Papa Coco's Recovery Journal

[Moondance]

I simply want to share that 1. I relate to this conversation and 2. I so admire you all not giving up and working through it by being truly honest, vulnerable, honor yourselves and each other.

This is a powerful thing I'm experiencing here and it makes me cry and scared. The crying  and fear are about hope.  There is a ray of hope that maybe, just maybe I can get there too and then fear of course because this means that I would have hope again.  Topic for next session with T.

I thank each of for who you are and for where each of are at.

[Papa Coco]

wow. Thanks everyone for responding with such kindness and comradery.

I say this all the time: That we here on this forum, the Fawns and Freezers and Fleers feel this type of pain because we're good. We all know that many people who are traumatized by bad families just become abusers themselves.  But we didn't. Turning our pain inward was us being kind and wanting to never hurt anyone else the way we've been hurt. As difficult as it is to be us, I would never, ever, ever want to pass on to others what was done to us.

Moondance, your emotional fear and crying touch me deeply and tell me that you feel what we're feeling. And with some hope that you've finally found a place where you are allowed to be you, and you don't have to be "teflon" here. I believe totally that people are social creatures. The most damaging thing that can be done to us to be isolated, either emotionally or physically. So when we find out that we aren't alone in our traumas, that's when the anxiety of the decades begins to release. Crying is one way we release anxiety.  I'm super touched by your comments that the conversation here with Dolly and Armee and Sanmagic, and soon I assume even more members, has touched you so profoundly. It makes me want to say it one more time: Welcome to the forum. This is who we are.

San, you are so right. This forum is loaded with people who are forgiving and empathetic and compassionate. We all know that we all are flawed and we all accept each other for it. It's like we're the type of people who should have been a family. Families SHOULD be this supportive of each other. But on this forum, a great many of us are from families who were the opposite of supportive. This forum is a far cry better family than my FOO was.

Dolly: Your comments about the avoidance spectrum couldn't be more spot on. Walking on eggshells is exactly how I've lived my entire life, from birth to now.

Armee, I can't imagine ever taking offense to anything you'd ever say to anyone on this forum, but trust me, I KNOW what it feels like to worry about it.

BIG HUGs to all of you !

[Papa Coco]

Journal Update: Monday, April 17, 2023

Two full days of microdosing are under my belt. They've been great, but not without fear of the future.

I preach and teach and comment all the time about the fact that we should all be focused on progress, not perfection. But I have the tendency to push myself to standards I don't push onto others.

My wife and my therapist often praise me for not giving up.  My little sister gave up in 2008. Two of the boys I went to catholic school with gave up at age 19. I am as damaged as they were, but I keep pursuing any and all help available. I keep pushing on.

I have a great fear now: Ketamine Infusions worked--for a while.  Hypnosis worked--for a while. Meditation and the pursuit of spiritual enlightenment worked, and it still work, but ONLY if I pursue this path fervently every day. ANY time I start to relax from daily meditations I go right back to ground zero and have to start over.

What will I do if microdosing goes the way everything else has?

I want to find a way to accept my damaged self-image on my own so that I don't have to keep setting myself up for crash-and-burns.

A while back, a member suggested a comedian on Netflix and YouTube. His name is Neal Brennen. His story is that he has tried everything imaginable, and none of it has helped him stop hating himself. His final message is that he is who he is and nothing is changing it. I need to come to terms with this. I need to accept myself with the same love and compassion that I accept you all with. In my opinion, you're all really wondeful people, and I'm just a tagalong who's in need of being a better person.

Heavy sigh. I don't know what to do with this. I'm still planning to ask my therapist for some EMDR, but I don't see him for 8 more days, and that's over zoom. So...

Another day. I'll enjoy these legal microdosing capsules for as long as I can, but I need to be focused on finding a way to accept who I am, rather than keep shooting arrows at temporary "cures."

Meanwhile thank God for you all. In AA I often hear members begin sharing by thanking all the members for helping them stay sober. I feel that same gratitude here now. I thank all of you for showing up and for accepting me for who I am. You're keeping me from bursting into a billion molecules and spreading myself out into space.

