looking for relief

Started by sanmagic7, August 11, 2022, 02:19:41 PM

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sanmagic7

CF, my heart was saddened by the fact that you didn't get what you needed from your F.  you and i were certainly good enough.  the idea that we didn't get the validation we needed, well, i'm sorry you experienced it as well.  i hope you can find your way to knowing it in yourself. :hug:

armee, thank you thank you thank you.  you spurred another revelation for me in my NN - i just pictured my dad letting me know throughout my school years how proud he was of me for my good grades, how validating it meant a lot to me going forward, and how my knowledge of that point about me and what i'd done in school would have strengthened, supported, and encouraged me, building my personhood into something more solid and secure in my own abilities to achieve and enjoy my own self.  :hug:

now i've begun working on the next step of childhood development:  School Age (6 to 11 years)   Industry vs. Inferiority    School   Confidence

confidence has been lacking.  even tho i knew i did well both in school and later in my job as therapist, it always seemed like an uphill battle to prove i was intelligent and for that to be recognized.  'flaky therapist' comes to mind (dang, that still hasn't stopped hurting).  but i think/believe if i would've gotten the praise and acknowledgment from my F during my school years, i would've been able to shake off such such hurtful/painful remarks by others just cuz i did things my own way.

i actually knew i was a great therapist w/ those girls because of the feedback i got from them, from their parents.  i've got little reminders i keep w/ me of the appreciation they felt for me.  i think of another forum member struggling w/ autism and her special perspective she has working w/ kids needing extra help, and how their feedback for her reinforces that her way works wonders for them.  the adults working w/ those same kids just can't see it, for whatever reason, that working outside the box w/ struggling youth is so important and gets beneficial results.

so, i looked back on school years till age 11, and can now picture my F paying attention to my report cards, marveling at how great a student i was and the results showed on those report cards.  never any problem in school, nothing neg. to report to them.  i channeled all my energy into getting good/great grades, even when they weren't showing all 'A's'.  that acknowledgment would have set me up for confidence in myself and my efforts.

my M isn't in the picture for whatever reason.  i suppose she was happy i was a good student, an excellent student. but she was too involved in keeping a clean house, clean clothes, making food, etc. to really give it the weight i needed.  my T mentioned she thought my mom was OCD when it came to cleanliness.  i believe that could be the case.

at any rate, i now need to let this settle a bit, wallow in it, if you will.  knowing i was more than smart, and all my work to do well in school was appreciated and celebrated . . . i could've really used that.  again, what a difference it would've made in my adulthood on so many fronts.  confidence.  yeah, i've got to put that in place now before i move on.

sanmagic7

still settling w/ some of my school stuff, altho i've begun to move into my next major memory.  that will come.

yesterday, in therapy, i talked a lot about how disconnected emotionally i was from anyone, including my parents.  once i moved out of their house, it was as if anything they might be going thru was no concern of mine.  even after my dad died, (my S and i were living across the country), i had no feelings about my mom being w/o him.  my S returned to their house to be w/ her so she wouldn't be alone, but that was something which never crossed my mind to even give a thought to.  i was planning my wedding, didn't have enough $$$ - i'd spent my extra money to go see him when he was able to come home from the hospital, so visiting him when he was alive meant more to me than being at a funeral.

at any rate, giving a care about others' emotions/feelings just wasn't part of me, wasn't part of my perception of people, the world, or me in the world.  yesterday, however, after talking about this the weight of my disconnect hit me full force.  what a horrible way to live.  i'm only just realizing this now.  i know it was a survival mechanism - i could never have survived my life w/o it - but i was overcome w/ sadness about it all.  that was extremely disturbing, and i overate to try to push all the distress down.

but here i am this morning, and i'm working on allowing the sadness, the weight, the distress to be there and to live thru them.  my D has told me several times she likes me better now that i'm beginning to feel, altho she understands the reason for it.  i'm sure this is caused by being in a safer environment, living w/ a safe person, and having the pace of my life slowed wa-a-a-a-y down.  all those things are giving me an opportunity to realize and acknowledge feelings for the first time in forever.

my next big memory which happened when i was 13-14 was what put the nail in that coffin, and i can't wait to put that to rest, but it'll have to wait.  i need to go thru this now, and i feel horribly sad and miserable.  ugh!  honestly, i spend too much time feeling miserable, tho.  i don't like it.

