Anger at Covid Deniers.

[Phoebes]

I rarely engage in politics or get wrapped up in the news. It takes a lot to get me angry and upset in these areas, because I figure I usually have enough going on in my "real" life to get all worked up about things I don't have control over. Until now.

I'm coming from a place of a close family member for 30 years was an epidemiologist in Africa, and who I have always heard speak about pandemics and how they work. I've always found it fascinating because of hearing him talk about it. And the only way to keep them from spreading is to contain them immediately, as in, no in or out of the house, town, city, neighborhood, state.. as close in as you can identify the case(s). Or to whatever circumference of where the cases are found. In other words, as soon as it was discovered in Wuhan, no one should have been allowed in or out until it was contained and diminished. And then a little farther where it was discovered. DESPITE people "wanting" to have freedom to travel. Once people traveled all over, it was spread. So, in each place it was discovered, it needed to be strictly contained at that point. And so on.

It seems WHO leaders should have known this, and doctors around the globe should have known this, and leaders who are not doctors should have listened and acted. I feel strongly that this is in large part common sense. If lil' ol' unimportant me knows this information, why don't world leaders have sense or background knowledge to know to stop travel to contain a rapidly spreading virus. Why are we still talking about "get back to work" when it is in full force?? Why was the team who would have been on this let go, and if they hadn't been, what would THEIR recommendation been??

I am angry, because I apparently have no choice or control over my own life. I'm doing my part, sitting inside at home ALONE for weeks, having NO family member ask about my well being. Family members repeating this crazy nonsense of how it's "just the flu" and "taking away our freedoms." I am happy to do it, because I know protesting to the city government "I want my freedom!" is not going to slow or stop this virus. We COULD HAVE stopped it and we still could diminish it if people would cooperate, which is what I assumed would happen. But no! We are in the twilight zone and all kinds of people are happy to be out there spreading it and believing it's a myth.

My questions are these right now:

If doctors and researchers of the virus cannot even name how it is that some people are more likely to get it, why people of all ages are getting it, and why some people die with no underlying conditions while others have no symptoms at all, how to all of these people in the news "know" that it's "just like the flu" and that it's the "government" trying to "control us?" It's a process. Like some smart doctors are seeing that the ventilators really aren't curing that many people, so they are trying new ways that are turning out to be more effective. It takes time.

And, if we go back to businesses opening, like they were talking about Disneyland opening for "limited numbers of people" and restaurants having "spread apart tables" and everywhere having "temperature checks." How, if many people who spread it are asymptomatic, meaning they won't have a fever at all, what good is any of that going to do? It will still be spread exponentially. The only way these mass integrations could work is to insure everyone in the population is free of the disease through testing. And isolate the sick until they are cleared. We've slowed the spread some..now we want to go back to accelerating the spread?

I'm seriously not ok with these ignorant people potentially putting my health in danger because they don't believe in science or don't care to READ about the truth about the virus and how it spreads. There are people in the world who understand what should have been done and what still needs to be done, but apparently all of the people who get to make the decisions don't agree with facts.

[woodsgnome]

So well said. Thank you.

Sometimes it seems absurd, that in the end the only thing that seems to matter is some vague deity identified only as The Economy. Huh? Somewhere along the road the idea of people's real lives and welfare was tossed onto the roadside, for fear of upsetting this wrathful economic deity. 

And, as others have sadly shared, it's all eerily reminiscent of when our own selves were, and are, dismantled by others who denied our hurt for reasons based more on their need to strut their importance and power while dismissing our real hurts as signs of weakness (and why is that wrong anyway?) or ... who knows what they really meant and why in the current instance the god called economy can ride roughshod over that simple deity called Caring.

When it comes to leadership, I'll end by quoting one recent leader who, when asked if he'd read up on what he was talking about, replied: "We need leaders, not readers." Sigh 

[Phoebes]

Wow, yes, I think you're right Woodsgnome. It FEELS a lot like that familiar truth that doesn't matter for the sake of narcissists "looking" a certain way, or getting what's most important to them. In this case, money.

