Messages

[2Spirits]

Hi 2Spirits  and welcome. 

Thank you for your introduction, and thank you for having made the effort. Such a worthwhile contribution. 

I found an online community where I'm "normal", what a relief. I experienced quite a lot of blank looks, incomprehension and "just get over it, what's the big deal" when I tried to explain myself, so with most people I gave up explaining myself and withdrew.

Join the club, I so relate to having that feeling. The best news is: and you were and are normal to begin with.

When my son was born, 4 years ago, something opened up inside myself and many feelings that had also been in me before, but quieter and easier to suppress, came out: lots of shame, anxiety, panic and confusion. For my own sake, my family and to lighten the burden I would pass on to my son, I started therapy and it took several attempts to find a therapist who is really helpful.

What a confrontation that must have been. 
And what awesomeness of you having taken these steps. Bravo! 

That was definitely a hard time trying to make sense of myself while two therapists labeled me as resisting, uncooperative and hopeless case. It was hard to disbelieve them and walk away, but it saved me from further humiliation.

Alas, this is an experience many of us have had, and stories of it have been shared here. In my personal case, my TherapistMom has turned out to be my prime abuser, with her incessant message I was broken and needed therapy. This started in earnest when I was twelve, and has continued up to I went No Contact with her almost two years ago. It's been a relief, yet at the same time just the start of my recovery and a clear(er) vision on what really has gone on in my past and upbringing. 

So hi to you all, thank you for creating, sharing and maintaining this space for dignity and healing and for being who you are!

I hope wish and trust you'll find aid and support in your recovery here.

Welcome again,

Dutch Uncle.

[tyy]

Hi tyy and welcome. 

Just wanted to check this site out, it was recommended by my. therapist and i am trying to do things that are good for me. I think this could be helpful to me. I dont have alot of friends and limited support right now. It would be nice to learn some new techniques on how to shut off the condeming negative strangers in my head.

We sure hope and wish this site and community will be of aid to you in recovery and "doing things that are good for [you]". We are a diverse community and there are a lot of different techniques that may apply to you (and each of us) personally. There are no universal applicable techniques, though there are some that have been helpful for most of us.
Those are the ones you will see many topics on.    I can't name them on the top of my head right now.
On a small personal note, I find it encouraging your therapist has led you to this site. It must mean we are doing something right here.

You see im actually doing rally good things in my life right now but i am scared that im not good enough smart enough worthy and all that jazz. Its a dam struggle moving forward with all the crap in my head it appears tobe a veryangry person in there that i have little or no control over. Its definetly frustrating. Could use some help with techniques on calming the beast. Going to school after many years of giving up my dream and having trouble im going to be able to do it.i get overwhelmed by the stuff.  Anybodyfeeling mehere.

It's great that good things are happening in your life as well, and you are able to recognize your part and effort in it to get it that way.  and congrats.
Anger is an issue for many of us, and something that is being talked about here. Feel free to share. There's plenty of room to address that issue here, though I want to point out to you our Guidelines for All Members and Guests that are here to keep this a safe place for you and us. I will highlight the relevant part on anger to you here:

Dealing with Anger

Anger and frustration at your situation is to be expected at times, especially in the early stages of recovery.  However, anger and frustration expressed towards other members can be counter-productive.  [...]

and

Refrain from offensive language. Swearing is not permitted at OOTS because many of our members were traumatized by abuse which involved aggressive, threatening and/or demeaning language.  Please be considerate and use a symbol mash (e.g., %^&$) instead. A filter has been added to replace offensive words with an *. However, if a word slips by please report the post and it will be edited accordingly.

A good rant  now and then can be very cathartic though. 

Welcome again,

Dutch Uncle

[manalive]

Hi manalive  and welcome 

Quite a history you've had. 
I do want to commend you for having come so far in recovery already. Wow. My hat's of to you.

This caused me to be anxious from being anxious, if you know what I mean. 

I hope, wish and trust this site and community will be of aid on your continuing part of recovery and healing.
You're most welcome,

Dutch Uncle

Hi Elizabeth  and welcome. 

No, you're not alone. I hope you'll feel comfortable in this community.

If you are using your real name, you might want to change it for privacy reasons. We in fact encourage people to use an alias, though it's in the end up to you.

Welcome again,
Dutch Uncle.

[or severe dissociative symptoms.]

and I went. 

