What to think...then and now

[Dyess]

Is it wrong to think a terrible childhood by todays standards, wasn't that bad? I didn't realize how bad the childhood was, it was normal for me, but the T feels different and is trying to make me understand that there were things that were wrong but not my fault. What's the point of carrying hatred, anger and resentment because your childhood was not perfect?

[smg]

Hi Trace,

It sounds like you're struggling to make some decisions about how to understand your past. That may take some time and effort on your part, but I think it's really good work to do. Where you're at isn't right or wrong, and maybe it's midway through a process.

I wonder if your therapist has been expressing some concern that maybe the story of your childhood that you're holding in your conscious mind doesn't match the way your heart feels about the same events.

For me, having the happy family myth in my conscious mind, and this void of sadness and self-hate in my heart created horrible conflict in me, and a constant, unhappy focus on the issue. How I really felt would burst out of me in a lot of illness and some passive aggressive acting out. I would then try to compensate with fawning. I would also be deeply threatened and angered by other people's self-interested behaviour because it contrasted with the fawning that I was instinctively forcing myself to do. In short, it was an awful way for me to live. I've found much more peace by moving toward knowing how I feel, matching my story to my feelings, and letting my feelings guide my behaviour (this is all still a work in progress).

Have you and your therapist identified some somatic issues or unhealthy behaviour patterns that may indicate your heart's truth, possibly in opposition to the "wasn't that bad" story that your conscious mind knows?

Alice Miller (www.alice-miller.com) wrote a lot about the consequences of suppressed feelings relating to childhood maltreatment. As I understand it (mashing up Miller's ideas with other reading I've done), acknowledging a feeling, understanding the basis of it and responding to it, will resolve that feeling (at least that instance of it) and free you from carrying it around.

:-)

smg

[Dyess]

Thanks for responding smg,
Well my T and I just started talking about this, but she seems to want to go deeper in the childhood part, talking about some developmental issues may have occurred. I zone out during a lot of the session so I just remember bits and pieces.  With all the trauma we have to choose from, to explore, why childhood so much?
<<Have you and your therapist identified some somatic issues or unhealthy behaviour patterns that may indicate your heart's truth, possibly in opposition to the "wasn't that bad" story that your conscious mind knows? >> I don't understand this, can you explain?
But if you don't feel like it was maltreatment would you have "suppressed feelings" that would be negative, or bad?

[DaisyMae]

Hi Trace,

I am working on the same right now.  Digging into my childhood to figure out how it affected my development and how I understand and regulate my emotions (which I numb, disassociate, and feel not much at all) as an adult.  So, to figure out why I think everything is my fault and why I do not like or love myself.  It is getting difficult, trying to be honest about it all.  The painful part about it is that I can remember all the events in detail but treat it so objectively that I still can't feel anything towards the people that abused me, neglected me.... All I still feel is the shame and hate for myself.  But I think that the reason that they want us to go that far back is so that we can understand how that abuse and neglect formed our emotionally responses and how we handled the traumas and abuses that we had to deal with as we got older....  does that seem right? 

DM

[Dyess]

Dm you maybe right. I think I am just still confused on how one traumatic event started all this and how this and my childhood are connected, if they are. If we are going to have to go through each trauma and dissect it this could take a very long time. My T and I are working through the PTSD work book, have you seen that. We just started, it's a lot of reading, some exercises. My T wants me to learn how to ground myself so I will not keep floating away in thought during our sessions also she wants me to find a safe place before we get into deeper conversations. I guess that's a good thing. Do you know anything about this stuff?

[DaisyMae]

Hi Trace,

I know what you mean.  Unfortunately, my NC father made sure that I was conditioned to believe that it was my fault because I was a girl.  Southern Baptists.... the whole Adam and Eve thing.... Eve tempted Adam with the apple?  Women are evil and tempt man, it is our fault.  So, unfortunately, I can see how my childhood development is connected.  It is my fault that I was molested, coerced, or raped because of how I dressed, danced, or just talked to a boy....  Since my T will not really give a diagnosis and has only said that "I might be a little PTSD", I do not really know anything about this stuff.  Only what I have read in Pete Walkers book and a few others.  We are working on DBT right now and I started with the Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (but it was not real structured), but he has not suggested the PTSD work book.  I know you have just started but is the work book and excercises helping?  DM

[Dyess]

Well I don't mind taking some of the responsibility but not all of it. I put myself in situations I should have known could be wrong.
Can't tell if the book and exercises are working yet. But do some research on grounding and see if there's anything online that may offer some exercises you could try. Surely someone on this site knows of some places. Maybe they will add something soon.
I think too timing is a big factor in counseling. Right after I found my Dad I started seeing an EAP counselor who's cure for everything is EMDR. I was in such a fog I couldn't even concentrate on that and it even made things worse by opening doors that needed to stay shut. I think EMDR at this point may work even better, I don't know, just a thought.

