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Messages - keepfighting

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Hi, colourfulrain,

and welcome to OOTS!  :wave:

I am so sorry you are confronted with these terror nightmares. What a horrible, horrible dream you had last night.  :hug:

Alas, I cannot offer you any advice on how to deal with them, just wanted to let you know you are not alone.  :hug: I had one of those once and was terrified to go back to sleep. I dreamed there were two men at the footend of our bed and I wanted to scream and wake up my husband but could not use my arms (muscles wouldn't obey me) nor could I use my voice.  Completely terrifying. When I got control of my 'faculties' again, there was no one there and I realized it was a kind of a nightmare like I'd never had one before.

It must be horrible for you to have them increase in frequency.  :hug: Do you also suffer from insomnia?

I once read that these terror nightmares occur whenever the brain 'wakes up' and is already active while the rest of your body is still in sleep modus (only milliseconds in between but enough for your over active brain to make up a whole story). So needing to pee in the middle of the night or being too hot/cold sound like a likely the cause for this fenomenon - but I really don't have a clue if it's true or not. My one terror nightmare did indeed occur in the small hours of the night when I woke up because I needed to pee....

I do hope that these nightmares will stop for you soon. Nowadays, I sometimes still have the 'normal' nightmares and often find that I am working through something in the night for which there was no time during the day. Sometimes I even have dreams that feel good and empowering, like when I am reliving a frightening event of my childhood, grownup 'me' appears on the scene to protect and comfort the child 'me'.

Best wishes and I wish you pleasant dreams tonight. You deserve to have a peaceful night!  :zzz:

Frustrated? Set Backs? / Re: Do we have to forgive?
« on: March 15, 2015, 05:28:39 PM »
It's too bad that the majority of society would take the stance of "they are your PARENTS, you should be nice to them". "You will regret it when they die".

In all honesty, I'm not sure I would be devastated if they were gone. It sounds harsh, but right now I could take it or leave it.  A part of me would probably be relieved too.

I can relate - have been  confronted with these kind of statements and many other judgmental ones like that myself. Somehow, it's ok in 'society's eyes' to 'divorce' toxic friends and partners, but when it comes to toxic parents they judge you for sticking up for yourself.  :stars:

But how can you forgive a person who doesn't ask for forgiveness? How can you be expected to forgive someone who does not even have a concept of ever being wrong him/herself let alone owning up to it and trying to mend the hurt (s)he caused you?

I don't wish my Narents ill and I don't wish my them well, either. I just don't wish them to be a part of my life, that's all. --- And I don't even feel guilty about that. I deserve to concentrate on myself and my FOC and allow myself to heal and grow.

Frustrated? Set Backs? / Re: Storm Before the Calm?
« on: March 14, 2015, 01:27:34 PM »
You're right: Meeting another scapegoat is double edged: Glad you're no longer alone and sad that someone else was subjected to similar hurtful things like you had thrown on yourself. Yet I'm very glad that this is a safe place to actually discuss these things and get us out of our isolation.  :hug:

Weirdly, I had thought I already did recognize it since for the past 25 years I've had little or no contact with most of my family for those reasons. I've been racking my brain trying to figure out why it is suddenly rearing its ugly head again -- and my only thought is that it is part of what "real" healing is about. I just think I avoided for all these years as a survival mechanism but never looked at it very closely.

My guess as to why it's suddenly rearing it's ugly head again (based solely on my own experiences with my FOO and especially the Ns in it): Being the scapegoat doesn't end just because you're LC or even NC with your FOO. The toxic people of your FOO need a scapegoat to carry all the shame, blame, failures and shortcomings. They have assigned that role to you in early childhood and it's still yours, even after decades of LC and NC - probably only makes it easier to spin their tales. They've probably used you all those years only on this occasion you for some reason were made aware of it. I'm thinking someone didn't get enough attention lately and is trying to make an almighty fuss, throw tantrums and use triangulation or whatever else it takes to get the attention she feels she deserves... (for an N, positive or negative attention are equally welcome...). N's also often feel the need to put someone down, belittle them or make fun of them in order to boost their own egos - so maybe that thought also enters the mix somewhere???

I hope your t session went well. It's good to have someone fighting your corner who can also teach you a few good strategies to improve your self esteem and go from survicing to thriving! It's a long journey but you're not alone!  :hug:

Poor C. - passive aggressiveness at work can make your job almost impossible to bear; even more so when you're dealing with CPTSD.  :hug:

C., please believe me when I say: It's not you, it's her!!!

