I want Justice!!!! - Trigger Warning

Started by Desert Flower, October 07, 2024, 05:35:43 PM

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Desert Flower

[Apologies, this post is too long, it's a rant, but I needed to get this out.]

So I've been thinking about what it is in the file I found that got to me the most. It was the (part of the) e-mail conversation with my abuser. It pains me so much to think about it, let alone feel what it does to me. This conversation happened when all of it was long 'over' (none of it is over regrettably), when I was around thirty. And the abuse happened in my teens. I was a kid in my opinion. Some teens may almost be adults but I was nowhere near. And I had no skills to deal with the treatment I received at the time. I didn't have them for a long time after either.

As it turns out, at thirty, via e-mail, I dared confront him, possibly for the first time ever. The part of what I started the conversation with is lost, but I seem to remember I accused him of abusing me. And within a few sentences, he had turned the 'conversation' around 180 degrees. And he made it so that he was the victim, 'of what he endured in my home'. He is referring to the discriminatory remarks my mothers' partner at the time (who was abusing her as well) made about him. That I defended him against! He forgets to mention. Luckily, at thirty, I notice what is going on and I end the conversation.

There is never going to be any conversation possible with him. I do not believe he will ever change. It feels so silly even writing this. Of course he is never going to change! But there's still a big part of me that is looking for recognition, apologies even. Which he will never give of course.

Ten years later or so, he appeared in some reality show on TV. And he was showing off the institution, just around our block, that he was put into because his mother couldn't handle him (I now gather). And he was still the hugely popular guy, insulting everybody in a 'funny' way and everybody laughing with him, including his brother. It was awful to watch and insightful too. I could see, with some detachment, the way he operated. But no one else seemed to notice. Same as when the abuse was happening.

And what stings me so much, it makes my insides churn and I feel this part struggling so, is that he always made everything my fault. And I just didn't have the conversational skills or the self esteem (my m had effectively robbed me of that) to talk back to him. That is, If I had dared at all, but of course I never did. I couldn't ever win.

And why would I endure all this? All I can think was I was just so scared of losing him and being a loser then and then losing my place next to the most popular guy at school, which would reduce me to nothing, zero. So scared of what the rest would do to me. So scared of being cast out completely. I was so desperate to fit in, to be seen at all. And I had nothing to show for of myself, I seem to have thought. I needed him to be seen, it seems. So I endured the abuse is what I did.

And all I could do when I finally realised I needed to end the abuse was leave. Run away. Still afraid to stand up to him, I left. And it feels like losing still. I feel like a coward (although I'm now sure I saved myself then, things only would have gotten worse.)

And the part of me that is struggling now still craves the recognition, the apologies, it wants to win still. It wants to hear: You are right and he was wrong. Plain and simple. And if I cannot win in conversation, I want Justice by some institution now. And that will never happen either. Everything criminal is now time-barred and anyway, I would never be able to prove anything. He always made sure nothing he did was ever visible. Not even to me for a long time, as he had me thinking it was my fault for having somehow upset him. Everything was always my fault. And I want that reversed. I want proper Justice done. And if that won't happen (it won't) I'm afraid I'll always feel like a loser.

And it's such a long time ago and it hurts so much it's almost unbearable. I can still feel myself retreat, shrink and shrivel and trying to make myself smaller and smaller still, completely in a cramp saying sorry sorry sorry I will never do it again (whatever it was that I did 'wrong'). Disappearing. Not being there at all. Not feeling anything.

And yesterday I felt a Rage, a lust for Revenge, a Wrath that I haven't consciously felt for a long time. If I cannot have Justice the proper way, there is a part of me in here that wants to do it herself. I didn't know I had it in me. But I do apparently. There it is.

And another thing. It brings me to the question of why I had such little self esteem to begin with. Why I would think so low of myself that I thought I had to endure this to fit in somehow. Or for whatever reason. And that brings me to my m. And this gets really hard as well. If she hadn't completely ignored and invalidated my feelings, emotionally neglected me, I might have had a sense that I was okay to begin with. But I didn't. I was already used to hoping the person I loved might someday change and love me after all, because I had finally managed to be the perfect child. And she didn't love me. Not ever. I was in no position to give up on her as a little kid. I had no choice but to stay and find the faults with me. And I was a sitting duck for the girl (called 'friend') that bullied me for the next ten years, and him (called 'boyfriend') to abuse me for the next three-and-a-half years after that (I have a count of the number of times he had sex wit me without my consent - that's called rape). Because I had no self esteem.

And it's a wonder really, that somehow, at some point, I did have the sense to end it after all. To get out. Save myself. Through some of my college friends saying something empowering and maybe Oprah Winfrey I gained a sense that I did not deserve this.

(Unfortunately, this sense was not solid enough and I ended up in another toxic relationship in my thirties. But that's for another time.)

This was hard writing. Thank you to the ones who managed to read all of this.

I do not feel strange anymore about the way it has made me feel. It makes complete sense.

