Menu

Show posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Show posts Menu

Topics - Flutterbye

#1
As I've posted around the forum of late, I've been working hard on my social isolation, boundaries, building healthy human connections as the focus of my recovery for a while now. Including starting my own friendship group and beginning the very early stages of what may have potential to be some healthy new friendships. this weekend I felt strong enough to send my first friendly SMS in over six years! The last time I did this was to my exfb, way back when I had a bf (who dumped me!). I lost just about all my confidence with that relationship, how it went & how it ended, and the few new people I've had the courage to SMS since (after they'd given me their phone number), turned out to be not healthy friendships so they ended quite abruptly.

This went really well  ;D. It was quite nerve-wracking - I'd forgotten that I get nervous waiting for a reply to an SMS - and a mini roller-coaster of emotions. But overall it went well! I even managed to reply back with a 2nd SMS. I actually feel better for this, a bit more human. It seems like such a tiny action, such a normal thing that socially connected people do ten times a day I suppose but for me at this point in my life it's a huge achievement. Yay! It feels just a little bit like my social connectedness could one day improve in the future, be a more normal part of life.

thanks to all at OOTS for your support, humour and understanding about social isolation and my goals on this. You rock!
#2
I don't know how I used to spend my time before I had the internet at home. I'm finding that I'm almost compulsively checking my email and updates and this just happened and that just happened. A lot of the incoming information I find irritating, whether it's spammy advertising, something I've signed up for like pinterest (not imo actually interesting to me at all) or just getting the opposite kind of reply that I wanted (e.g. asked a 3d friend for a favour and get a 5,000 word essay reply that says in a very roundabout, ambiguous way 'no, I don't want to help you with that favour.') As far as online society goes, at various times, I participate on different support forums [just to clarify & avoid being cryptic, I'm not referring to OOTS, this OOTS forum is one of the few places I actually feel heard & understood, thank goodness  ;)], for example, such as a local mental health forum that has peer support and also trained mh moderator staff. it gets to the point where I can't remember why I joined, it's more like a kind of addiction. Like, I'm too scared to go onto for example facebook and share my thoughts or news there, so instead I share my news/thoughts on my local mental health forum because I'm pretty darn sure I'm doing something anxious/depressed & I'd rather keep it private/anonymous but I do want to share it somewhere because I'm pretty lonely & want to tell someone.

I guess it's nothing new that I'm very lonely. And there is no reason why participating in safe, online 'life' should not be a sensible way for me to have some kind of 'connection', or at least just pass the time (I have a lot of time on my hands, especially when I feel anxious). For some reason - the reason is my personality - I get very irritated by it all. I get online to try to find something soothing or neutral or maybe a little uplifting. and after a little research or trying to listen to a guided meditation, I generally find myself running back to my inbox & just feeling very irritated and annoyed once I'm there. As far as addictive behaviour goes, hey, it's better than drinking. But sometimes my reactions are so triggery I do want to drink!

I just can't recall how I used to cope with these feelings of anxiety & loneliness pre-internet, they are nothing new but I don't know how I used to pass the evenings - I had no pc, let alone internet for years & years living by myself.

I try the strategies of doing some alternative thing that is productive, like housework or craft or exercise if it's daytime. Thing is I have a lot of difficulty concentrating and focusing due to dissociation. I work really hard on my recovery, it's not like I'm passive & a victim about managing my dissociation and anxiety, I know what they are (can identify what I'm feelings & why I keep getting online) and I've put a lot of work into managing these 'symptoms' and a lot of work into my recovery every day.. but it's just so frustrating that after all this work I'm kinda still this awful, highly reactionary personality. I'm working (really hard!) on my social isolation, social skills & loneliness and I'm making some very small, slow progress with persistent work.. it just seems there is gazillions of hours to fill each day, I have all this time on my hands and as soon as loud noise outside or other trigger sets me off I get very anxious and go online.

