Self-soothing, stopping destructive ways

[rain.brown]

I was just reading the very helpful post about self-soothing. This is an area I am struggling with. I use food, and the over eating of it to sooth. I use prescription meds combined with alcohol to sooth and I use cigarettes. I hate all of these. They help for the moment make it worse in the long run and only continue my self-hatred. How do you get out of such a loop? Really get out it. Stop doing it and turn to things that are positively soothing. This is a lot harder than these simplified questions make it sound.

[sanmagic7]

i, too, have calmed and comforted myself in most of the ways you've mentioned (i was never big on pills), but the rest of what you've talked about was right up my alley.  i've managed to do away with the alcohol and cigarettes.  food continues to be a problem at times, but that is diminishing.

you're absolutely right, this is much more difficult than your questions imply.  all the self-help 'recipes'  i've read about stopping this or that have never worked for me.  i think it's because they're often based on logic, and with c-ptsd, there is no logic.    while i've attended 12-step groups in the past, they were never truly the answer for me, although for many, they do the trick.  it may be a way for you to explore when you're ready.

ultimately, what has allowed me to stop my substance abuse has been becoming healthier in my mind and spirit, more self-caring about my body and my physical health, and more mindful of what i really want to do to and/or for myself.  last dec., i was on the verge of pneumonia.  i've been an on and off smoker for 50 yrs, including not smoking for 15 years at one point.  i've smoked through illnesses before.  this time, something clicked, and i decided that my lungs just couldn't take it anymore, and i didn't want to do that to them anymore.  to this day i feel very strong about this decision, and can't see myself smoking again (other times i had quit, i always left that door open.  this time seems different.)   

alcohol was the same.  20 yrs. drinking, 15 yrs. clean, then back to it for 5 yrs. or so.  my hub is in recovery, and when we got together 15 yrs. ago, i decided enough.  food has been more gradual, but it's getting better.

my point is that it's a process within yourself.  when you are ready, for whatever reason, you will stop.  if you need help, go get it.  if you've tried and can't make it alone, then you need help.  in reality, the quitting is the easy part.  i know, cuz i've quit substances many, many times, especially cigarettes.  the staying quit is the challenge.  but, it's do-able.  when you're ready to do what needs to be done to quit because you'll do whatever it takes not to abuse yourself in this manner anymore, when it becomes scarier to go back to using than it is to move forward without your substance of choice, you'll do it.  and, it won't be as hard as you thought.  when you're ready.

i didn't do this all at once, all substances at once, and still haven't quite finished - i still self-harm with food at times - but you have the choice, you have the power to pick and choose what you want to be quit of and when.  i, personally, don't think there's a lot of logic to it.  there is self-awareness, grief, sadness, and a realization that this is simply not something you want to do anymore, along with a willingness to do whatever it takes, whatever help suits you or fits for you.  some people work recovery in one way, some in another.  i know people who swear by 12-step programs, others who swear by finding a spiritual path, still others who swear by friends and family.  you will find your own way when you're ready.  my own opinion.  best to you on this journey of recovery.

[Sienna]

rain.brown. It definitely is very hard.
Im going to put a trigger warning for this post.

I struggle too with self soothing, and using unhealthy things to soothe.
I also used to bing eat. Shop. I drink alcohol. I flee into activity sometimes.
I smoke. and many more.

I asked my T what i could do to stop smoking. A bit worry for me.
She said that looking at and working through the triggers, and why i use smoking will help.
But i think its more than that.
I have been reading, *The flight from intimacy, healing your relationships * counter dependnacey- the other side of codependancey*book, about over coming counter dependancy.

This book talks about how self soothing behaviours start from the early childs years of attachment.
Co dependant - counter dependent- it talks about both and how these attempts at self soothing start.

Possible triggers here:
In the book, it talks about addictions and using these things, as ways to self soothe.
It goes back to attachment patterns, according to the book.
In short, it says that, we never learned how to self soothe.

For me, the belief that i am on trial for my life, that i deserve to be punished and reminded of how shameful and worthless i am, even though i never asked to be born, is a belief i have, i realised, reading the book.
The only thing i had that i could attach to instead of a parent growing up, was that belief.
So i continue with the self destruction.
It makes sense to me, that, if your parents / caregivers, were abusive and neglectful, you would model self soothing from them, and you would end up with self soothing that is abusive to you. Maybe even neglectful ie. through not eating for example.

The book also says, that, the things we use to self soothe, drink, cigerates, etc. are our substitute for our mother. The cigerates, (any damaging attempt to self soothe), is the mother.
We reach for those things to comfort us, just as a child would normally reach for their mother, we set them aside, and then return to them later when we need comforting, as a child returns to his mother.
The alcohol and cigerates and food etc. etc. provide feelings of comfort that our parents did not provide for us.

We have no internal mothering voice to self soothe with. (We should have a mothers nurturing voice that we internalised that is now our own)

It said that we need to grieve the mother we never had, and that we never will have, in order for us to not need to use damaging ways to self soothe.
Instead of attaching to mother, we attach to objects.
It said too, that, because we were not able to internalise a nurturing motherly voice that should come up when we need to self soothe, the things we do to soothe, which are unhealthy, only offer temporary fixes.
Thats why we cant stop smoking, drinking etc.

I found that quite upsetting and shocking to read. I think that grieving and developing your own internal comforting voice, and learning how to re-parent yourself like the book says, may be the only way.

It says that a lot of these programmes, even therapists, fail to work with clients on the very origin of their unhealthy attempts at self soothing and i wonder if my T knows that my issues with self sooting may go back to attachment patterns.
It says that they don't go that far back- are often unaware that this goes back to attachment patterns.

It is a lot harder to heal this than i thought. Just want you to know, that i have similar struggles with this. You are definitely not alone. 