Not Alone

San, I felt a lot as I read your posts.  :grouphug:

CactusFlower

We're here for you as you have the feelings, san. You are not alone.

(you also are not NotAlone, you are San. ;) )   :grouphug:

Armee

Whew. I audibly blew out air reading that. That is a big difficult realization, San.  :grouphug:

I hope you are able to be compassionate toward yourself because the lack of feeling was forced on you as a way to cope with people who harmed you and ignored your feelings and needs. I also imagine you had more empathy than you are recognizing right now. And how we feel about our parents and how much empathy we can extend is a reflection of them, not of flaws in ourselves. It makes sense to be a bit cold toward a parent who was cold to little you. That's protection and that's valuable.

:bighug:

sanmagic7

thanks for your support, notalone. :hug:

CF, not only for your support, but for the smile you brought to me.  thank you. :hug:

i thought about the empathy, armee - thanks for bringing that up. it was another big realization.  :hug:

when i looked back, i realized i did have empathy toward others but only if they were children.  ex ;  walking to the store one day, i was maybe 9, a baby had been left in a buggy on the sidewalk, all covered up in blankets on a hot summer day, and was crying and visibly agitated.  tears leapt into my eyes for it, and i wanted to help it but didn't know what to do so kept walking. 

the other example is because of the movie 'the miracle of marcelino'.  orphan boy dropped off at a monastery, he was treated well, but very sad at being an orphan.  one day he went exploring and found a life-sized statue of jesus sitting in a chair.  he came back several times because the statue began speaking to him.  finally, one day, the statue (this is bringing tears to my eyes as i write it) asked marcelino if he wanted to see his parents.  the boy nodded, and the statue told him to climb up onto his lap and go to sleep.  the monks found him like that, dead. 

right now i'm sobbing.  the idea that someone was so caring to this child, enough to encircle him in love and give him the capacity to die gently so he could be with his folks - that kind of caring and kindness and gentleness was foreign to me.  i think i saw this movie when i was about 8-10, and i cried freely while watching the depth of this tenderness to be given to a child.  i believe now i was already feeling the absence of my folks emotionally, even tho i never put that together till now. 

unfortunately, my friends ridiculed me for crying which  . . . did that cause shame?  did i become ashamed of crying?  it certainly added to the pile of crapola about being perfect and strong.  i was being stopped from having emotions from others besides my parents.  well, a bright light just clicked on at the back of my brain.  shame connected to emotions.  makes sense.  ashamed of having emotions/feelings, ashamed of being a girl, ashamed of being human.  that kind of wraps my entire essence of being in shame.  *sigh*

so, this is new right now for me.  thanks armee, for sending me down this road.  it opened something up i wasn't quite conscious of before.  i did put together the shame and being a girl before, but adding these 2 other layers kind of wraps everything of 'me' into a nice, neat/messy bundle.

so, yeah, i've always had empathy for children, but not for adults, not my peers, friends, parents, family.  that was knocked out of me a little later in my NN.  and it seems that child empathy was really all about me.  gotta sit w/ this first.

CrackedIce

Hey Sanmagic7

Crying is a tough one.  I'm definitely a crier when it comes to movies, I don't think I can get through a Disney movie nowadays without shedding a tear.  There's a scene in The Adam Project (netflix) where the father is being a decent dad and reconciling with his son - I have to try really really hard not to bawl every time I see it.  But even then, my wife and kids will notice, and make fun of me!  They're just poking fun of course and likely don't realize how much more hurtful it is, but I get really agitated and defensive about it.

I learned early in my childhood that showing emotions, particularly needy or protesting ones, was a terrible idea.  The trick now is unlearning it, which is hard to do for the average person, nevermind those of us who've been scarred by trauma in the past.  Even without those bad memories there's still pressure from society / friends / family / peers to keep things 'happy'.

I've done a lot of reading on Toxic Shame ('Healing the Shame that Binds You' by John Bradshaw, which is also touched on quite a bit in Pete Walker's C-PTSD book), and it becomes such a core part of your presenting self, in a way it's the deadbolt that locks away your 'true self' / 'inner child'.  It's a hard thing to shake, but being aware of it is a great step in the right direction.