I mentioned something about this in another thread:

another process-server/bailiff ringed, and as I was walking down the stairs he was already pushing the envelope through the letter box. I nevertheless opened the door, and we actually had a talk, where I spilled my beans! Told him I was a victim of childhood abuse. He was genuinely interested, validated me for getting this far without (professional) psychological help, gave me tips on how at least avoid some costs like: "show up at least, even if you can't pay, tell the story, for at least you will be spared court costs."

I was summoned because I didn't pay my bills for my health-insurance. Which I don't, and which I can't. I've been asking for help a lot of times the last couple of years (since the FOG started lifting and I started struggling.) but I have received very little, and inadequate help. For example: when I went into treatment for my alcoholism (basically in order te get it under enough control so I could get psychological help for the underlying causes of my boozing'/numbing out with the help of alcohol), and I worked hard with the program I was enrolled in, I was 'let off' after four months and 'passed on' to the psychologists, I was told in the closing meeting by the women who had been my counselor: "Before I started this treatment with you I was of the opinion this treatment was not fit for your situation, mr. Uncle." "*!" was my gut reaction, "I've been had."
Something similar, though far less severe happened at the psychologists, where an anxiety disorder was ruled out fast, a SCID-II was offered, no PD detected yet I did score some 'points' below the thresholds. So I have developed 'fleas' and/or dysfunctional coping mechanisms as a result of the abuse inflicted on me. An example of that is that dissociation had been detected.

I stumbled on my SCID-II results today, and one of the (BPD) traits/fleas I have is:
9.   Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociative symptoms.
So working through this book is definitely a good choice in my path of recovery.
For clarity sake: I exhibit two of the eight 'traits', threshold for BPD is at least 4/8. Plus than some other criteria, but all that is completely off-topic.

Which is why I have joined the Book Club threads on dissociation.

In the run up to this court date, and in fact in the run up to my previous court-date that was averted at the last moment, I have experienced thoughts like: "I'll let this happen, and it's a cry for help of sorts." Way back in my mind, it might well actual dissociation. Another part of me crying for help as my other parts find it practically speaking impossible to cope, find a job, apply to social security or in any other form secure an income so I can pay my bills.

So this time I did let it come to court-day. Perhaps because this time it's my health-insurance that is suing me, and part of the problem I keep being stuck in this cPTSD/avoidant/procrastinating limbo is that the 'advertised' (mental-)health-care isn't materializing, no matter how hard I try to seek help as I realize something is awry in my daily functioning.

I was pretty calm that morning. I had a sense of returning or staying in reality. This all IS my reality, even though it sucks. But reality sucks at times. Better face it. Easier said that done!
Another experience I had in the days leading up to this was inspired/trigger by chapter 7 of the book:

One way to start communication is to find common ground i.e. it's likely that all parts want to get better. Usually all parts can agree with this goal even though they are not likely to agree on how to achieve it in the beginning.

and me and all my parts (a.k.a. "we" ) agreed this was a good step to make. What it would bring is a great unknown, but I need to find help, we can not do it without third parties who are willing and able to aid us.
Scary? You bet. For some parts at least, but other parts felt confident as well. This was also an opportunity to again say, and let it be seen, I do want help, seek help, have thought help, committed to help offered, and still am struggling and not functioning as should, and more-ever: as I can, as proven at (plenty of) times in the past.

So when it was my time to approach the bench (there was a whole bunch of people who had been summoned to 'pay up', some fought the charge, others didn't. It was quite interesting to be honest. I was very much "there", not dissociating at all. I think all my parts were there too.) I didn't 'fight' the charge, and when asked: "How come you didn't/don't pay?" I told my story. Short. Stated that I needed help, had no control or oversight over my finances, had sought help but never got adequate help despite my efforts (I did tell the example of the alcoholism-treatment dupe). etc.

Of course the judge couldn't judge on anything I had to bring to bear, she was there to judge about the financial claims. This was obvious from the start.
But she did gave me an address she thought that might offer me help, or otherwise they might be able to assist me, and she made a remark that somehow made me feel validated: "I'm sure the health-insurance wants you to get the help you need as well." Which in fact they don't care for that much. They're mostly in it for the money, or for somebody at their office would have put 1+1 together and think: "Hmmm, this guy goes into addiction-treatment, then to a psychologist, and after that he gets behind in his payments... something is still wrong there... We have to offer some more help... Clearly there is no 'division' at the office that looks into the history of a client when the bills are not getting payed...
But I digress.

