and where I was brainwashed enough to doubt myself, whilst sacrificing every moment of time and shred of self-respect to try and fit with her agenda out of love. You'll understand @steamy why the suggestion that I should reflect more on the contribution I made to our relationship difficulties doesn't go down well.

I need to reflect on the choices I make, but accepting the blame is exactly where I'm getting out from.

I've been feeling really low the last few weeks, even though nothing has really changed and I thought I was coping.

Struggling with staying awake, I just want to lie down and sleep so much. The things which have been there for me as a foundation for years - the morning cup of tea, sexual activity, my personal projects - haven't any taste for me any more and I find it hard to justify doing anything for myself beyond buying takeaways. I don't recognise this person who is me. They've literally never been in my life before.

I was just reminded it was my 41st birthday by one of those automated emails you get from some nameless website you signed up to years ago and I just don't know how pathetic to feel. I'd completely forgotten it was my own birthday. When I read the email I wondered how they'd got my wrong birthday on file, until I had a cold dawning that they were right. Right now I'm wondering whether anyone will remember me before midnight. I'm starting to wonder whether there's a me, a person with ideas and wants which actually exists. I keep visualising the movement of a revolver to my head and thank my lucky stars we don't keep guns here. It would be too easy.

How did I get here?

I met a woman six years ago, who I now believe to have a personality disorder. My own way of relating must have made me blind to it, or even maybe somehow drawn to it. My parental history is of both step-parents exhibiting PD symptoms with my natural parents being enablers, and I guess it just felt right to absorb things and be the martyr like that.

When I met her I recognised she was struggling with her own feelings, but always just tried to be there for her. As time went on, and we had a child and moved into a house together, things became darker and what was previously turned in on herself (which I could support her through as an expression of my love for her), became turned outwards on me (where I was used as a perpetrator pawn in her machiavellian triangles).

She revelled in claiming she was being victimised by me, and blamed me for her dark thoughts about herself and threatened more escalation and blame whenever I tried to understand any details about her claims. This somehow healed her, putting her disorder outside herself where she didn't need to own it. It slowly crushed me as I tried to make sense of what I was supposed to have said or done to prompt her perception, and the rejection and vengeful acts which followed as retaliation. After some time I was lucky to earn a glance, or a word, and almost never a touch because of the negativity I was blamed for which somehow could never be specifically described. It felt like a daily torture, and 'walking on eggshells' isn't the half of it. Where others might have died inside, it felt like I had the strength of will and self-reliance to just know that I was doing everything possible, that I was a good person.

It was somehow inconceivable to me that she had an altered reality. Before all the reading I've now done, I think the nature of mental health issues was anathema to me, who prided myself on being a rational achiever. It was beyond my experience that a person would distort reality, self-sabotage and create problems, so I took all her concerns at face value, accepted them and jumped through hoops to resolve them. I spiralled into trying to do the right thing for a person who cannot perceive your true nature, and whose real reason for punishing you is to be a punisher.

Nevertheless I lived with the guilt and consequences of somehow being the villain for all those years. I slowly suppressed my contributions to our life choices which might serve what I wanted out of life, as I was trained to fear serious consequences from expressing anything which took the attention away from her.

The simplest statement of the problem has come down to 'how can I stop doing something which you never describe and which I don't think I'm doing in the first place'. There was no other way to make sense of what was happening, except that my partner had a personality disorder. Reading about BPD was a godsend, in which suddenly literally everything she did was in the playbook. I can't think of a single thing she does which isn't in the OOTF list.

Armed with that knowledge I became stronger. By this point, reading the literature about the evolution of abandonment/engulfment issues I was already anticipating that she would leave me, emasculate me by sleeping with others, then try to get me back. It was almost a relief when she moved out to sleep with other men, as it meant I could change the locks and start to rebuild myself. When she asked to come back I said no. After a period of me looking after our daughter, she was able to make a new home for herself and we now share her care.

The last 4 years since our daughter arrived have included extreme repeated trauma and threats of losing access to my daughter in order for my partner to dictate my behaviour, both during the first 2 years in a house together, and now since the breakup. Almost boiling-frog style, it's as if I didn't notice it happening. She made the most of the expectation that pregnancy and birth would make her the queen of all attention, and the privileged relationship with our daughter, allow her whims to control everything, and as a blanket unchallengable excuse for any amount of negative behaviour on her part. Somehow we never got back to normal after that, but I wonder whether it was ever normal in the first place.

Recently, she has been using our daughter and shared care routines to exact her difficulties, and I am permanently split between whether her denial of her clearly high-conflict behaviour is genuine, or if she is just consciously playing me like a cat with a mouse.

In one phone call, my ex demanded I give up contact days with my daughter, and because I wanted to know the details (e.g. when will I see my daughter, can I check the calendar and get back to you in 10 minutes), she started to rant with abuse and threatened to 'get a solicitor' and move with my daughter 6 hours away, I finally sent a solicitor's letter detailing that this was not acceptable behaviour within a shared care arrangement, expecting the worst by way of retaliation. Within days she was threatening to take me to court for alleged domestic abuse - a continuation of her distorted reality when we were together. Making that claim gives her free legal aid, and the fact she was under a doctor for her anxiety and panic attacks 18 months ago (which she of course blamed on me), apparently qualifies her to get this aid. She announced to my daughter's nursery and her housemates that she was leaving with my daughter within a few months. She kept telling me that the woman statistically will get the child, and that she wouldn't want our daughter to have to hear her (fabricated) stories of abuse.

I held firm, and made clear that I would bring her mental health record into the court if she followed that route, she seems to have backed down. She's now talking about arriving at a mediated solution in which we would share care in our home town just as I was hoping. However, the subtle abuse continues and I think it's finally worn me down.

I wonder whether other deadlines like finding a school for our daughter in Sept 2016 (where she will inevitably go and live with one or other of us) are lurking and making future life seem impossible. I recently got a job and she's been using that freely to manipulate things, cancelling nursery saying she will look after our daughter, then refusing to look after her unless I pay her, telling me that I have to give up my job because she's refusing to agree any suitable nursery to replace the one she cancelled.

During our relationship I ended up with streptococcal psoriasis and more recently was prescribed beta-blockers to cope with what felt like continual adrenaline all day waiting for the next phone call or text with an escalation or threat. I haven't taken the pills yet, but I'm glad they're there as a fallback if I really think I can't cope.

Even about a month ago, I was still experiencing quite intense panic attacks which felt like heart racing, rapid breathing, irritability all when anticipating further escalation (typically if I've had to put down a boundary on her behaviour). However, the last few weeks have been a real change of pace, like my body's finally giving up. I don't know if I can bear any more conflict, and I'm so tempted to just do whatever she wants the moment she says it, to make life livable.

Such a long intro, but it's meant a lot to get it off my chest!