Hope you have a good week!

sanmagic7

hey, crackedice, being aware is definitely a good first step.  thanks for the support. :hug:

i just read about writing a letter to your inner child, and it scared the crapola out of me.  for one thing, i wouldn't know what to say.  the only thing that came to mind was to do what you need to do cuz it's gonna get much, much worse before it gets 'better'.  not very uplifting.  and the message back to me from my inner child?  'help me'.  damn, tears again.

this is all so sad to me.  i guess it's not a bad thing - i cried a lot yesterday, so i know i'm releasing pent-up poison - but the sadness and despair i'm feeling is so very very much.  i don't want to be carrying these burdens anymore.  they're painful and debilitating at times.  like slogging thru thigh-high mud which also is full of rotting  . . .  i just want to cry again.

CrackedIce

My first attempt at writing to my inner child was born out of the recovery letters I wrote to my parents. I was feeling a lot of unresolved anger and felt necessary to write to myself as part of the exercise.  Needless to say the letter wasn't very nice... But at the same time it helped me come to a lot of realizations.

The negative attitude I had towards myself was almost entirely fueled by how my parents treated me... All the things I wanted to say to myself were things that they said to me, and upon writing them down I realized how absurd they were!

Anyways I'm still pretty far from "accepting" my inner child, but wanted to share that the process can still be helpful, even if your initial feelings are anything other than kind.

CactusFlower

Gentle hugs, san. It can take a while in the beginning for the Inner Child to even warm up to the Self, especially if trust is an issue.  You have to show them that you mean what you say and that you really will come back over and over.  Mine still get a little pouty now and then if I haven't talked in a while. But once they do open up... it can be quite revelatory.  We're here for you as you try things.

Armee

I'm holding your hand and offering tissue and a shoulder as you cry these pent up tears. Help me. I know that one. It hurts to hear. You're doing amazing work, San. It's painful.

sanmagic7

hi crackedice, i actually don't hold any animosity toward myself in any form of my 'self'.  i don't hold blame, shame, guilt, etc. about me in all this.  the idea of what i thought about writing to little me was a reflection of the reality of what little me was going to be heading into down the road.  i didn't realize that what i wrote here could be taken as being unkind.  interesting.  i was speaking realistically.  hmmm . . .  thanks. :hug:

thanks, CF.  i'm feeling like my NN is actually showing little me that i'm there for her, taking care of things for her.  i can picture a new image of me as a little girl being happy and smiling and encouraged to be free to be me.  maybe i'm wrong.   :hug:

armee, so appreciated.  it is painful.  it hurt to realize that my younger self was actually feeling so much pain by the time she was 10.  it was also surprising, but felt absolutely accurate. :hug:

some of these comments kind of sent me spinning.  maybe i don't know enough yet about writing to my 'self', maybe it's the autism/alexithymia that gets in the way.  maybe i don't have a clear enough understanding about what writing to an inner child entails.  kind of distressing.  but i'll have to let that go and stumble on.

i talked w/ my T about writing these letters, and she suggested that they were often utilized for people who blamed or shamed themselves, which i don't do.  then we went on to discuss why.  i told her i'm still confused about how much all these things in my past have made such a neg. impact on my life when i had no overt physical or sexual abuse of any kind. 

she said that what i went thru from the get-go was extremely insidious, that what my parents did consistently dehumanized me.  i brought up gaslighting, how it's the thing which causes a person to doubt themselves, doubt their perceptions, and then it struck me - i have rarely if ever doubted myself mainly because they took away my 'self'.  there was no 'self' to feel guilty or ashamed or doubtful about.

a lot to process.  it feels like it fits, tho.  i haven't been able to relate to what many people here talk about.  but it also explains how, as i look back, i've garnished clues and cues on how to act, be, what to say from others, basically everything that goes into human being and relating.  i was truly unformed as a human, out in the world w/o a smidgeon of an idea of me - never had opinions, always seeing both sides of an argument, never stood for anything, fell for most everything.  i was truly 'dust in the wind.'

this is difficult to digest, but it all rings true.  there was no 'self', so i had nothing to place shame or blame on, had nothing to doubt.  weird concept.  my stomach is roiling now.  too much.

