Uncomfortable Work Experience

[rainydiary]

I planned a meeting with a group of people.


The original invite list was small but word of mouth had me adding more people.

One person that reached out to be invited is someone I didn't want to invite.  I opted to invite them to see how it would go.

It went as I expected.  This person talked over me, invalidated what I said, and kept offering advice when that wasn't the purpose of the meeting.  I am most upset with myself for not saying anything or setting any boundaries.

One of my colleagues shared that this coworker is really hard for her to work with as he reminds her of an ex husband.  I noticed that she didn't even speak during the meeting.

I am working to not feel responsible for that dynamic.  To be honest when she talks she tends to be very similar to him.

But I am also wanting to be more direct about some boundaries with people who do this.

I was thinking that at our next meeting in December we set some community agreements.  I also wish I hadn't sent the invitation to him. 

I am mostly wishing I could stop being hard on myself for how today went.  I think people beyond the two I mentioned here had a good experience.  But I don't like being talked over and being invalidated by someone that wants to feel important and not listen to others.

[AphoticAtramentous]

I'm sorry it didn't go the way you wanted it to, rainy. Try not to kick yourself whilst you're already down, life is hard enough without our silly brains making more of a mess... but I know that's easier said than done.

I think your idea of setting some community agreements is really good! I personally find that writing my plans down (the set of agreements in this case) can be helpful in sharing and enacting them with others. Otherwise, suggesting these things on the spot I think makes it easy for us to lose our nerve, especially when it relates to our boundaries. Having it in writing feels more official and easier to share! But that's just my own little idea, not forced to use it at all.

Regards,
Aphotic.

[NarcKiddo]

I'm sorry that happened. It is always frustrating when people behave precisely as expected which is why we didn't want to include them in the first place! I totally get why you might be feeling upset with yourself - although that comment is NOT meant to suggest I think you should be upset with yourself or that you did anything wrong. I'm glad you are trying not to be too hard on yourself. Just because your doubt about this annoying person proved to be correct does not necessarily mean you should not have given him that opportunity to behave better.

Given that it is a work meeting I guess it should be possible to produce a pretty strict agenda in advance and make it clear the agenda will be stuck to. Of course these things can depend on workplace dynamics, the purpose of the meeting, who is organising it and so on.

I'm glad you are working on not feeling responsible for the dynamic between the tiresome person and the coworker who does not like him. You're right to be doing that - their dynamic is their own.

[Desert Flower]

I feel for you too Rainy, it's a lousy experience to be going through. Especially when you saw it coming. I can totally understand how you're feeling. And there's no need to beat yourself up about it. These are hard patterns to change. But going through it this time, and not liking that at all, maybe some next time you will have been 'annoyed enough' and have the courage to speak up when it happens. But I know that's really hard and scary too, I don't know if I could do it either. 

[Kizzie]

Yes to community agreements     

And then if he or anyone else doesn't follow them you can say something a little softer like, "Excuse me Harold, remember our community agreement was to not interrupt (or whatever)?" 

Then it's not you being the bad guy because it is based on the what those in attendance have agreed to.

[rainydiary]

Thank you all for the support and encouragement.

I wanted to share an update.

This morning I sent out an email to share that I've been reflecting on the conversation this week.  I suggested two topics for our next meeting.

The first topic would be discussing community norms.  I suggested a list of four and emphasized that this was a starting point that we could modify or add to.

The other topic is to more specifically discuss comments that people often say to me when I disclose that I am autistic (which Harold, as Kizzie named him and I like, said to me during the meeting).  The purpose of our group is to discuss ways to support autistic and neurodivergent students in affirming ways and he is far from that.

Harold almost immediately responds to my email in a way that makes me know I touched a nerve. 

I used ChatGPT to help me come up with some responses and sent him a response which I hope will shut the email thread down for now.

I then also forwarded what he said to someone who told me she would help me engage with him.  She is being really helpful.

I think the help will be most needed at our next meeting when he starts trying to dominate the conversation.  At least I can try to prepare a bit and have this colleague to back me up (assuming she attends).

[Desert Flower]

Whichever way this goes Rainy, I think you're so tremendously brave and strong, the way you're handling this, facing it head on. I am very proud of you. 

[Kizzie]

Look at you go!!       

That's awesome and I think you're preparing yourself quite well, especially having someone on your side. Maybe you could ask her directly to attend as you would appreciate her backing you up?

Not to make you nervous but he may do his level best to dominate the discussions and shut you down as it can take time to get through to someone who is used to getting their way. It's hard but if you hold firm and calm eventually he is likely to back down and behave.

On the other hand you never know, he may have realized from your email already you are not going to back down and want to revisit the conversation for the sake of the kids who need support.

Whatever the case good luck at the next meeting and let us know how it went.

[Chart]

Bravo RD! Keep going, keep building, keep gaining experience and stick to your convictions. It seems to me you're working hard and doing really great! Thank you. Your actions are really inspiring.
 

[rainydiary]

Thank you Desert Flower, Kizzie, and Chart.

Harold ended up responding to me (he seems like someone that always needs to have the last word).  His response sort of acknowledged what I said and at least was something I didn't feel compelled to respond to.

I think you are right Kizzie that he will up his antics.  Everyone knows he does stuff like this and it is annoying that it is allowed.  I've seen him get defensive by every person that has said something that doesn't align with his perspective and expertise, so it isn't personal to me.

I feel shaky standing up to him but it feels important to do.

[Chart]

Standing up to people is something learned. I think you're doing great, RD!!!

[Kizzie]

When you do stand up to him try and picture all of us standing behind you cheering you on.         

You may feel a bit shaky but honestly it gets easier when you really do embrace the fact that he is the problem not you and you are not hurting him.  And imagine if others take your lead, you all may find he's not so domineering and wouldn't that make everyone's working life better!? 

[Chart]

I agree with Kizzie 100%!

(And by the way, I'm the  on the far right  )

[rainydiary]

Thank you Chart and Kizzie. 

It is helpful to remember that I am not hurting him. 

It is also helpful to imagine being cheered on.

I have about a month until this meeting, so will try to not obsess until that time.