So I went to these people the judge suggested. Wrong 'agency' (why am I not surprised?) but I was steadfast, and they were actually helpful. They let me 'get it of my chest', listened, and game me advice to visit some other 'social services'. Looked up the nearest office for me, opening hours (very irregular, presumably so they can offer help to anybody: working, schoolmoms (or schooldays ), night workers etc.) and it turned out first opportunity was yesterday afternoon.
I went.
Did my story again (third time in two days. It was getting easy ), insisted on help, got listened to again, taken seriously and they forwarded me (again) but this time not to 'another agency', but to another 'level' of the care they can provide, and they arranged all that FOR me, instead of me having to take the reigns again. Which clearly is part of the problem for me at the moment: it takes too much energy to keep on taking the reigns and art from scratch time and again.

So I should be called next week (two weeks tops) and then services will come to my aid, and they should be able to provide what I asked for literally: "I need somebody who can take me by the hand at times, and do the (legal)stuff, the paperwork, when I'm not capable. Somebody who can take stuff out of my hands, when I can't hold anymore in my hands when they are full already."

So fingers crossed for the times to come.

Court ruling is in 5 weeks, so that's 5 weeks respite. Ruling will be I have to pay, but lets hope (and trust) things will be in place to tackle that problem then.

For the past two days I have been sleeping much better. Less midnight breaks, and I have been sleeping in to 7:30 two days in a row. Wow.
I also have a lot less urge to booze.
These are all good signs I've done "the right thing".
The right thing for me. The right thing for us.

Thanks for having a place to share this. Having gone NC with practically all of my dysfunctional and unhelpful abusivet FOO, having lost a good chuck of my support system. Which basically means I only thought they would be part of my support system but it has turned out they aren't, so I stopped sharing my story with them.

Here's to help from outside. Both in cyberspace as well as 'on the ground'.

Awesome job, wife#2. 

Trust your gut you've nailed it. For what it's worth, it does makes sense from my perspective.

Wow. Very nice. 

Such lovely examples. Yay to your friends! And Yay to you too, as friends like that don't hang around with jerks. Honestly.

Good luck in your endeavor to figure out why you find it difficult to do the same thing.
Once you have the idea of: "Ah, that might be it." go out and do it. Baby steps. And practice crafts art, as we say in Dutchland.

and thanks for brightening up my day.

I did not use this opportunity to second-guess my own competencies or come away ready to quit.  I attribute this resiliency entirely to my cptsd recovery efforts.

Awesome. Well done and what a wonderful pay-off for your efforts.

all of the charm of a prison matron

Thank you all, and thanks for the birthday song!

Wow, has it really been another whole year of being out of the fog?!  Congrats and keep on recovering  Dutch 

Thank you for this. It made me realize how difficult it is to actually stay out of the FOG, to not be hoovered back in, not to drift again in the mist and to actually stay awake, keep my eyes open. Which is hard, as the longer I'm out of the FOG and thus the thinner it gets, the more painfully clear it all becomes.

By chance I discovered it was my 'coming out'-anniversary yesterday, but I'm so happy I picked the date as one to celebrate. The event that triggered my 'coming out' was bad, and worse was yet to come, I hadn't got a clue how life changing it would be.
A year ago I didn't really know what I would achieve by making that date a birthday for me here, but yesterday I felt real joy to have added another year, and genuine pleasure in celebrating it.

Here's to many years to come. 

Not just 'good enough' now, it always was. Even as it was hidden, the good was always there, like a shining star now coming into view for the first time. Some externals clouded the view, but you see it now, which also cuts the constant striving for visible achievement.

Thank you woodsgnome.
Cognitively I know this to be true. Emotionally I'm not there yet.
To feel I'm good now is already new to me.
I have hope I'll be able to extend that, in time, to feeling I have always been good enough.

It feels good now though.
Thanks again.

So I wrote down some parts of me that had been really helpful then, and connected them to Inner Critics.

still trying to sort all this out, so are you saying that the inner critic is/ was the driving force for those parts that were helpful?  this is confusing me.

No. Sorry to have caused confusion, yet I see your point.