The EFs start for a reason when you are dealing with her and the reason is that they are trying to protect you from further (psychological) harm.

Last year, my h got a new supervisor at work due to a reorganization. Passive aggressive a$$hole of a man - drove even my very laid back and pleasant h to the brink of insanity within less than a month (many people quit because of this guy, some got a burnout --- he'd left a wreak of havoc in his wake yet no one dared to fire him). So h went on the net looking for strategies how to deal with passive aggressiveness in the workplace and tried different strategies (warning: Though they worked, none were 100% protection against being the target from time to time).

So please, go on the web and look for strategies how to deal with passive agressive behaviour in the workplace! You need to learn how to protect yourself from her attacks - that's much more effective than having to deal with the EFs in the aftermath of each attack.

Here's a link I found but there are many more that might fit your situation better:

Passive aggressiveness is a part of many PDs and it's furtile to try and analyze why someone behaves like that. Often, there is no logical reason - it's just part of who they are. But learning strategies how to avoid and/or deal with it effectively can be very beneficial not only in this case.

Best wishes!  :hug:

Frustrated? Set Backs? / Re: Do we have to forgive?
« on: March 13, 2015, 01:25:46 PM »
So my question is - I'm quite happy not having my parents in my life. I am ok with never talking to my family again.  Is it ok to do this?  Is it ok to not forgive?

Wholeheartedly: Yes, it's ok!

It's about you and what's best for you

I think it's important to do whatever it takes to get the feelings of 'bitterness' (for want of a better word; English is not my first language) or any other feelings that might be holding you back  from present or future progress - but I emphatically do not believe that absolving your f of his hurtful behaviour is in any way neccessary to your own recovery.

I was raised by Narents and like you, on some level I still wish I could make them see and understand the hurt they've put me through and the impact it had and has on my life. But alas, we're truly "children of the self absorbed" and there is no way of getting through to them. So the best option is to look ahead and take the best possible care of ourselves and allow ourselves to heal.

Forgive your f inasmuch as it's neccessary for your own sake - that's all you're responsible for IMO.

Frustrated? Set Backs? / Re: Storm Before the Calm?
« on: March 13, 2015, 11:18:41 AM »
Hi, lonewolf,

so sorry to meet another member of the (not so exclusive  :sadno:) club of scapegoats of a narcissistic family. The only good thing about having been assigned the role of scapegoat in such a toxic family system, is that the scapegoat is the most likely to reach out and get help for him/herself. So in a way, that makes 'us' (the scapegoats) the ones with the best mental health to come out of such a family system - which sounds counter intuitive because on the surface, it's often us who carry the most signs that something is wrong. But we are the ones capable of change and capable of learning how to be good and kind and nurturing towards ourselves as well as towards others.

My father is an overt narc, my mother a covert narc, one of my sisters a passive-agressive antisocial PD. I was the scapegoat, my brother the lost child, my other sis the co-dependant (married to an overt narc h to boot). It took literally years to figure out and absorb (....and be honest about it towards myself...) how toxic my family really was and how that affected me and my relationships with the FOO (family of Origin). For me, Medium Chill didn't work well enough so I had to go to LC (Low Contact) and eventually NC (No Contact) in order to protect myself and my kids from further (emotional) harm.

Like Cat suggested, go check out the Unchosen section of OOTF - there are so many helpful and compassionate people there to help you through a FOO crisis.  :thumbup:

I found a website with some good information about narc families on it:

It also contains some ideas of how to leave the dysfunctional family patterns behind.

Dear lonewolf, I don't know what else to say then let you know you're not alone.  :hug:

About the ring: I'd ignore the entire request. Whatever was behind it when she gave it to you years ago and whatever is behind her request to return it now: It's meant to hurt and belittle you and make you feel small and insignificant. Keep the ring, throw it away, sell it or return it: Whatever you want to do with it. It's yours and she does not have the power to demand it back.

Best wishes and  :hug: to you!

Family of Origin (FOO) / Re: Finding Me Without Losing The Rest
« on: March 12, 2015, 08:32:47 AM »
About the stomach aches:

That would put the IC at an age between 8 and 14. At that age, many children experience stomach aches that can be quite distressing and don't have a physical cause. They are usually centered around the navel and occur when the child is anxious or exhited. That's why they aches are so peculiar: They occur when strong emotions are involved that can't be properly regulated yet, but they occur equally strong when dealing with negative anxiety as with positive excitement. They usually disappear in early adolescence.