If I don't like what I find in my inbox why do I keep checking it so often hoping to find some amazingly nice surprise there? If I don't like how I feel participating on my local mental health forum why do I keep returning to it like a moth to a flame, hoping I'm miraculously going to feel a different reaction than I've been feeling all this time? If I keep getting very irritated why do I keep going back for more? one thing I find highly irritating is condescending, unwarranted advice - I'm c-ptsd not a totally lazy idiot, they are different things!

I know back when I used to have 3d friends, yeas ago, I used to bug them with phone calls and text messages. I just wanted to talk. They got so fed up with it they would finally turn around and say, "You are so lonely, get a life." and cut me lose. So now that I've recently found the courage to try to make some 3d friends I think it's important for me to have some kind of ways of interacting elsewhere so I don't return to that behaviour, it's important to give people space & respect their boundaries (that's what I expect from people, I like to have my boundaries respected).

None of this really sounds very productive. I know the obvious solution is to simply get offline already Flutterbye. Stop going online!! It's hard to do. Just feel really frustrated.

Also, I really don't like that I'm such an irritable person, get so annoyed all the time. I think it's a classic ptsd symptom, not sure if it's also shared by most c-ptsd folk. in any case, it feels like this terrible dirty secret that I'm irritable, short-tempered. why am I the only one getting so annoyed and irate about it all?
#3
One thing I value so highly about OOTS here is that I feel like I actually exist and people understand me, that the parental narcissistic abuse, tho largely psychological in nature, actually happened. I went to my 3d support group this week, it's for adult survivors of child abuse. Whilst I respect the severity of all kinds of childhood trauma (s*xual violence, physical violence) and don't wish to minimise them, at times I feel that narcissistic abuse/emotional abuse isn't quite understood or acknowledged as childhood trauma, nor the long-term impacts which I often struggle with on a daily basis.

I shared an accomplishment - that I ended a risky 'friendship' recently because it was very triggery and I knew I was headed for another manipulative/abusive dynamic, that it was a positive step for me in my recovery as I was able to actually end it and in its early stages, breaking my dysfunctional pattern.

My peer, whilst I'm sure was well-meaning, suggested I'd done it all wrong..  sided with the 'friend' (who I'd merely described), their need for friendship & to fit in, that their aggression towards me was an indication of really important unmet need (pardon, how is that the point of my recovery?).. and that I should go back and rekindle the friendship, use negotiation skills to make it a good friendship and introduce my 'friend' to new people & help them to form other friendships so they weren't alone.

That's all pretty much the opposite of my recovery goals.

:'(  Urg. Like, apart from the fact that my peer's input was just seemingly off topic (I'd already ended the friendship, was sharing my accomplishment in breaking my dysfunctional pattern, not asking, 'should I or shouldn't I end the friendship?'), I found it intensely triggering & invalidating.

I've being having intense EF since, very frustrated & stressed. It's as if those few short words from my peer invalidated that I'm a survivor of psychological child abuse at all, that the abuse never happened, that I have no moral right to go nc with people as the most healthy choice. and so on. It reminds me of some really damaging therapy I unfortunately did when I'd managed to go nc with my Nmother & all my then therapist could say was that I should go back to her & make the relationship good, no support for my choice or the reasons behind it.

I feel so frustrated. My peer said they'd never had to end a friendship with someone & couldn't relate to my situation. So why say all that to me? Why undermine my healthy choices that are right for me? I know it can be very tempting to share my 2c worth in supports groups but this input is just feeling terribly invalidating. I feel like yelling, 'don't you understand emotional abuse is serious?' I'd never share this accomplishment in any old social context, felt it was ok to be vulnerable in this 3d group given that it's for ca survivors but something went quite wrong.

Nothing really productive to say here OOTS folk, but I feel a bit better for telling you about this. Thank you for listening, it's nice to have a safe place.
#4
Well, I started a friendship group. I'm very isolated & friendless, so decided to do something about that! After lots of trial & error with trying to meet new people I felt strong enough to try starting my own group.

I am amazed that I've met some nice people. Harmless, pleasant people, I can just enjoy their company for a meal. And others who I really, really like & feel quite compatible with. I just can't wait to see them again!