Chart

It makes complete sense to me too DF. It's called injustice. And when NO ONE ever stood up for us, then how could we know or think we were of any value or worth, to be treated with respect? It's simply impossible, no child can do it. We are born naked and no one clothed us. We grew and stood up but totally vulnerable, no defense, no sense of WHO we are. Our models could only think of theme. We were sent into the lion's den completely naïve.

And of course now we can see it. But looking back, I'm not that person anymore. Grieve for the suffering of that younger you, but make the difference in the here and now. And forgive who you used to be. It very simply wasn't her fault. "She" lives on in you, but "you" are no longer her.

Armee

That young you was so strong. So strong and so vulnerable. You are super insightful now about why that happened, how it ties in with the way you were treated by your mom. And ugh that sucks so much to look back and see it with clarity now that we couldn't see then. You really nailed it when you said

But I didn't. I was already used to hoping the person I loved might someday change and love me after all, because I had finally managed to be the perfect child. And she didn't love me. Not ever. I was in no position to give up on her as a little kid. I had no choice but to stay and find the faults with me.


Wow. This is so well said and so true and why this type of parental abuse is so damaging.

I'm sorry you had to watch him on reality TV. That must have been so hard, so triggering.

And all I've read says the murderous rage is very normal for that type of absue/assault.  :grouphug:

Desert Flower

I feel a lot better today. It's really good I got this out.

And I wanna thank you so much for sticking with me through this, Chart and Armee. I cannot tell you how much I appreciate it. Thank you.  :hug:  :hug:

Quote from: Chart on October 07, 2024, 07:31:06 PMmake the difference in the here and now. And forgive who you used to be. It very simply wasn't her fault. "She" lives on in you, but "you" are no longer her.
Yes, I will Chart. That's true.

Quote from: Armee on October 08, 2024, 04:14:09 AMAnd all I've read says the murderous rage is very normal for that type of absue/assault. 
Thank you for pointing that out Armee. I never read it but I believe it. Very helpful.
I'm so glad I found this Wrathful part. I knew she was in there but before, I couldn't find her. Makes me feel calmer to know her somehow.

 :grouphug:

Armee

I'm so glad you are feeling better. :grouphug:

Here's an excerpt from a great book that for some reason isn't mentioned often or ever. I stumbled on it after reading several books on sexual trauma and it's the best I've read. By Erin Carpenter, Life Reinvented.

It's in this stage that most survivors struggle with anger. A very justifiable anger is the result of the deep understanding of what we have lost at the hands of the perpetrator. Anger is pointing us toward our inherent goodness, and signaling that we truly did not deserve the abuse we experienced. In this way, anger can be healing. It's also difficult to experience anger, especially for women who are socialized to believe that they should not be angry but always warm, forgiving, and cooperative. It's tempting to try to 'do something' with our anger. Experiencing intense anger can feel very helpless if we can't lash out. I see this sense of helplessness manifest most often in revenge fantasies revolving around the perpetrator. It could be imagining hurting him or her or making their actions known publicly to try to humiliate them. It can take the form of a mirror image of the trauma itself, with the roles of perpetrator and victim reversed. I always try to normalize revenge fantasies of survivors. Often they feel embarrassed about them, or worried that their thoughts mean they will actually act on them. In the vast majority of cases, these thoughts are just thoughts, and they are healthy to the extent that they reinforce the fact that the perpetrator alone is responsible for the assault, and therefore is an appropriate target for angry feelings.

Desert Flower

Thank you Armee, for typing that text here. That's very helpful. I ordered the book immediately.

I'm glad it says the anger is pointing towards goodness. I do feel this Wrathful part wants Justice, to balance the score.

I'll return to my journal now for an update.

Kizzie

Desert Flower have you ever considered initiating charges against your abuser and perhaps getting justice through the courts? It seems more and more people are going this route and making actual headway even if the abuse was years in the past.

Desert Flower

#7
-Trigger warning-

Hi Kizzie, well, yes, I did consider that at some point, briefly. But really I consider this a Lost Cause for multiple reasons. (This is really difficult and painful for me. It feels like having to defend myself. I know this wasn't your intention of course but still.)

First, the offence is indeed legally time-barred in my country.
And if it wasn't, there is literally no evidence at all left (except for the state I'm in) and no one to speak as a witness.

At the time, some people must have noticed something was going on, but they would never testify on my behalf. Even my mother- who definitely knows what happened- I dare not ask. I don't think she would support me. And his brother, who was sometimes in the room when it happened, would not testify for me naturally.
And other than that, he did everything to keep it hidden. I did not speak to anyone about it then, I was not 'allowed' to and so I never dared.
So I would in fact be the only witness. In a court situation, it would literally be my word against his.

