Does anyone else struggle with extreme hatred and desire to punish others? TW

[livingdeadgirl]

Trigger Warning for deep anger & thoughts of revenge

This may be a bit dark, but recently I've realized I have a lot of pent up hatred from being used as a punching bag throughout my entire life and scpaegoated in many contexts. What bothers me most is that they still get to live without suffering while I am left with pain and I'm sure that many of them live without regret or remorse and without being affected at all by the extent of the harm they did to me and how it still affects me. Even when I have interactions with people who aren't connected to my past trauma I am full of hatred because I am triggered by every little thing they do that hurts me or that crosses a boundary of being intended to be funny at my expense or shows that they don't value my boundaries/needs/preferences/feelings as much as they should (this feeling of not being respected on a basic human level that triggers me more than anything because it always brings up the question of what I have done and what I could possibly have done as a child to deserve to be treated that way, disregarded as a human being by random people who don't even know me and have no reason not to be decent let alone my own family - - what do people see when they look at me that makes it feel okay for them to decide that my life and my feelings do not matter at all, or that I am just there to be hurt for convenience or for fun?) I want them to be punished because I feel like every day that they don't live in suffering knowing that their pain is because of how they have treated me and probably others is an extreme injustice and insult to injury because I feel they are smug about it and see it as confirmation that they can do whatever they want to "someone like me" and no one and nothing in the entire cosmos will object.

It gets to a point of me sincerely wanting people to die but only while knowing that they are being punished for hurting me (even over relatively minor things) and wanting them who dared to trigger any negative emotions in me to be ultimately humbled and become an example for others. I feel this is a typical power/revenge type of fantasy for bullied kids but I am a 25 year old woman and the extent of my silent repressed hatred and rage on a daily basis has gotten to be so much that I sometimes struggle to get through the workday because of how much I want people to be hurt. Former abusers as well as people around me who make me feel bad in any way to any extent.

I'm not homicidal or violent and I'm not the kind of person that anyone would imagine blowing up at anyone because I am shy and very mild-mannered. I don't even really want to confront people or to vent my feelings and redirect them through other means of expressing anger, I actually want them to suffer specifically (not necessarily by me doing anything to harm them, I don't know how to explain it) and my growing frustration and resentment is because no harm is being done to them and/or they will not correlate the harm that is coming to them with how they treated me even if bad things happen to them as "karma". I also don't want them to apologize or change their behavior and become my ally or anything, I really do have a very dark and vicious part of me that just wants them to die and never be seen heard or observed by me ever again after confirming that they regret whatever they did to hurt me (even if it was unintended on their part).

I don't like to admit to this part of myself because it feels sadistic and cruel and abusive like the people that hurt me most in the first place, but nevertheless it exists as the pent up rage of the injustice of my entire lifetime of the primary abusers and the community of enablers and proxy abusers who were empowered to "punish" me for things I didn't even do, for things that weren't wrong, and for simply existing especially if I refused to passively allow myself to be harmed without trying to advocate for myself or hold abusers to account. They were empowered to convince me that I was in the wrong for my own self-preservation and that I should be as okay with me being harmed and an acceptable target of any and everything they wanted to subject me to as everyone else was or else I was a terrible person and the real abuser and only hurt even worse to punish me for loving myself and wanting to survive. I despise them all and the fact that they are still alive without regret and without their life being a testament to the consequences of what they did is a constant torment to me.

I have had moments where I felt I could not be at peace until everyone who has ever hurt me has died, I feel this that intensely and feel I have a lot more energy for spiting my abusers and enemies than for pursuing my own goals based on heartfelt passion or joy. I am not writing this to revel in these feelings or seek validation for them nor to normalize this kind of malice, but because I have started to integrate my shadow self and accept the reality of my "dark side" that truly feels this way and which I don't know how to actually be at peace with if there is no acceptable way to enact vengeance on the people that I hate or retreat from society and stop being entangled in interactions that will fuel this deep-seated reactive "bloodlust".

Has anyone else dealt with extreme repressed or distorted "fight" instincts and hatred/rage/vindictiveness? How do you cope with this and release these feelings without harm to oneself or others? I do not believe that forgiveness or letting go works because it only feels like more confirmation that they can get away with anything and because their target is me it doesn't matter and they don't have to "pay" at all but instead the responsibility is on me to allow my own pain and be as okay with me being hurt while they walk away unharmed as they are, which is the opposite of healing for me. How do you get closure without a sense of justice or vengeance, or how did you channel a desperation for justice and/or vengeance into something productive or healing?

[Desert Flower]

Hi livingdeadgirl, I read your post and I just want to reply because I don't want you to feel alone. What you write is very difficult to relate to for me, me being on the other end of the 4F spectrum (fawning) but it sounds to me that this is a reaction to the awful stuff that happened to you, even if it may not be a nice reaction. I do respect your honesty a lot and I think you're very brave writing this. From my point of view (not an expert), it sounds like it would be good to find a way to get this anger out there in a way that's not harming you or others. And writing about it here might just be the start of that. I hope it helps a little bit.