[smg]

Hi Trace,

"<<Have you and your therapist identified some somatic issues or unhealthy behaviour patterns that may indicate your heart's truth, possibly in opposition to the "wasn't that bad" story that your conscious mind knows? >> I don't understand this, can you explain?"

Okay, I'll try my best to explain. (I find it hard to articulate some of this stuff.) I should start by saying that my experience is primarily emotional neglect/abuse and I've responded/protected myself by not allowing myself to get into a lot of situations/life experiences. So no violence or big-T-Trauma.

I had allergies and asthma and frequent illness that has mostly gone away now that I'm very low contact with my FOO. They reoccur when my mother shows up, or when I have a long-lasting EF. My FOO called their behaviour loving and told me that it was my problem, my defect that I was unhappy despite their "love and support." What they told me was that I needed to toughen up and have fewer feelings, because what I was feeling was inappropriate, and if I couldn't get rid of my feelings, I needed to at least never act on them. To live with my FOO, I went along with the myth that I had a loving and supportive family; and to accept that myth, I also believed that I was defective, just like they said, because otherwise I wouldn't be sad and frightened. I didn't know how to honour my feelings, and use them as evidence to challenge the family myth. I couldn't listen to my feelings, so I think that the physical symptions were my body screaming that there was a problem.

I don't know if you're going through anything similar.

I think that I'm reading in your posts that part of you wants to call your childhood bad, and redirect some anger away from yourself and toward the perpetrators; another part says that there was no maltreatment, and the blame lies on you.

For me, there was a conflict that I had to resolve to find any degree of peace. In order to stop hating myself and believing that I was defective, I had to give up the idea that my family was loving and supportive. The process of questioning was very difficult for me.

If you're going through something similar, then there's no right or wrong, just settling on what best honours your experience and brings you peace.

smg

[Dyess]

I get headaches a lot and muscle tension. My back knots up so bad you can physically see the knots and they are so painful for the chiro to work on. That's where I've always carried my stress, in my back and neck. My back is like a board, hard as a rock.
SMG you may be right about the feelings about childhood, in both situations. I wish we could get through the healing process without going through the childhood. When I started counseling, after finding dad, I had no idea we would end up in my childhood. May not have even started if I had known that.

[Dyess]

Also, not sure if this goes here or not. I noticed when I went to my VA appointment I have developed a deeper social anxiety stemming from the following two situations. Which I didn't know were a problem until I got out.
1. All the deaths of police officers, in the line of duty. After 18 years of LE I realized that one day I may run into some undesirable person that I arrested and now with social media it would be so much easier to find me. So I'm very on guard about that.
2.The soldiers being killed in Chattanooga, TN. I had my VA appointment with the Psychiatrist on the 20th. I got there early. Sitting in the lobby with all those strange people was really wearing on me. I felt myself pulling in tighter and tighter. Then there was an automatic door right at the lobby that lead to the outside. Every time that thing opened and closed I flinched and was waiting for someone to come in shooting. How do you stop these things from worrying you when social media and the news are always on? I knew the VA was a trigger, I used to take Dad there to pick up his prescriptions. My gut tightens every time I walk past the pharmacy.
I guess this will go away with time. But I hate those surprise triggers, makes me want to stay isolated even more.

[Dyess]

Counseling can be so confusing. When I told my T I was going to see a Psychiatrist at the VA she was not that moved by that. I asked her if I should go and she said if I was happy with our sessions and felt okay about my PCP prescribing my meds that should be all I need. But to go and see if there was something I needed from them. So I went, wasn't a good experience, above posts, my meds were increased based on my physical and emotional state right then, which is not like I am all the time. So I decided not to increase the meds and not go back to the VA. Just not worth it and there really wasn't anything she could do for me. My sole purpose for even going to the VA was to get my prescriptions should my insurance be cancelled, that's all. But when I went for the initial visit, the doctor there scheduled me with the Psychiatrist.  Okay, back on track, so my T wants me to follow up with the Psychiatrist now? That kind of blew me away, so much I couldn't even respond back to her. But now that I have thought about it I want to know why and what changed her thinking on that. Next session topic. Wish they would explain these things instead of just throwing it at you for you dwell on.