Meanwhile, I'll keep giving regular updates on the progress of whatever gimmick or cure I'm trying next. LOL. A lot of these things really do help a lot of people. It's sort of a custom fit for each of us what will work and what won't. Perhaps by routinely reporting on my experiences, I can grant the world a look at what they might want to try and what to avoid.

[Armee]

You are such a good and beautiful human. I wish you didn't hate yourself. It's so unfair. Actually it really is unfair because you weren't allowed to hate your abusers and to express that anger and it had no where to go but inside. There's nothing to hate about you.

I have that voice too. It's been pretty loud the past couple days. I hate myself I hate myself I deserve to die I'm disgusting. Those voices flare up when I am close to something painful but am still fleeing from it. It quieted for awhile and now it's back. It's just a distraction. To remind myself I am bad. I am the bad one. Bad things didn't happen. It's me.

I strongly suspect the same is true for you or something similar. If you looked at yourself as anyone but yourself, you would love and admire the person you saw. ❤ I sure do.

Your statement to me. That you couldn't imagine me ever saying anything to offend anyone made me tear up. I know why, because no matter how nice and loving I was to my mom she constantly made me feel like I was doing something wrong to her. It was her own mental illness but when I'd do nice things for people I'd feel like I was being a horrible person. It's such a Topsy Turvy world we grew up in.

I had just been worried about whether the pills were trustworthy since the guy was fast talking you, but I realized too I was very triggered because my dad died of an intentional overdose in WA. And I don't want anything bad to happen to you.

[Moondance]

I have read your posts PC and Armee and can so relate. I am thankful for your shares, your growth and your continued strength to keep at it.

[sanmagic7]

PC, my T does emdr w/ clients over zoom all the time.  i even do it w/ her just by phone.  it's flexible, versatile, and accommodating.  wishing you the best w/ it.

i agree w/ you about family being here.  it does feel like that for me as well.  and, yes, we could have turned into abusers, but we didn't, you didn't, and, using your words, we are good people, which includes yourself.  i think eventually you'll discover that good person w/in and will be able to stop punishing him w/ hate for being human.  love and hugs

[Moondance]

 

[Armee]

 

[Papa Coco]

Thank you Armee, Moondance and San,

I will see (zoom) my T tomorrow. I will discuss the idea of EMDR over Zoom. See what he thinks of the idea.

I have an update about my self-hate. I have always hated myself. But I have always resisted believing it.  Meanwhile I've also always had several squirm-moments every day of my life. Any time anything has triggered any memory of me saying or doing something dumb, or hurtful, or accidental, I've had a several minute trip in my mind to my dark place.

For most of my life, if I see something that reminds me of a time when I wasn't able to make someone feel good, or a time when I humiliated myself (and with all the years I've lived, there have been many less than stellar moments), I have automatically looked up to the sky and said "I'm sorry" to the universe. Even during a good day I'll have 30 or 40 squirm-moments, each followed by 5 minutes of excruciating self-torture.

BUT!  Things changed two weeks ago when I just flat out admitted to myself and to you and to my wife and my friends that I have always hated myself. NOW when I see someone who reminds me of someone I didn't do right by 40 years ago, I trigger a new response. I just say, "See? This is why I hate myself."  THIS IS GOING TO SOUND INSANE, but saying those words (instead of "I'm sorry") stops the EF immediately in its tracks. It's like...I've always hated myself, but I've never just openly admitted it to myself, which has led to a follow-on 5 minutes of wallowing in the confusion and shame of events from years gone by.

It's like: the problem has always been there, but I've never faced it head on. Now that I'm facing it head on, I have something tangible to work with. Tomorrow is my T appointment, and along with talking about EMDR, I am going to bring this to my T to see what he'll do with it. My guess is he'll be happy to hear that I'm finally facing this dragon and he might (fingers crossed) be able to move me forward a few steps in the healing process.

I hope it isn't too confusing, but thank God I'm finally facing this dragon.

To make this feel even better, I hate a lot of people; Bad politicians, Evil corporate CEOs, racists, murderers, etc, etc, etc..
   Main stream psychology, as well as spiritual religions, repeatedly teach that we can only hate in others what we hate in ourselves. I hate people who bully because I hate that I was so bullied. I hate child molesters because I'm a victim of CSA. I hate thieves because I've been stolen from... and don't even get me started on narcissists and sociopaths!!!!!!