I do relate to the anger you feel for the people that hurt you who continue their lives fine and happy, and we're here feeling not all right at all, while they were the ones that caused this and we did nothing to deserve this at all. It's just not fair at all, to put it mildly. Your anger is justified. And if you can channel it, it might be the way to healing. At least I hope so.

[Beijaflor57]

Has anyone else dealt with extreme repressed or distorted "fight" instincts and hatred/rage/vindictiveness? How do you cope with this and release these feelings without harm to oneself or others? I do not believe that forgiveness or letting go works because it only feels like more confirmation that they can get away with anything and because their target is me it doesn't matter and they don't have to "pay" at all but instead the responsibility is on me to allow my own pain and be as okay with me being hurt while they walk away unharmed as they are, which is the opposite of healing for me. How do you get closure without a sense of justice or vengeance, or how did you channel a desperation for justice and/or vengeance into something productive or healing?

Hi livingdeadgirl...I actually can relate to these feelings, though I don't share them very often with others. Most people who know me would see me as this 'sweet,' unassuming, somewhat shy person. However, I've always had a strong sense of right and wrong/ just and unjust, so, even at a young age, when I realized what was happening to me was very, very wrong, and very, very unjust, I fought back--not physically (although, I did often engage in physical fights with my narc sister, who was my primary abuser)--but internally and in my attitude and stance toward those who hurt me. For many years, I carried a lot of hatred and resentment toward my narc sister and toward my mother, who enabled her and neglected me. I distanced myself, emotionally, from both of them. I do have fawning tendencies as well, but when it comes to legitimate injustice, I have a strong fight response. Not just for myself, but for others. I don't think this, in and of itself, is wrong, but rather a form of healthy, righteous indignation. So don't feel ashamed that you also carry these feelings.

As to how to get closure, especially when it appears that those who harmed us 'are getting away with it,' I admit that I too struggle with this...still, after so many years. I've forgiven my mother over and over, and confronted her as well, and I forgave my sister for what she did to me when we were younger, thinking, for the longest time, that it was due to childish immaturity---until, recently, when it became clear she never grew up and was still abusing me, I've had to forgive her all over again. But I admit I still carry some anger toward her and my mother. I don't know if the anger will ever completely go away. But, to me, forgiveness doesn't mean never having anger or saying it's ok what they did...absolutely not. It just means I'm letting go of needing to personally take vengeance, recognizing that I harm myself more than them by holding onto too many negative feelings. For me, this letting go actually empowers me and tells me I have the agency and ability to overcome the damage done to me by others. That what they did doesn't define me.

I also believe, despite how it may outwardly appear, that our abusers and those who have hurt us don't ultimately 'get away with it.' I believe in a higher power (i.e., God, but I won't discuss my personal beliefs here) that will ultimately hold everyone accountable. This gives me comfort and helps me let go of vengeful and vindictive feelings.

But I recognize that none of this is easy. It's not easy for me. But just know that you're not alone in your difficult feelings. 

[Kizzie]

Pete Walker spoke about our need to anger by beating a pillow or screaming in the shower to let it out, not with the intent of actually hurting our abusers or anyone else. Letting our anger come to the surface is all about reigniting our self-protective instincts which in most of us have been stuffed way down in order to survive. If we got angry around our abusers most time it would mean more abuse would rain down upon us.

There is a good essay here about repression of emotion by Pete Walker - https://pete-walker.com/recoverEmotionalNature.htm. It's all about recovering repressed feelings so that we may live as full human beings.

And here is another article about Pete's grieving processes, one of which includes "angering" - https://wiseandshinezine.com/2024/01/11/pete-walkers-four-grieving-processes-angering-crying-verbal-ventilating-and-passively-feeling/. 

"Although the name may sound like it means becoming angry or making someone else angry, "angering" as the "grieving" process is actually a matter of feeling and, crucially, expressing anger that already in some form exists. Not just talking about it, but actively and outwardly emoting that anger through actions other than mere words.There is more to this angering, including important considerations of toward whom the anger gets directed and for what, as well as the proviso that the emoting be channeled so as not to be harming others or oneself." 

So, IMO good on you for expressing those dark feelings that we so often keep to ourselves. The caveat of course by Pete and here at OOTS is that the angering leads to healing and not any kind of actual action to hurt anyone. Writing about it here is one good way to get it out. Many people write letters to those they are angry at but never send (https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?board=43.0), and or in their recovery journals. (https://www.cptsd.org/forum/index.php?board=61.0). 

[dollyvee]

Hey livingdeadgirl,

I think it is brave for you to share that as healing is not all puppies and rainbows. You've stated that you're not going to act on what you're feeling and the knowledge that it is on some level "wrong." As Richard Schwartz says, all parts matter and we have to meet the with compassion and curiosity for why they are the way they are.