"And, as others have sadly shared, it's all eerily reminiscent of when our own selves were, and are, dismantled by others who denied our hurt for reasons based more on their need to strut their importance and power while dismissing our real hurts as signs of weakness (and why is that wrong anyway?) "

This really helped me understand where this extreme anger is coming from. It's like my feelings, and even my knowledge of facts in certain areas (like my own major in college), are completely dismissed by N-parents, while they take everything certain people say as gospel truth, without any question or investigation. Their friends, church leaders, choices of political leaders, and any ol' joe blow off the street, knows everything, and my sister and I are completely dismissed and shrugged off- treated like we are idiots. I've only more recently realized I'm NOT an idiot, especially in areas that I have sound knowledge and research. I just realize no one knows everything and why not consult people who have dedicated their life to studying things like pandemics, rather than just take any ol' money-motivated politician?

[Kizzie]

My T believes (and I agree) that anger is a response to injustice and in the case of COVID and a leader w/malignant NPD and a large band of flying monkeys, there's a LOT of that to go around. I'm not even American and I'm really angry, not because of politics, but the utter lack of humanity, abdication of responsibility, and of dangerous/life-threatening abuse being inflicted on a country  and supported by some of its citizens.

I cannot fathom how/why so many seem to reject the science and don't see that Trump will cost more people their lives because of the lack of coordinated, rational, humane response.  It all feels like living in the alternate reality of my NPD parents with their band of flying monkeys.  And now here on a much larger scale, swaths of people are ignoring/ dismissing reality and putting others at great risk as a result.  Boggles the mind and fills me with both anger and despair frankly.



(Note: Just to be clear, this thread is not about US/Trump's politics, it's the reactions/ responses to COVID, Trump's and others, and how it affects us as trauma survivors.)

[sanmagic7]

amen to all of the above.

some of what i had to work on w/ my t recently was the absolute anger  (i wasn't able to sleep - my anger had gotten to a dangerous, for me, level) i had at what's going on, how it's being dismissed/handled, and how the flying monkeys (love that phrase!) have even disrupted traffic on purpose because of their political agenda, and the heartbreaking rant of one healthcare employee who was incensed by their behavior because he couldn't get to work!

we are helpless in the face of this, and i had to come to a place of acceptance that i cannot control how other people think or what they do.  still, the anger is righteous because our rights to safety and protection are being ignored, just as kizzie noted, like they were in childhood.  yeah, no wonder this is affecting many of us here on the forum to an excruciating level.  my heart is with all of you.

[Phoebes]

Your responses really help me come down a notch. I don't think I've ever been so sustainably angry in all my life. In the only other area of extreme anger, at least there was the piece that had me questioning myself if I was being too harsh, or if I should just have boundaries and try to get along. lol. But this, there is nothing about this I'm not furious about.

But, I have to find a way to bring it down and accept I can't control others. I do feel, though, that I can't be friends or family with these people. There are a lot of people around me thinking this absurd way (and others not). I can't deal.

Kizzie, the swath of people ignoring reality. Wow. Eyeopening and a reminder of no wonder no one believed me before. People want to be in denial, big time. It sounds like you have a good T. I have yet to find one. I feel like while the leader of other countries could have been more on top of a possible pandemic and how to respond, the citizens themselves are more reasonable and thoughtful people. And many Americans, too. But, as a whole, where I see people as more sensible, there are certain American types that would see that as a willingness to have my rights taken away. Noooo, it's a strategy to end a virus? I just don't get it.

San, helpless is how I feel. Definitely. I also feel that I am JUST now getting a handle on what happened to me and how that affects my relationships, and hoping to have a love relationship finally in life. To be more open, get back out there, and pursue dreams and love, like I used to before I blacked out and have lived in a hole for 10 years. I feel like now, my chances will be over. My niece and nephews chances may be over. I'm feeling pretty catastrophic about it all, and I need to stop. I guess I'm a realist now.