I've had a good period a few years back, and have since 'relapsed' (for lack of a better word). I'm trying to identify the Inner Critics that 'caused' the relapse and/or played a role in the perpetuation of the relapse.
During the "good period" I was not listening to (or following) the Inner Critic (through conscious effort), and had connected with parts in me that managed to make the Inner Critic shut up. I must say, when all that happened (about four years ago, one year after initially the FOG start lifting for me) I had no knowledge of the concepts of Inner Critic, Boundaries, Inner Child, Narcissism etc.
So the terminology I use now are terms in hindsight. Yet I now see how much they apply.

In short the answer to your question "are you saying that the inner critic is/ was the driving force for those parts that were helpful?  " is:
No, on the contrary. Somehow I had the ability, strength and perseverance to counter the Inner Critic. And I was aware of these 'negative thoughts', as I describe above, and deliberately put an effort into focussing on the "Inner Strengths" arguments I posted.

In a sense I was rebelling against my Inner Critic, being an obnoxious adolescent. In a very healthy way, when dealing with toxic parents/Inner Critics.

I hope that clears it up a bit, but rereading it I'm not sure. 

[like]

... and possibly: who is this Critic? Which authority figure?

I have had periods in my life where things were going well. I remember a specific period, about 4 years ago, I was putting self-care first, above my studies. Somehow I felt doing that would benefit my ability to study later on.
This was in the end sabotaged by TherapistDramaMama, but lets forget about that.

So I wrote down some parts of me that had been really helpful then, and connected them to Inner Critics.

Perhaps this could be a useful tool for others as well.

Inner Strength				Inner Critic
- Eating and Cooking well. Food I like, yet taking into account nutrition as well. But primary: what would I like to eat today, not have to or mustn't.				- "you are not eating well enough, you'll die on this diet." Origin: Mom. "Are you eating well enough?" "Think of the poor starving kids in Africa!" "You're loosing weight." "You're gaining weight."  "I don't like what you cooked" (I did cook for my parents for a while) Other IC-"leading questions": Is it not too fat? Is it not too sugary? Is it from an organic farm? Is the meat OK? Is it not processed? Is it enough veggies?
- House Cleaner. Not everything has to be clean at all times, the same time, but as long as I clean most things once a week, it's fine.				- "That way there will always be dirty stuff somewhere!" An imprint of somebody else's Inner Child, namely my mom's who had a (s)mother who would pass with her finger on every surface out of sight to see if it was clean at my mom's appartment.
- Loving music, playing it regularly and finding more I like				- "This music isn't good enough." My father hated us children playing music. He hardly ever played music himself. I was forced to study music (the flute) and hated it. Later, in puberty, I had friends who where into music, but it had to be really complex/difficult. It took time to learn to appreciate it (for which I'm still thankful) but I have always been insecure. Until I went with one of these friends to the North Sea Jazz Festival, and we saw an unknown band that played out-of-sinc. Naturally I though this was part of the intricate-complex music (so I had to appreciate it, my IC said), when this friend burst out in laughter and said: "these guys are stoned, LOL! They miss every beat. This is ridiculous, LOL. I can't listen to this any longer." With a sigh of relief I left. Since then I'm less 'uptight'.

I will add some more, but I wasted too much time on getting this table stuff working, LOL.

It's my birthday again! 5 years since the FOG started lifting. Yay!

Cake to be had at my profile (assuming the pie of cake is visible to you too.)

I realized that my father's is pressuring me into a forced commitment with my 'mom'. (Discover your core commitments)

See also A tool I invented to manage my dissociation. To that last thread I made I want to add here:
One of the many therapeutic destructive psychobabble/spells she said to me over and over again was "Je doet het er maar steeds mee. (Dat is niet goed.)" Which translates roughly as "You always settle for how things are. That's not OK."
Well, there are plenty of moments in life where "settling for it" is fine and/or the only option. As the serenity prayer says:

Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
Courage to change the things I can,
And wisdom to know the difference.

I like that better.

In the same vain from the movie "On Golden Pond" (IIRC)
"Life is not about getting what you want,
but about wanting what you get."

And a Dutch song that I really love:
"Had je het al in de smiezen,
het leven draait niet om winnen, maar om verliezen
En wie dat het beste kan
die sterft straks als een gelukkig man
of vrouw
het leven gaat van AUW."

"Had you already figured it out?
Life is not about winning, but about loss.
And he who can lose well,
will die as a happy man
(or woman, life's OUCH!)