I also thought a lot about karma when I was in my early 20s when people would treat me badly and, like you, came from a scapegoating family where I wasn't treated very well. I wasn't taught to have boundaries or stick up for myself and I think that this is where this likely stemmed from. This was the only defence I thought I had. It wasn't until I started learning about healthy boundaries that and standing up for myself that some of this anger lessened. I think on some level, you're proctecting yourself in a way that you learned as a child, to people please/fawn etc on one hand (be complacent, do what people ask etc), but also trying to protect your "Self" on the other, and to have space for yourself. I think what helped me was to start looking at situations where I was "giving my power away," and to start saying no, and putting boundaries in place as hard as it is.

Sending you support,
dolly

[Chart]

I think what we are doing here on the forum is very hard. Whether we are expressing our struggle, or whether we are witnessing (through reading) the experience of someone else's struggle, it's hard.

Triggering is a very tricky thing. Part of healing is disconnecting and re-creating new neural pathways. Triggering is activating old pathways. So how can you fight against something that in order to change it you have to look at it, but by looking at it you're actually being counterproductive to healing? It's a Catch-22.

There's just no easy way through this.

[Cascade]

Has anyone else dealt with extreme repressed or distorted "fight" instincts and hatred/rage/vindictiveness? How do you cope with this and release these feelings without harm to oneself or others?
...
How do you get closure without a sense of justice or vengeance, or how did you channel a desperation for justice and/or vengeance into something productive or healing?

Hi livingdeadgirl,
First, I love your name.  I know the sentiment exactly of living a non-life.

Mostly, thank you for your bravery and courage to share all your thoughts with us.  I have also had similar feelings.  I have raged and imagined choking my father, physically getting down on the floor with my hands clasped around an air-throat.  I have imagined him going to prison and being the cell mate of the biggest, roughest, meanest convict possible.  I never confronted my parents, will never have legal justice.  All I could do was go no-contact with them, at different points, during the last years of their lives.

The coping and closure are completely different matters.  For me, the rage kept escalating and escalating.  It was all I felt 24/7 for the first year after I unexpectedly recalled the worst of the sexual abuse.  The anger started seeping into everything... work, my relationship with my cats, interactions with strangers, everything.  The only thing that started getting me out of it was realizing it was a way to keep punishing myself, that I was really hurting myself a lot by feeling only anger, and not having any compassion for myself or comforting myself.  

I'm still trying to figure out how to get angry in healthy ways.  I think I pretty much started focusing away from the anger, understanding they're not worth all that energy of mine, and asking what do I need?  I totally get that might not be where you're at, or be what might work for you.

I hope the other side discussions haven't caused you to run away from us.  I'm interested to hear what you're going through and hope we can help each other deal with our anger in better ways.  It's a tough thing for me to figure out, too.  I'm sure my anger's still in there hanging around somewhere!

Here's a hug if it might feel good. 
   -Cascade

[Lonewolf86]

Hi Livingdeadgirl,

I'm new on this forum and your post caught my eye so I read it.  I've also read the comments and I want to share with you that while I don't experience what you describe, I can relate to it.  I have definitely felt hatred toward people.  In fact it's kind of a go-to place inside me (my wounded inner child?) but I also feel love toward other people.  I definitely relate to feeling hatred toward my family (for what they did and are still doing to me, and the "injustice" of it all) but here again I also feel love toward them.

What I hear most is your pain and I have nothing but empathy for you because I know how much this hurts.  You are very courageous to make this post and I don't agree with the poster who was trying to shame you for what you said. It was clear to me you weren't planning on acting on these feelings. Also, I totally disagree with criticizing the length of your post. Nobody forced anyone to read it.

I want to echo that Pete Walkers book and his ideas about using our anger/rage to access deeper grief and healing has been very helpful to me.  He describes anger and rage as being a sort of gateway to healing.  There's some sections that would probably be interesting/helpful to you if you haven't already read it such as "thought stopping", thought substitution and correction and other ideas. 

I'm no expert but this sounds like progress.. the fact that you recognize this stuff in yourself and the fact that you want to change it.  You can do it too, but it will just take time and patience.  I wish you the very best!

Also if you follow the bible at all.. this passage brings me a great deal of comfort Romans 12:19

[AphoticAtramentous]

Hey livingdeadgirl,
I relate to so much of what you say. Thank you for sharing and being honest about it all. Too many people ignore or pretend these dark sides don't exist and I think ignoring it can be very counterproductive. To see this being raised by others is very refreshing and validating. I have these similar thoughts, but would never dream to enact on said thoughts.

For me though it has helped a lot to write down my violent fantasies, make up fictional stories of harm, pain, torture, suffering, and death. Although it doesn't punish them directly, nor send down a lightning bolt of divine justice... it does help to take away the anger a little bit. Whatever you write in though, ensure it's locked up and not easily accessible by anyone else. At a glance it might look a little... concerning, to someone who doesn't have the full context. Since I've started writing these things, I've felt a lot more... at peace. Every time I write an entry it feels like I can breathe again, and I'm no longer worried of accidentally lashing out at someone around me.

Regards,
Aphotic.