[sanmagic7]

just to let you know, phoebes, i've also eliminated many people from my life who don't think the way i do anymore.  i can't take the ignorance and denial they display, either.  you're not alone in this.

i don't doubt things will get back to a place where we will again be able to pursue our dreams.  it may not be tomorrow, but it will be there.  i have faith on some level, and i'm just going to live by that.  sending love and hug full of faith to you, too.   maybe sharing my faith with you will help ease the catastrophic feeling for you.  i hope so.  it's a terrible way to feel. 

[Kizzie]

Just a reminder to please avoid getting into the political aspects of the pandemic in the US because it will only lead to divisiveness and acrimony as we've seen play out over and over again there. Difficult I know and we really need to talk about the trauma we're experiencing, but we need to focus on how NPD affects us as survivors so the thread doesn't devolve along politically partisan lines. Tks!

So in terms of the traumatization I have been experiencing, it's safe to say watching the pandemic play out in the US under someone with malignant NPD has been shocking, horrifying actually, but not surprising. NPD is traumatizing, inhumane, dangerous & even life-threatening as many of us know from experience only too well. My only hope is that more people will now see NPD for what it is and that none of us will ever have our trauma invalidated or minimized again. 

[Phoebes]

So, my uNd, who I realized at the holidays this year is more N than "en" after we talked and I set some boundaries. He went on 2 week vacation out of the country right as the pandemic was starting and said he had bought some spray that kills the virus, and this is just another flu.

Then, I checked on him twice during his trip to which he responded one word, as well as his wife would send me pics. One of the things I told him in our chat is that I had blocked her long ago and the reasons why. So this felt gaslighting.

Then, she said he would call when they got home, and he didn't. They got out the day the borders closed, and I was concerned. A week went by and I again reached out and asked how they were doing and that I never heard from him. He said fine, and they assume I'm working. 

THEN, ever since then, he has not checked on me once. I thought maybe he isn't talking to me because of the things I said and boundaries set. But out of the blue he texted me the food he was eating. Then I saw a video he posted on FB saying political things as mentioned before that are really triggering, I think BECAUSE, here my dad doesn't care to check on me or have empathy for how I may be feeling or handling being alone for weeks, but cares to post crazy nonsense on his FB. This type of thing always feels like "lectures" to me. What is the point? To tell people how to think? To let people know how he thinks? I don't think it's that he doesn't care about me entirely, I think his mind is so wrapped up in his abusive NPD wife he isn't thinking how his offspring feel. At all.

[Kizzie]

I saw a video he posted on FB saying political things as mentioned before that are really triggering, I think BECAUSE, here my dad doesn't care to check on me or have empathy for how I may be feeling or handling being alone for weeks, but cares to post crazy nonsense on his FB.

It's hard to swallow I know, that your F would be so wrapped up in his NPD wife, he hasn't even asked how you are faring during this crisis. It's the nature of the beast (the beast being NPD) unfortunately, it consumes everyone's attention, time and energy, and makes rational thinking near impossible.

I'm sorry you aren't getting the love and support you need, want and deserve Phoebes.

[Phoebes]

Thank you, Kizzie. I appreciate your responses and support. I don't know what I would do without you guys here. 

[sanmagic7]

what kizzie said. 

in my experience w/ npd's, they set their sights on the one thing they think will give them their narc supply, and everyone else needs to take care of themselves.  sounds like your situation, too, and i feel for you, phoebes.  love and hugs

[alliematt]

There's a place for discussion about where and how to reopen the economy, and that I can appreciate.  But the deniers and the "my freedom above all" are really getting to me as well.  You're not alone.

[Kizzie]

   Phoebes

[Phoebes]

San, that's a good way to look at it. Come to think of it, it's always been that way with both Nm and Nd. They get fixated on one thing or person and pursue supply.