[Dyess]

Anyone else devastated about how long it takes to get a handle on this? Maybe I was dealing with some of this before dad's death, but I seemed to be handling okay, I was pretty much happy with life. The one act, dad's suicide, caused all this to surface and become such a set back in life. I don't know who I am anymore, don't know how to get back to the old me because I have forgotten what she did to be happy, his death sucked the life out of mine.  I think counseling has only made it worse "digging up bones" During the past week I woke from a nightmare about witnessing my Grandfather's death. I woke up screaming NO! NO! when I got up and started remembering the dream. My Grandfather was laying at the bottom of the steps, a lot like how I found Dad, and there was a full view glass door, leading outside, right behind him. Someone kept trying to open the door and hitting him. He was a large built man and he filled this space at the bottom of the stairs. That's when I was yelling NO! Then it dawned on me where these stairs were and they were the ones at the counselors office. *?  Then had another dream about finding Dad and woke up crying. I'm tired.

[Dutch Uncle]

Anyone else devastated about how long it takes to get a handle on this? Maybe I was dealing with some of this before dad's death, but I seemed to be handling okay, I was pretty much happy with life. The one act, dad's suicide, caused all this to surface and become such a set back in life.
[...]
During the past week I woke from a nightmare about witnessing my Grandfather's death. [...] My Grandfather was laying at the bottom of the steps, a lot like how I found Dad, [...]  Then had another dream about finding Dad and woke up crying. I'm tired.

I have a few questions. There's no obligation for you to answer them.
- Did you witness grandfather's death only in the dream, or was that a real-life event?
- Did you also witness your father's death? How came it to be you that found him?
- How long ago was it that your father died?

To me (no psychologist in any way) it seems you are dealing primarily with grief here, grief over the loss of your father. I've read somewhere that the grieving process over the loss of a loved one (or a loved job, or a cherished relationship or other such events) can take 2 to 7 years. That's a general accepted time-frame, the article said. 'Normal', for lack of a better word. It fits with my experiences.
Often, this is not acknowledged as such, and especially 'outsiders' have a (perceived) attitude of "aren't you over it yet?", and/or the bereaved tell this to themselves.
It's not much of a comfort, I know, but I thought I'd share that piece of information anyway.

I think counseling has only made it worse "digging up bones"

This is a recurring theme in your posts in this thread.
Perhaps at the moment you yourself want to focus first on the loss of your dad, and the undoubtedly shocking experience of finding him. Perhaps you should insist you want to deal with that first with your T.

For me personally, it's fine to let the past rest, at least for a while longer, while I address my problems with my FOO in the now, or much nearer past. Whatever there still is 'in me' from a more distant past I have been carrying along for long now, a few weeks or months more will not make that big a difference, if there's also FOO-POO to deal with in the present.
There are certainly horrible things from my past I have already made 'peace' with, have 'closure' on. In this respect I agree with you that "digging up old bones" is not always a necessity. To keep with the analogy: I've already cleared a few graves, picked up the skeletons and transported the bones to the ossuary. I have no need to "dig" through the heap there  in order to piece the skeletons back together.

But that's just my 2 cents.

[Dyess]

******Trigger*******
******Trigger*******
Dutch Uncle,
I witnessed my Grandfathers death. We were walking down a hallway, going back to the den where the others were, I was walking right behind him within hands reach for a 5 year old. Our house was old and the bathroom and basement door were beside each other and for some reason the basement door opened inward, as did the bathroom door. We think he thought he was opening the bathroom door and just stepped in but it was the basement and he fell violently to his death , to the bottom. It was a horrible sound , he was a big man. My dad came and turned on the light and there my grandfather laid at the bottom of the steps, lifeless with blood coming out of his head.  It was a lot for a 5 year old to take in.
My father's death, I was at work and we couldn't reach him. So I went to his house and found him behind a fence, gun shot to the head. Dad died in Oct. 2013
These images are still so fresh in my mind and reappear sometimes in a different theme. The end is always the same though.

Not sure but I think the counselor is "digging up bones" to try to find some idea on how I deal with death. Not sure though.

[Dutch Uncle]

I'm so sorry for your losses, Trace. My condolences.

So your dad passed away fairly recent. I think it's perfectly OK to still mourn his loss, and have difficulty accepting him gone, to grief over it. I think a violent death often makes things harder, especially as you've seen the physical injuries so hard and uncensored so up-close personally, it's so confrontational.

Being so close to your Granddad's death, to witness it all as a five year old, the whole event, must have been devastating, and has drawn heavily on your coping skills. I'm so sorry for your loss of your granddad at such a young age. It's hard you had to witness such a tragic accident.