Paying It Forward Discussion-What are your experiences?

[C.]

Something that has been on my mind a lot, especially since beginning recovery, is the idea of  "Paying It Forward." 

I want to give an example from my own life.  For about 10 years I was fortunate to have a home and enjoyed having friends and family stop by to visit.  I often would share food and meals.  Fast forward to a few years ago when I hit rock bottom.  I was low on food and lonely.  I found that I had friends who gladly shared their food and company with me.  These were not necessarily the same people, but somehow it all worked out.  I helped others when I could.  And others helped me when they could.  Different people and different times, but oddly it felt like the same.  Like a special kind of unity of human spirit...

I've felt like that a lot during my recovery.  Somehow the right person at the right time would help me.  Then someone else might need something from me and I would be in a place to give at that time.  It happens IRL and on this forum for me.  It makes the world feel like a much better place.

This got me thinking that I'd like to hear about other people's experiences of Paying it Forward.  What are some experiences in your life or on the forum of "Paying it Forward?"  Some thoughts you might have about this topic?

[Dutch Uncle]

I'll reply a bit more elaborate on this, since I do have some experiences in this.
For now I want to share a Dutch saying: "Wie goed doet, goed ontmoet." Which translates as "What goes around, comes around." (Literally: "(S)He who does good, will meet up with good(ness).")

[Dutch Uncle]

I got one! 

Today I got a postcard.
This was written on it (in Dutch of course):
"My inattentiveness around X-mas time is such that nobody sends me cards anymore. The card you have send me felt like a cool drink on a hot summer's day.
You probably won't guess it, but this is a valentine's card for you from me."
[name]

So my X-mas card to her has been "paying it forward".

BTW: I'm the only one in my friends-circle who sends X-mas cards. It's been a long tradition for me, and I love shopping for them, so everybody get's a 'unique' one. Once upon a time (Grandpa speaks) it was very common to send and receive cards. Nowadays I hardly get any myself.
It won't stop me. 
The only 'problem' I see arising that fewer and fewer are made. This year I had to resort to sending out the same design to several people (I'm picky on the design  ). Oh well, it's the thought that counts.
QED. 
edit: I want to amend the last bit in respect to "Paying it Forward":
It's the thought together with the follow-up action taken that counts.
QED.

[Dutch Uncle]

Right.

I got another one.

Many, many years ago (I can't even remember how much. Must be a decade or so) I bailed a friend of mine out, financially. He was on the verge of being kicked out of his home (the movers were actually at his door) and so he needed MONEY!!!!

I had heard of situations like this before, and how they could screw up friendships/relationships/any-ships-at-all as I pondered for a sec and decided: Nah, I got the money he needs, it's not even that big an amount (relatively speaking. It was a substantial sum on the whole), I'll pay up, and whenever he pays it back it's OK, it's even OK if he doesn't. Friendship >> money.

In the meanwhile I have had a bit off a fallout with him. Started about three years ago. Haven't seen him for exactly two years now.

Now I am in dire need of money. Electricity and gas may be cut off any moment.
So I phoned the gas/electricity guys (actually it was a women) what I needed to do to make sure I wouldn't get cut off. "Pay the outstanding bills + 1000$ 'deposit'. "
*? The outstanding bills... ehrrm I might scrape by, but the 1000$ deposit? No way.

So i dared to call this 'old friend' up, told him my story, reminded him I bailed him out once, and asked if he could scrape up the cash to bail ME out this time. ( I felt very humiliated to do this. Oh the SHAME!)
I got his answering machine and he called me back about an hour later.
Very helpful. He will pay everything in full. Now. This very moment.
No questions asked on how 'the score' is nowadays: he just payed up.

I'll meet him tomorrow at a pub. And probably tell each other what we have been going through the past two years.


Paying it forward. No questions asked.

[Kizzie]

Wow Dutch that's quite the story and I would be interested to hear how the meetup goes.

[Dutch Uncle]

I will. I forgot to write here that as far as I remember he only ever made one repayment, a quarter of the whole amount or so. But all this I don't recall in detail, not even the original sum. I had a successful business for years, so I couldn't be bothered that much. He had an unsuccessful business that he eventually had to stop, many years later.
So it also will be 'settling the debts' financially as well, I guess.

Plans have changed a bit: he's taking me out for diner. 

[Kizzie]

Even better - enjoy!

[C.]

I agree.  Great story and I look forward to hearing more 

[Dutch Uncle]

Quick update: We met at 7 at his house. Toddler son was there, whom I had only seen as a baby before. Fun little kid, very sociable. Me and friend chatted a bit, in between toddler drawing attention from this stranger who had entered his home. His wife came in late (15 minutes or so. Never mind) with daughter (6-ish) whom I knew from before. Very sociable as well. Played a game wit her and dad/friend.