By admitting that I hate myself, I wonder if I'm clearing the air. I'm just openly admitting something that will help get me past my confusion. Whenever I see a news article that a family of a murder victim has forgiven the murderer, I'm both dumbfounded and impressed. How do they do that?  How can someone be so beautiful that they can forgive someone who has hurt them so irreversibly?  Maybe those families just don't hate themselves so much that they also don't project that self-hatred onto others? Just a thought. I need some true, professional guidance to move past this for my own life.

[Armee]

 

There's power in naming and facing and turning toward a difficult feeling or thought like that self hate. The way my T describes it is saying "yes, I see you." For me those thoughts are protective and distracting (in a protective way), keeping me away from more difficult feelings and memories. Mine are: I hate myself. I'm stupid. I'm disgusting. I'm bad and wrong. I deserve/need to die. I know their purpose now though and I know the pattern of when they show up and it is less distressing now because of that.

I hope that looking that thought square in the face and telling your loved one about it helps, and that your T can help you with it too. At some point I hope you don't need to feel those thoughts and feelings anymore, that they serve their use to you and then mosie on down the road to live in someone's head who maybe should feel that way.

[Papa Coco]

Armee,

I'm struck by the way that you can see the good in me, and I can see the good in you. But neither of us can fully embrace the good in ourselves. I guess this is more proof that we both struggle with the same trauma-induced, non-realistic self-hatred. We're both battling the same disorder in similar ways. So when you feel self-hatred, think of how I see you as a loving person. When I feel self-hatred I'll try to remember that you see me as a loving person. If I can't maintain a decent self-image, maybe I can trust your judgement. And the same goes for you in return.

[Armee]

 

That has really helped me, exactly this. When you write about hating yourself or there being nothing to like about yourself, or describing these beautiful parts of your life as ashes. All I see is this beautiful talented kind human. And I can know that's what's happening with me too. I will remember.

And yet I also find those thoughts about ourselves are serving a purpose. And stripping them away too soon can be dangerous. So please do continue to hate yourself when you need to. When the alternative would be worse. Just know it isn't true while you do that and yes please think of me feeling the same thing and know it's preposterous!

I've made the most progress with feeling disgusting. I smell myself and my clothes and shower multiple times a day and change my clothes multiple times a day and smell myself telling myself I'm disgusting, but I've noticed over the past couple months um I'm actually not disgusting? So my mantra before being close to people or going into stores used to be "I'm disgusting I'm disgusting no stay away! I'm disgusting!" But now I can think "I might FEEL disgusting but I am not actually disgusting." It seems like a horrible thing to have to think but it is leagues better than what I used to think. Little non-threatening steps. It is all about survival after all.

[sanmagic7]

hey, PC, i'm jumping on that bandwagon - i see you as a loving person as well as kind and caring.  as you once told me, people who are truly bad don't question that part of themselves, don't pay attention to it, don't give it any weight in their lives at all.  opposite of you, they take their hatred and anger and rebellion out on others in an intentional way - to hurt, humiliate, cause pain and suffering. 

as another who has been held up to impossible expectations about how to be, getting off that ship is a tough one.  we continue doing to ourselves what was once done to us.  i think the little child inside, who would always protect their parents, is still doing that.  we've been taught not to hate, always forgive, but the human side of me has found a place for that hate emotion lately, and to me, that's all it is.  another human emotion.

as far as forgiveness goes, i've stood on the philosophy that i've taken what they gave me, felt what they did to me, and survived it the best i could.  that's enough for me.  i let someone/something else, whoever/whatever form that might be, to do the forgiveness if that person warrants it.  i don't think i have enough in me - too ravaged by what was done to me - to have the energy to go an extra step on their behalf.  let the powers that be take care of that piece. 

best to you w/ your T and the whole emdr thing.  i hope you get some satisfaction.  love and hugs

[Moondance]

Hi Papa Coco,



Thinking about you, how did your session go with T? Don't have to answer but did want you to know we are thinking of you.

[Hope67]

Hi PapaCoco,
I am also thinking about you and hoping that you're ok and sending you a supportive hug 
Hope