Maybe it helps to get your IC work started if you think about why the child you at that age might be trying to reach out to the adult you???

Family of Origin (FOO) / Re: Finding Me Without Losing The Rest
« on: March 12, 2015, 07:39:59 AM »
Hi, JDog,

it's great that you started to pay more attention to your IC. It sounds like she's been lonely for a long time and she deserves to know that she won't be powerless forever - that she'll grow into a beautiful and strong woman some day who can take care of her and herself.  :hug:

I understand why you're anxious that paying more atttention to your IC might affect your other relationships negatively. But consider this:

Learning to love your IC is adding a new kind of love to your life and the good thing about love is that loving one more person in your life doesn't diminish the love you feel for others. Love can grow and add up endlessly. That's the beauty of it.

I hope you'll find many ways to communicate with your IC as you go along. She deserves to find a mate!  :hug:

Recovery Journals / Re: Bheart's recovery journal
« on: March 11, 2015, 02:44:50 PM »
Maybe by the end of the year I will have the maturity of a grown up..... ;D

LOL  :rofl:

Good going! I'm glad your new t is working out so well for you.

Good luck with your EMDR.  :thumbup:

General Discussion / Re: "...sometimes it's shame"
« on: March 10, 2015, 02:57:16 PM »
This is a very good article, indeed. Thank you so much for posting, Coda!

Hi, lonewolf,

just wanted to let you know that you're not alone in experiencing this. Sending you a cyber hug in lieu of a puppy  :bighug:.

I had to read Walker's book in small portions because of the many EFs I had. Even now, rereading it, I take long breaks in between in which I exercise, go for a walk, read a non-triggering book - that kind of thing....

A bath, a healthy meal and some herbal tea sound very nice and comforting. It's great that you're taking such good care of yourself! One thought just occured to me: Those are all things to make a grownup feel comfortable. If your EFs have triggered your IC (Inner Child), then maybe something that would comfort the child you might be helpful to restore your sense of wellbeing in/after an EF: a cuddler, a bit of chocolate, something like that.... For me, if the IC  is 'activated' and disturbed by an EF, grownup strategies alone don't work well enough; I have to pay attention to my IC pain as well.

I hope your session with your T will help restore your sense of safety and wellbeing again.  :hug:

Podcasts, Videos & Documentaries / Re: Narcissistic abuse resources
« on: March 07, 2015, 03:46:55 PM »
This is about the Narcissistic Victim Syndrome:

Some very good posts on the website, IMO.

Introductory Post / Re: Glad to have found you!
« on: March 07, 2015, 02:46:41 PM »
Hello, JDog,

nice to meet you on the forum!  :wave:

I totally get how your codependency wasn't an issue until the death of you m: After I married, I moved to a different European country and that's when it gradually dawned on me how codependant I was.... (though I didn't learn the name for it until I started t a few years later...). Nothing like a major life event - like the death of your mother or me moving far away - to force you to take a fresh look in the mirror and re-asses your life and yourself. Codepency is not something you can just 'snap out of', but you can take several steps to change your life and be kinder to yourself and it sounds like you're already well on the road to recovery.  :thumbup: Your t sounds nice and validating.

I love how you've taken up running for yourself. I'm in awe at how much you have achieved for yourself - both in physical as in emotional wellbeing. Second marathon - wow!

I joined a gym and exercise there three to four times a week. It's just 'me' time (I'm nowhere as fit as you must be) - and sometimes I use it as a flight response to get me out of 'freeze'.

Anyway, glad you've found us and looking forward to your next posts!


Books & Articles / Re: A short but really good book!
« on: March 05, 2015, 02:06:59 PM »
What a lovely title!

Thanks for the tip, fairy, I'll certainly check it out.  :yes:


She has some good and clear ideas of how to orevent and minimize the negative effects of childhood trauma when/before it happens.

It was a bit triggering for me, since I am already facing some of the ill health effects of childhood trauma - some 'minor' chronic diseases like eczema and chronic sinusitis and my immune system seems to be the worst in my FOC (viruses never seem to pass me by and I always take longest to recover) - and there might be more in store that could be directly related to my childhood trauma. The hard facts that after having survived childhood trauma, there is also an ill effect on the lifelong health is something that always gets to me very deeply - doubly unfair!

That's why it's twice as important that we do all we can to break the cycle of abuse.

I am very glad that doctors like Nadine are on the case for this and future generations of children. It's important to pass on the message and make people aware of the health risks that come from childhood trauma.

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