So that's nice. What I'm struggling with is I feel I don't have much information to go on. Like, people have turned up more than once so I assume they like me well enough or at least like the group well enough. And some people I've reached out to & let them know I like them, they have let me know they are interested in pursuing a friendship with me (I think) & the feeling is mutual.

Thing is, I'm so excited and want to see them, am bursting with enthusiasm! But it feels one-sided. I don't want to be needy & demanding, scare people off. I'd love some more interest, reassurance, expressions of enthusiasm from the group members. It is organised online so there is plenty of room online to say things to each other, just little things like, 'Had a great time' and so on. There is a little of that but I usually need to initiate (I guess that's my job given that I run the group!). Trouble is I'm in another friendship group & there is all this online chatter about how awesome a time people have, it's very warm & enthusiastic. Maybe I see that as perfect & ideal & my group as inferior?

I'm trying to be reasonable rather than panicking into the conclusion that "nobody likes me!" & feel plagued with shame. I know there are good reasons for how my group is going so far...
- people are busy with employment, family, social plans & other friends; you can't be everyone's top priority
- it's a very small group that is quite new
- healthy friendships can take time to build trust & rapport, some people may need to meet me & the group a few times before they can relax
- not all personalities are bursting with enthusiasm that they express readily (like me!! I'm so anxious, even hyper-vigilant, but the upside to being a somewhat nervous personality is that if I like something I'm bursting with enthusiasm & encouragement & let people know!); some people are calm & steady and don't need to express how much they're  enjoying something
- it takes time, healthy friendships take time, repetition, lots of common interests to develop.

the above list is all guesswork!!! (as I'm most expereinced in dysfunctional/abusive relationships)

I would love to hear if anyone is managing to have a healthy friendship, working on these kinds of goals or figured out some realistic expectations about healthy friendships.  ;)
#5
I made a new 'friend', that's probably too strong a word. We've seen each other 3 times. I feel trampled, disrespected and walked all over by her, it's not good. I get profoundly disturbed, dissociated in her company and it triggered EF's that lasted days.

It didn't start well but instead of ending the association after the first meeting, I didn't listen to my instincts, went into fawn response, got real stressed & agreed to see her twice more. I was bending over backwards for her, waiting for her to be 40 minutes late, organising my entire weekend plans around her wishes & prioritising seeing her exactly when and where she wanted. I know, sounds crazy. Classic fawn response. On our last meeting I realised what was happening - we have nothing in common, she insulted me to my face (wow that helped clear things up quickly), I realised that of all the hours I'd spent listening to her probs she's never asked "How are you Flutterbye?" or asked me anything about what I'm doing or how my life is going. (This sounds absurd now I'm writing w the benefit of hindsight).

So I realised I didn't want to see her again. She wanted to see me 1-2 times/week. I felt no ill-feeling towards her, no grudges & wish her well, I just didn't want to pursue the friendship. I let her know that as politely as I could. I'm very isolated & friendless so almost entirely inexperienced at ending friendships but I thought I did quite a good job. I was very surprised by what happened. She replied she was shocked, upset and requested I call her (we've never spoken on the phone) to explain what's wrong. I thought I'd already explained that politely & don't have anything to add.

I'm not going to call but feel obliged to reply by email. I really don't know what to say, I tried to end the friendship gracefully & politely but it doesn't seem like she's accepted it. I don't want to be cruel by ignoring her request or by replying tactlessly. I also don't want to leave it unresolved & left open to us spending further time together. May sound mean-spirited, cynical or warped but I just feel her part in the friendship was so 'me me me' and insincere, no regard for my needs.. I don't know how serious her upset can really be? the time we spent together reminded me so strongly of being with my narcissistic mother I want to put it behind me & move on but feel guilty.

Has anyone had to end a friendship gracefully? any kind word or suggestions would be most welcome  ;)
#6
Dating; Marriage/Divorce; In-Laws / First date
March 09, 2016, 11:29:00 PM
Hello all, this is maybe my first post. Good to meet you  :bigwink: Read some fantastic older threads on dating, wonderful wisdom about awareness of self & boundaries which really cheered me up.