[sanmagic7]

thanks for the info, sienna.  it makes a lot of sense.

[Sienna]

Thats ok Sanmagic. I wasnt sure if i should post it as i wonder if people would like to find this out for themselves, such as through reading like i did.
But maybe paving the way here is right..? dono.

[Sandstone]

I do agree with sanmagic regarding when youre ready. Its took 30 yrs of self abuse to finally feel like i am worth being healthy. Obviously it wont happen overnight but iv stopped drinking alcohol  (the cause of my childhood neglect) i smoke, take prescription meds and illegal substances and i dont eat properly either. But im at the stage where i thnk iv had enough now. Now i know im not broken but just affected by what happened to me. So yeah for me its about feeling a bit more self worth.

Sienna thanks for the book info, thats really interesting and i am gonna look it up. Xx

[Sienna]

Sandstone, I am so glad that you are going to look the book up!
(It explains how codependnacey develops too)

. Now i know im not broken but just affected by what happened to me. S
That is so great to hear, and I'm so happy for you. 

I wonder, do you know what the reason is behind *not* eating?
I know its self neglect so Im thinking it stems from childhood neglect...
As well as needing to destroy / suppress something inside of you, and or, maybe self image issues.
I just want to understand this better...

[Sandstone]

Hi sienna i actually yo yo from not eating to overeating. Have gone both ways for years now. Never really thought of it as self harm as well before.  I too am interested in finding out more. Another book on my list 

[meursault]

I agree with sanmagic.  You mostly quit when you are ready, IMHO.  How can you get yourself to be ready then?  Probably varies quite a bit from person to person.  Recognizing there is a boy in me who didn't deserve all he endured and deserved to be protected was the basic shift for this in me personally.  This is helping me...

I think the book Sienna read is on the right track...
When I want to turn to coke or chocolate bars or whatever, I kind of have fun with it now.  I talk to myself like I'm the father with a little boy DYING to have chocolate.  I promise him he can have some later, but let him know I am only limiting him because I know he will be happier in the long run.  I'm basically being the parent I never had: respecting the need, validating it, and then doing the thing that I think an adult would do to protect the boy.  I don't force it, though, and if I cave and get that chocolate bar, I don't beat myself (aka the boy) up for it.  SO I'm basically using an internal part of me to soothe an upset internal part, rather than looking for something external.  (Unfortunately I don't do that for my relationship and intimacy needs yet!)

It's all pretty jumbled, but I have an idea of how an honourable and loving father should treat his kids, and I try to do that now, even if I don't feel like it.  I'm probably successful over half of the time! 

Meursault

[sanmagic7]

yay! for you, meursault!

i think that's a great concept.  it sounds very loving and forgiving and accepting, all at the same time.  i want to try that out.  thanks for sharing it.  it seems to be a very powerful tool.  and, over half the time?!  really good progress.  i hadn't thought of this in terms of my little girl, but you've got it in my head now.  i'm smiling!

[Contessa]

Sanmagic

it's because they're often based on logic, and with c-ptsd, there is no logic.

Yes. My brain has always worked logically, and in the past kept my behaviour in check. But now the c-ptsd gets in the way.

[meursault]

Good to hear, sanmagic!

I don't know, maybe other people can connect with this way of looking at things to help sort out all this chaos.  I have a long way to go, but I'm doing way better than I have for many years.

I find I am aware of BOTH of them more now.   I can untangle the "father"-y part to look after the "boy" part better, which helps me actually do the things that are constructive, and untangle the "boy" part better to know what is hurting/scaring me, and the traumas I need to address and grieve.  I'm still exploring, but I noticed this was helping me pretty quickly.

Meursault

[MarkD67]

Hi people. With self soothing, i really struggled after i got clean and sober. I have since used a combination of techniques from a couple of authors

From Francine Shapiro's EMDR self help book "Gettjng Past Your Past", and actual EMDR therapy,
and from
"The Developmental Needs Meeting Strategy: An Ego State Therapy for Healing Adults with Childhood Trauma and Attachment Wounds" by Shirley Jean Schmidt,

I created inner resources using various small bits of positive memories from my life. Using the DNMS strategy of building and reinforcing A Nurturing Adult Self, a Protective Adult Self and Spiritual Core self. I now have these 3 healing versions of self experiences as mental people who i use to comfort and support me and the younger versions of me stuck inside.  I even have supportive conversations with them.

And combining those with the  "safe place" technique from EMDR.

I used 2 memories of being comforted, one at  24 another at 27. I build the feeling of thise 2 experiences and melded the mental images, then used Alternate bilateral stimulation to "fix" the image.

Then by regularly going to that place i have built a mental space i go to in moments of extreme flashback. I still can backslide a little when the emptiness gets too much, but now the extremely distressing experiences are bearable. Such that combined with medication to treat temporal lobe epilepsy (one of my cPTSD symptoms, i am alcohol, drug, tobacco free 2.75 years later, i have also dropped 23 of my 26 other OCD behaviours.

So now I am almost 50 and I am experiencing a freedom and inner life that I never knew existed. And its all inside me, ready to be used at any time I need and no one in my circle is any the wiser. I think thats pretty neat.

Regards from Australia. 

[sanmagic7]

even more than pretty neat!  that's great!  good for you.  very resourceful.

[Digitality]

This happens to me especially often because I like to drink too much and it is bad for subsequent events. I have been looking for an answer to the question how to stop drinking alcohol for a long time but I didn't find anything useful because half of the country suffers from this kind of addiction and no one wants to get rid of it. I tried to convince myself otherwise but so far without much success. My wife advised me to go to a clinic that helps with such problems. I'm not sure about this scenario, but it's worth a try, which is why I wish us all the best of luck!