David Goggins

[johnram]

I sometimes listen to interviews of David Goggins on youtube.  a man who would be a candidate for cPTSD given his history.

However, he has achieved a lot through grit (Navy Seal, champion ultrarunner, world pull up champion etc), and it does make me feel a bit weak if i am honest, but also curious about possibilities?

thoughts?

[johnram]

Link to a video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xzvvNXBcvLg&t=10s

[Kizzie]

My first thought is that what matters is what drives a person to excel.  For those of us with CPTSD it's often perfectionism, an unrealistic standard we set for ourselves so that we are never vulnerable. Pete Walker talks about this:

Perfectionism is the unparalleled defense for emotionally abandoned children. The existential unattainability of perfection saves the child from giving up, unless or until, scant success forces him to retreat into the depression of a dissociative disorder, or launches him hyperactively into an incipient conduct disorder. Perfectionism also provides a sense of meaning and direction for the powerless and unsupported child. In the guise of self-control, striving to be perfect offers a simulacrum of a sense of control. Self-control is also safer to pursue because abandoning parents typically reserve their severest punishment for children who are vocal about their negligence.

As the quest for perfection fails over and over, and as sustaining attachment remains elusive, imperfection becomes synonymous with shame and fear. Perceived imperfection triggers fear of abandonment, which triggers self-hate for imperfection, which expands abandonment into self-abandonment, which amps fear up even further, which in turn intensifies self-disgust...on and on it goes in a downward spiral of fear and shame encrusted abandonment. It can go on for hours and days...weeks in environmentally exacerbating conditions...and for those with severe PTSD, can become their standard mode of being.

Ref: http://pete-walker.com/shrinkingInnerCritic.htm.

What do you think of what he is suggesting?

[johnram]

Well said regarding perfectionism, i can really see that here

in terms of David Goggins - i just find, and particularly i think in the American culture, these one off people speak as if anyone can do that, and change the discourse for people struggling negatively.  Its like my medically trained (former) friend who said, "Depression isnt real, people just make excuses".  it creates a false sense of potential, and it bothers me, makes me feel a bit weaker. 
However, there is the other side, where i do find it motivating also, so i get a bit torn.

not sure if that makes sense

 

[Kizzie]

I hear you.  I come back to the whole notion of why anyone chooses to work on their fitness to the extreme and if it's for healthy reasons and is a passion - OK. If it's b/c they feel less than, that they don't measure up, and it is a compulsion then it's not really healthy or positive in the end.   That's my take anyway.

[johnram]

i think that makes sense, as you couldnt find some form of peace, so kept pushing and pushing (which is davids story)

highly impressive but disturbing also (e.g. running with broken bones for 30 miles)

[Kizzie]

Yeesh re running w/broken bones 

[Boatsetsailrose]

Pete walker hits it all so well with perfectionism and imperfectionism thanks for pointing back to this...

Hi John ram
Interesting isn't it and for me it's always working to come somewhere in the middle ground between being in EF and all that brings v my high achieving wants..
I've def learnt I'm not an up there achiever in areas I'd like to be but I am up there when I look at how well I do function in light of it all.. I mean wow its amazing I'm alive and walking tbh..
So i hike I haven't achieved the himalyers but I have walked many large hills and one mountain... That's great!
I don't run marathons but I can run a couple of miles that's great!
I don't work as a psych nurse anymore but I am going to do some voluntary work in a community project... That's great!
I'm super women in my own right and all of us here are too.... We are amazing...

[johnram]

I like your reply, and i think i am coming to that lense of thinking, owning the parts of me that have suffered and the parts that havent and finding my balance

[Rainagain]

I'm amazed someone who is medically trained claims depression isn't real.

Like saying measles isn't real.

It's so well researched and the physiological effects of depression are so well documented that I'm at a loss.

It can be produced and then alleviated pharmacologically in rats, rats dont 'make excuses'.

That is alongside people who believe the earth is flat in my opinion, someone holding a belief that is contrary to everything that is documented.