Feeling ashamed of being alive

[nina]

I guess many people here can relate to this.. at least I used to have a childhood friend who would say this about themselves. That is already more than just me.

I am in a flashback by the way.

I have been thinking about this shame and that I do not know how to change it. It seems to be a self reinforcing mechanism. Low self esteem, inability to stand up for myself, and dissociating in moments when I should defend myself, later realising that: people stop respecting me. When I do not treat myself seriously, people don't either. When I do not stand up for myself, people do take advantage of me. Is it people's fault? I do not think so, I think it is a social mechanism, invisible for everyone. Even people I used to count on have changed like this. This is quite depressive. I see where it is going.

Today I thought: so it ultimately happens with everyone.. people either get disappointed with me and leave me or start abusing me and I have to leave them. Everyone I spend enough time with. Co-workers. Partner? What if I find a partner who actually loves me and then they will also be subject to that mechanism and start feeling contempt towards me? Why should it be different with a romantic partner? Why should someone love me no matter what? How could someone love me if I do not love myself. Did anyone ever love me? Why am I denied what is so basic to human experience.

It feels like a chicken egg problem. How do I solve this? Anyone solved anything similar? Made any progress at all?

[Jazzy]

Hi Nina, sorry to hear you are having such a rough time. Those flashbacks are nasty... nastier than words can really say... but the thing is, that flashbacks end, so I'd really like to encourage you to find your way through to the end of this one.

You have every right to be alive, and make the most out of that life!

Shame is a ludicrously gigantic topic to try to deal with. Speaking for myself, I struggle with it, and don't have all the answers by any means. I expect a lot of people here are similar, but we all do our best to get through it, and improve as we go.

I know what you mean about the self reinforcing part of it. Its a point of particular interest to me. I think another way to describe it is the snowball effect. Once it gets rolling downhill, it just keeps rolling, and gets bigger as it goes. The thing is though, unlike a snowball, it self reinforces in the opposite direction as well. When you improve your self esteem, it will show, and people will notice, and react on that, which helps you build your self esteem, on and on. Now, of course its not that easy, people get emotional, things get in the way. But the point remains, its hardest to get started, but when you do, momentum will help carry you forward. Its just a matter of getting that momentum started. To be honest, that takes an awful lot of work, but I'm sure you can do it; I believe in you!

I would like to challenge your assumption that "it ultimately happens with everyone". There's a lot of people out there, and we don't know the future. Maybe, at the very worst, its happened to everyone so far. But, you've already shown that you're working to improve yourself, and that is going to make a difference in time. Another thing, is that, while it does seem rare, there are people who will not take advantage of you, and care about you when you're not able to stand up for yourself. Maybe you don't know any right now, but they're out there. I'm sure quite a few of them are right here on this forum.

So, hopefully some of that helps, but I think the most immediate concern is the flashback you are in. Wishing you all the best as you get through that, and a good recovery journey on the other side.

Take care!

[woodsgnome]

Something I've noticed about this condition -- there's rarely any truly easy answer. Wait, actually there are -- lots of them, except they don't apply very all easily to the long-entrenched issues that keep us feeling trapped in how it's always been.

One starting point per your self-esteem might just be that you're asking for help. It's a huge step -- it's not a sign of weakness or failure, but an indication of a willingness to consider other options besides what's always happened before. Trouble is, the steps can be a slow process -- still, just  starting, as you have, is a plus sign.

I am often so full of fear of asking that I can hardly utter the simplest words to effect what I want. Why? Fear of being judged, a very old habit. Yet if I honestly assess what's often come back to me it seems I was sometimes wrong and had been behaving based on past fears, not present reality. I was just so scared that I couldn't change. This is still a troubling work in progress.

Many answers sound too good to be true -- such as taking the first steps. That's discouraging because it would be so grand to have a magic solution. I feel almost ashamed to have to admit that, but if I don't it keeps me from ever trying again. The rest of life, after all, is only ahead, starting now.

May the steps you're taking indicate a turn in the right direction, at last. 

[nina]

Thank you for the supportive words. I like the idea of reverse snow ball. And I really wish there were people who will not take advantage of me even if I cannot stand up for myself. Have you actually met some?

About the first step of asking for help and the process being slow.. no, I don't think I am at the stage of taking the first step. That stage was maybe 10 years ago.. It's more the stage of "I really don't know what else I can try". Yes I do behave based on my old fears.. they are my reality, I just can't stop this automatic spacing out whenever there is a chance to do something different this time. I am afraid that what I want or don't want is going against what someone else wants or doesn't want. I don't want to let them down. Like, I am terrified, so terrified that I only want the situation to end, even if I have to do something against myself. I don't feel I have the right to be.

[Jazzy]

Yes, those people do exist. Right now, I can think of 3 people I have known that I would put in that category. Like I said, not many, but they are out there. One, I was really close with for a while. I like to think of her as my angel without wings. To me, she seemed somehow better than human. She's not in my life anymore, but I will never forget her.

I've felt like I don't know what else to try plenty of times, so I know what that's like. There are a lot of resources available though... and new things are always coming to be. Recently, there was a video series that really helped me see some things in a new way, and gave me a lot of hope. I'd say everyone is different though, we all need to do our research, and find what does, and what does not, work for us as individuals. If you haven't yet, you might want to look at Pete Walker's website, and what he has to offer. You can find it at http://pete-walker.com.

This automatic spacing out you mentioned sounds like a dissociative episode. I find them really difficult to handle. There are still some things (and people) who throw me in to such an episode almost every time I see them. That whole situation is still a work in progress for me, but I'm encouraged by reading other's successes, and they've certainly become less frequent, and less intense for me. So, there's hope, for sure.

I am afraid that what I want or don't want is going against what someone else wants or doesn't want. I don't want to let them down. Like, I am terrified, so terrified that I only want the situation to end, even if I have to do something against myself.

Regarding this, I can certainly understand you feeling that way. Its really difficult to put everyone else ahead, and try to live up to their standards, whether they are real or imagined. I hope you can reduce that terror to something more manageable. I find that focusing on myself and my own needs help a bit.

I don't feel I have the right to be.

Again, this is understandable... but you do have the right to be. You have just as much right as everyone else you don't want to let down.  I know it can be hard to accept, but its true, even when we feel like it isn't.

[Blueberry]

I don't feel I have the right to be.

Again, this is understandable... but you do have the right to be. You have just as much right as everyone else you don't want to let down.  I know it can be hard to accept, but its true, even when we feel like it isn't.

You DO have the right to be, Nina! I understand because I believed for years that I didn't either. Emotional abuse from parents can lead you to think like that.