So I've done a tonne of work on myself & went thru a lot of quite painful learning last year, I kinda put myself thru a boot-camp of facing my social fears.. meeting new people, socialising & altho I wasn't looking to date, unexpectedly found myself on more than one date.. all whilst trying to develop my (previously non-existent) boundaries. Wow, that was hard, hard work!

Feeling a bit more grounded within myself this year & better able to manage my symptoms (not perfect of course but getting there). My boundaries are coming along. I now notice I'm able to enjoy the company of some new people I meet (have that nice feeling of, "I'd love to see you again soon!") and better able to feel the early warning signs of people I don't like & deal with it quite well (a big improvement on my old pattern of: meet mean person -> EF melt-down -> instant enmeshment in abusive/exploitative relationship with mean person & take months to even figure out that I'm doing that again).

I still spend most of my time alone but am slowly getting better at socialising.

This week I was at a 3d dinner and unexpectedly got asked on a date. I'm off on a date in a few days. I've done well, I chose a café I'm comfy in that I won't stress about & am interested to see if I enjoy his company, it's worth a try. But.. eek.. some fears & doubts are circling up in my head,

- I'm not sure if I like him. There is something cold & off-putting there (even tho I can be an icycle myself); as I'm super intuitive/imaginative/emotional I don't like very logical/rational interactions much. Then again I feel that around many men or for that matter many people. I could dismiss the whole thing in impatience & miss out on a really nice person.. why am I over-thinking it and why can't I just give myself a chance, it's only coffee!
or
-  more dangerously, in this situation I could quickly get lost in EF and enmesh myself deep into a totally dysfunctional relationship where my inner child passionately works to change him (i.e. change the parent). this is a really big, strong pattern for me! I don't like a cold/lonely/anxious man, I feel an infuriating, cold absence of any connection at all but I behave as if I'm desperately in love with him & love him.. sometimes I think the feeling driving this maybe there's a very strong connection of hatred & I don't know the difference between love & hate

I'm in my early 40's and am quite sensible these days. But when it comes to dates, platonic or romantic, it's just a really big deal before, during and after. My mind focuses on it a lot, anxiety & ruminating.. I've found there's only so much prep I can do & beyond that it doesn't positively influence how the actually event goes, it's just a case of 'jumping in the deep end'.. can any other c-ptsd folk relate?
#7
Hello fellow C-PSTD people, I'm really glad to have found this forum.
I'm new here at the forum and have been finding the OOTF and OOTS sites so helpful for a while & continue to, there's so much info there I keep coming back to.

I've accepted that I have C-PSTD and that it was caused by my abusive childhood; sometimes I call that 'chronic early life trauma' or 'developmental trauma', each term helped me to understand & eventually accept what happened to me that was not ok to a kid, what damage it did me then and what damage I am living with now in my early 40's.  I'm now able to identify what symptoms I'm experiencing when and am gradually developing my ability to manage them, mainly with mindfulness. I think that all took me about some years. Lots of hard work in therapy, psycho-education & self-help.

These days I'm focused on my quality of life, I've had to take an early retirement due to injuries, relational/emotional probs, difficulty concentrating & fatigue but in a way this is the best time in my life! I like researching neuroscience ideas about how to feel better; I put my energies into what I can do with my diet & lifestyle to help and especially like things that can help with neurogenesis. I'm no expert of course but those topics give me hope & inspiration at this point in my recovery. I started high intensity exercise a few months ago & finding it helpful. To my great surprise as I'm the least sporty person I know & until now had a strictly yoga-bliss-out kind of approach to life.

Sometimes I slip back into denial. One pit-fall for me is I compare myself to people who don't have C-PTSD. Warm personalities, terrific fitness & stamina or very goal-oriented/ambitious people at times can overwhelm me & make me feel like a failure as a human being. I have to remind myself I'm working with some difficult damage & am a work in progress. I'm sure I'll find lots of shared experiences here & feel less alone in my limitations. Look forward to being part of the forum.