And then I'd expect we would have this discussion about 'consent'. While I would not consider being paralysed with fear and thus being unable to speak to be consent, he would state that I never objected. This is one of the hardest parts of the situation actually. I didn't say anything, because I was too scared too. And in those days (more than thirty five years ago), there wasn't any clarity, like there is today, that silence does not constitute consent. And I would have to face having to defend myself against him saying it was my fault (again) because I didn't say anything. (Although I KNOW what I felt, I know it didn't feel right.) The only specific example of something he did -which he would never admit to either- was him trowing me out of the bed when he was done. That to me is the only 'proof' I've got.
This part has actually fuelled my doubts for so long about whether one could actually speak of 'abuse'. This has been a burden for me for so long. Again, I know what I felt (or actually most of the time didn't feel because I dissociated) and that's how I know it was abuse. I do know that. But I'm really on my own here.

And I really don't think I would be able to bear going through that. The backlash of him gaslighting me again and me not being able to prove anything would definitely do me in. (Reading a 'simple'  email conversation I had with him is enough to completely throw me off balance even today). And the chances of winning a case like this would be very slim to zero I'd say. I don't think any lawyer would take on a case like this. There is no case.

So no, not a viable option in my opinion. I'd rather not think about it. It is making me sick. This hurts so much.

And that's why I'm left with Red Tara the Destroyer (in my mind, just to be sure, I wouldn't really be so daft as to actually do it). 

So I think I deserve some chocolate now, ha ha. 'Cause I quit with the whiskey long ago - Yay!

Armee

Bourbon-flavored chocolate you definitely deserve.  :grouphug:

Totally understandable. But even with the systems stacked against this type of abuse and holding people accountable...it is not an indictment of whether it was abuse or not. It was. And I'm sorry it happened to you.

I'm so grateful to that woman in France holding a public trial against her husband and the 50 men he brought to assault her over the years. Only a case because he recorded and saved stuff. So thanks to her for being the public face proving this stuff happens. Horrific but so brave of her and so appreciated.

Desert Flower

Thank you Armee.  :grouphug:

And yes that French woman is so brave and very appreciated indeed. It's really hard to think of the horrors of this case.

dollyvee

Quote from: Desert Flower on October 09, 2024, 06:12:35 PMAnd then I'd expect we would have this discussion about 'consent'. While I would not consider being paralysed with fear and thus being unable to speak to be consent, he would state that I never objected. This is one of the hardest parts of the situation actually. I didn't say anything, because I was too scared too. And in those days (more than thirty five years ago), there wasn't any clarity, like there is today, that silence does not constitute consent. And I would have to face having to defend myself against him saying it was my fault (again) because I didn't say anything.

DF, this has actually brought back something that I sort of pushed out of my mind. Around 23 years ago, just after I was finishing university, I remember coming to the realization that quite a significant number of women I knew had been raped/date raped, but it wasn't really something anyone talked about. Just oh, I was really drunk and he did this. I don't feel like there was any sense of accountability, or even the line that that was WRONG. I even have my own experience of when I was 16 with someone well into his thirties after drinking together, but because I felt like I was consenting at the time (though I can unpack that too), I never said anything about it even though it felt wrong, and I felt off afterwards. I actually never talk about this. It just makes me realize how much of this stuff just gets hidden away and accepted as a product of the times.

Desert Flower

 :yeahthat:

And I'm really sorry it happened to you too Dolly  :hug:

Chart

#12
Quote from: dollyvee on October 11, 2024, 09:55:29 AMIt just makes me realize how much of this stuff just gets hidden away and accepted as a product of the times.
:yeahthat:
I've never accepted this. Of the four long-term serious relationships in my life, three had been raped in their lives. I've explained on two separate occasions to my daughter that NO ONE has the right to touch her body without her consent. NO ONE. She asked, What about the doctor? I replied, Not EVEN the doctor IF you don't want them to touch you. I hope and pray she never goes through that experience. The enormous topic of sexual abuse SHOULD be part of the educational system and discussed in the proper settings at schools with educational psychologists. Young boys are just as vulnerable as girls AND both boys and girls should know about sexual "limits". In both directions, victim AND perpetrator.

My parents often passed these limits, my mother did it regularly. She discussed her sexual life openly, showed me parts of her sex when I was too young to know how to react or get away, and my parents photographed us nude once on a camping trip. It was passed off as 'art', but it made me horribly uncomfortable. I know my personal experiences were nothing compared to many who have experienced much worse. It's just INSANE this happens so much and nobody talks about it.

All we can do is talk and try to "teach" this subject to our children. It's really hard knowing how to go about it.

Chart

I want to add that many perpetrators are just as abandoned by society. A young boy systematically witnessing his mother being raped by his father is not going to understand limits at all and could very easily take this as acceptable behavior. This does not condone the behavior, but rather underscores the pernicious nature of the problem. The problem also has to be addressed from the different poles. Perpetrators need help too if they're ever going to understand what the impact of their behavior truly is. Again, this is not an excuse of their behavior. But for it to stop perpetrators need help too... I fully believe this is possible, particularly from an early age. Later, clearly, many (most?) male perpetrators just don't get it.