Went out for dinner after that. Talked for ages. Did indeed catch up on the two years that has passed. Emotionally it felt we had met the day before. Parted half past midnight. Many  and Took the subway home. Home now. 

Apart from some talk about getting in (and out) of financial trouble/dysfunction like I'm in now (and he was then) not a penny was discussed.

It was a great get-together. We'll be seeing more of each other in the future. We promised. I intend to keep that promise. I think he will too.

[Dutch Uncle]

I'll elaborate a bit further on the post above.
I was quite open about the struggle I'm in. I haven't said I have cPTSD, but I did tell him on me going no contact with DramaSis and DramaMama, by problems with dad etc. He was already aware of some of this, as the last time we met at my place I had a family picture upside-down on the wall, as a signal/reminder for me to "get a different perspective on the various family-relations". 
At which time I had mainly talked about dad, apparently, as he asked about him after I told my NC story.
I told him about me going to the psychologists and taking the SCID-II test, and having joined up on a forum to to have a support-group to discuss these issues.

He took it quite well, asked some questions, but was quite validating overall (at least not dismissive, which is a  )

He also could relate to plenty himself. He told me about him going to a psych as well (after his "could you bail me out, Dutch" episode a decade ago), other past and present troubles/struggles, him now having to deal with an ex of his wife that he called a Narcissist (which might well be true given the stories he told. His wife and ex have a few kids to share custody with.) He also spilled some other beans, for which there is no need to get into details.

Apart from that we also talked about more 'mondaine' aspects of his life: work, his kids with his wife, he asked me how I experienced the carnage in the near-east (since I used to work there extensively) etc.
I guess it's easy to see how we filled 5 hours + after not seeing each other for two years.

It's amazing how some people can relate to others, simply because they have (had) similar 'secrets' in their life experiences. And have been reluctant to share the full extend of it with others. As we on this board all can relate to as well, I figure.

He'll mail me with some ideas for looking for jobs, and will keep tabs if I'm not back to indecision.
All in all, a wonderful reunion. Hadn't thought in the world we would reunite so strongly during the past two years of absence from each others lives. 

[Kizzie]

That's amazing Dutch, glad it went so well   

[Wildfire]

Love your examples ! Such a great thread idea.

I'm quite compassionate so I always try to be as kind as possible and go out of my way to help others, unless I am in an emotional '* everyone' flashback. I find it generally helps build positive relationships with others and others hold you in high regard...kind of like a basic karma thing. It's funny, I recently went back to the house where I lived with my * ex, and the new housemate was complaining about how inconsiderate he was and was saying how our old housemate really missed me and how I helped keep ex inline and pushed him to consider others. The new guy couldn't stand ex, whereas he said I was 'such a sweetheart' and we still chat today. It made me think about the contrast of how treating people with kindness and respect v being a general inconsiderate, selfish mofo, will lead to very different relationships and outcomes.

My friends really helped me after ex went psycho for the last time: I was super upset and they let me stay at their place rent free for a couple of months, cooked me food, hung out with me and were just generally there for me .

I think making a note of other's kindness is great for dealing with the mistrust and outer critic that come with C-PTSD and making a note of your own kindness and good actions is a great way of countering the self-hate, shame and criticism . I want to write a blog post on this topic!

[Kizzie]

... making a note of your own kindness and good actions is a great way of countering the self-hate, shame and criticism

Exactly!  I remember the exact moment when I knew I was really in recovery.  My NM was trying to make me feel badly and I shouted at her that I was not a bad daughter, that I was a good and decent person and walked out.  It's not always easy to get the critical side to calm down but I go to that memory and it really helps. 

So with respect to paying it forward - I would have to say that I pay the compassion I have received and learned in recovery forward to others here and in daily life. 

I think that a blog about the kindness of self and others would be a great way of paying it forward Wildfire 

[Wildfire]

... making a note of your own kindness and good actions is a great way of countering the self-hate, shame and criticism

Exactly!  I remember the exact moment when I knew I was really in recovery.  My NM was trying to make me feel badly and I shouted at her that I was not a bad daughter, that I was a good and decent person and walked out.  It's not always easy to get the critical side to calm down but I go to that memory and it really helps. 

So with respect to paying it forward - I would have to say that I pay the compassion I have received and learned in recovery forward to others here and in daily life. 

I think that a blog about the kindness of self and others would be a great way of paying it forward Wildfire 

Aw that story is wonderful   ! Awesome, you do such a great job sharing your kindness and insights for all of us here ! I'm always thankful for how trauma didn't make my heart hard but drove me to develop more kindness and compassion, I think the same could be said of  you ^^.

^^ I want to start a blog, I write anyway but I really want to do something to really help people.

[Kizzie]

    and       Wildfire, go for it