sanmagic7

i've noticed my disturbance w/ all this new information/realizations has knocked me out of my socks.  i feel like i rambled a lot in my previous post, especially when responding to others' support, and i also discovered today that i wrote the wrong name in someone's journal.  please forgive me if i've said anything untoward, hurtful, or messed up.  thanks  :grouphug:

sitting w/ these new realizations, how they are concrete in how i've envisioned myself over the years has been truly difficult.  trying to define my self by how others spoke and acted in any situation, guessing at all the rest - especially in relationships - and looking for definition and touch from men regarding my womanhood - just floating from one situation to another nearly my entire life.

my D and i were watching a show that i was really enjoying when it turned out one of the actors decided to leave the show at a high point.  i felt anger at him for doing so because he was one of the main characters around whom the story was built.  i told my D the next day about my feelings, and she told me this was a big sign of me regaining my emotions.

i was struck by that, asked her to tell me more.  she said that now i know how she feels during these shows when she's gotten invested in a character and things go sideways.  i can't say how i felt about hearing that - i was more confused about it than anything - but i guess it's a good thing.  it was so different to me, so startling.

i'm being surprised by me on nearly a daily basis, either by discovering that i'm regaining some of my humanness, or the painful backstory that caused so much trauma in my life.  as someone here said lately, how different my life might have been, thru choices, perspective, perception, and self-knowledge.  it's rather mind-boggling.

the phrase from my T about my parents 'consistently dehumanizing' me has struck a major chord.  the idea of being unformed is kind of haunting me now, but it explains so much.  i'm waddling around in the midst of these realizations and understandings with disturbance.

Armee

 :hug: no wait... :bighug:

Thank you for helping me over in my journal. I didn't say much about how awful and in what ways I was feeling but your response showed how much you felt and understood the intensity of horrible shame I was feeling. You can't do that and not be a feeling human. Even as a trained therapist. That does not explain your empathy.

I wanted to comment yesterday but was unable to, about you telling your T you felt confused about the level of traumatization in the absence of overt physical or sexual abuse. I know you know this but it's hard to accept for ourselves. The insidious sometimes subtle psychological abuse and emotional abuse is what causes the most damage. It is fully pervasive and shaped us. It shaped our brains and nervous systems and it was every single moment of every day. Right now what I'm working through is the damage of an overt act but underlying that...the reason it happened, the reasons it is so painful to treat and process has almost nothing to do with that overt assault and almost everything to do with the twisted mess my parents made of my brain.

I don't want to throw another wrench in all you are managing but I suspect there is more overt trauma than is being acknowledged too. Things can be traumatizing even if they don't meet a definition of a crime. But even without that, the emotional abuse is insidious and highly damaging.

Papa Coco

San,

It sounds like you're really moving forward. It's exciting, but I know it's also painful.

I'm not doing well right now, so I'm not going to comment too much. Just a little. I just want to agree with Armee's comment that being a trained therapist does not explain your empathy and kindness toward others. You are a gifted healer because you're a beautiful soul who also happened to have been trained as a therapist. The salt of the earth.

My therapist boldly states that those of us who feel the suffering and work through it ARE the healers of this world. Those who have found ways to distract and shield themselves from the suffering are part of the problem. They're letting it continue uncontrolled.

We're part of the cure. We're part of the love and connection in this world. We show it to each other on this forum every day. I can't tell you how many good things I've learned from you and the others on this forum. Healing is happening just because we are willing to share ourselves with each other.

I guess when you read up on all the most spiritual healers of all time, Buddha, Ghandi, Jesus, King Solomon, Mother Teresa, Etc, that they were not immune to suffering, but chose to face it head on, and even to fully digest it as an inescapable component of an ego-centric world. Their empathetic connection with the suffering of the world drove them into a sense of peace. Then they healed a whole bunch of other people. Maybe it's true:
   Our empathy IS the most powerful healing tool known to mankind.

I hope I don't sound too crazy with all this.

Just know that I'm thankful to have you as one of my online friends, and I hope that you're able to move forward with less pain. My therapist also always says "You can't gain more potency without feeling some anxiety." Each step forward in our healing has the potential to bring up a period of anxiety that we must work through. I guess, a total lack of anxiety is a sign of a total stall in our healing process.

Even if what I said sounds crazy, please accept this hug. I really hope things ease up for you soon.  :hug: