Trying to make some sense of it all...

[Blossoming]

Someone recommended a site called Marriage Builders to me yesterday and I forwarded a link to my husband and asked him to read it. It seems very helpful so I think if he reads it that would be a good first step towards showing me he is sincere and willing to recommit to our relationship.
He also called the other woman yesterday and talked to her for 15 minutes and didn't tell me about it. Huge red flag! When I asked him about it he said it was about work and he was going to tell me today. I think if he really wants to save our marriage he needs to cut all ties with her and get a new job. We talked about it a lot in the middle of the night and I asked him to think about it. I'm not going to stay around forever while they are still in contact even if it's supposedly just work because I think it would be a distraction, temptation and interfere with us being able to move on.
I'm pretty proud of myself for staying focused and asserting my needs in the face of so much hurt and emotion.

[sanmagic7]

i'm proud of you, too, blossoming.  that's a lot of strength you're showing.  warrior woman courage.  it doesn't get any better.

[Blossoming]

Thanks sanmagic7. I still don't know how things will turn out but I'm proud of myself for mostly keeping it together and not compromising my needs. I'm reading a good book called Surviving an Affair. It's a tough situation to say the least but in some ways it's good to finally be discussing our relationship issues. I remember thinking it seemed like he took me back when I left him in 2014 just to punish me and he basically admitted as much last night so at least I know I've been corrected in my instincts about our relationship and not delusional or paranoid.

[Blossoming]

Someone told me my husband is gaslighting me about the affair. There are several red flags that he doesn't want to truly end it but just keep it secret from me. Like he wants to have his cake and eat it too so to speak. In the Marriage Builders program they encourage the betrayed spouse to expose the affair to as many people as possible and even to the employer if it is a work related affair. The problem is that my only evidence is his admission (with no details) and apology and the cell phone records which doesn't provide details either so not the most solid evidence. I'm thinking about asking him for a separation because this is just too emotionally taxing as long as he chooses to stay at his job where they work together.
Some things that make me think he doesn't want to end it and that he is gaslighting me are:
He called and talked to her for 15 minutes last week and he didn't tell me.
She texted him on the new year but he did tell me about that although oddly enough it hasn't shown on the phone records yet.
After they stopped with the excessive phone calls and texts his data usage skyrocketed as if they were communicating via snap chat or something. When I mentioned this to him the data use immediately went back to normal.
I've told him I need him to leave his job if he really wants the marriage to work but so far he won't. In all fairness I only told him this a couple days ago but still...
Sorry if I'm repeating myself. I'm just trying to work this all out. I am going to talk to my old T and get tested for STD's because I have to take care of myself.

[sanmagic7]

blossoming, you sound like you're doing a very good job of sorting through the deceits, innuendoes, and outright lies that are going on around you.  talk about being an emotional hostage!  first it's this, then it's that, then another thing comes to light, but the main thing, the separation of your husband from this woman is just somehow not getting done.   i also believe that if your intuition was right once about what was going on, it's going to be spot on again and again.

of course this is emotionally taxing and abusive as well.  he's playing so many games is what it sounds like to me.  still, there are no standard rules except the ones he decides on and changes at will.  your rule, that he leave his job in order to be away from this woman, is being ignored.  big red flag for me.

you're number one, here, your health and well-being, your person, your essence.  you have a right to protect them at any and all costs.  i hope you keep taking care of you, and i know you'll do what's best for you.  standing right beside you.

[Blossoming]

It was so nice to read your honest and insightful words sanmagic7. I truly appreciate your help! Maybe I'm starting to come out of the fog more.  Things have been really intense. I've got a PI following him today while I'm at a job interview so I can hopefully get the evidence I need that the affair is still ongoing. It's been stressful getting everything arranged but I feel it is important to completely expose his lies for my own peace of mind.

[Blossoming]

I'm about to leave for my job interview (Yay! I finally got an interview for the job I've been trying to get for two months.) Interviews are nerve wracking for everyone I know but knowing that the PI might be getting evidence while I'm in the interview makes today especially stressful. Sometimes I wonder how much more I can take. I have to drive downtown which is stressful, be in an interview for three hours and then try to find out the results of the investigation as soon as I'm done. Oh and then come home to my wayward husband. I'm sure people have endured worse and I probably have too but it still feels extremely hard right now.

[Wife#2]

HUGS to you for all the stress! :: Fingers crossed for GREAT interview results AND PI results you can use ::

Not as bad stress is like only a little pregnant. Yeah, no such thing! And, driving in town, having to hire a PI, having to interview (3 hours? That's marathon just by itself!), that's a lot of stress for one day. Maybe having to see proof of what you know but that saddens you - well, who looks FORWARD to that kind of thing?

::: Sending hugs, prayers, relaxing thoughts, successful karma your way :::

[sanmagic7]

blossoming, that's a TON of stress.  if someone you knew was having all that to deal with in one day, i believe you'd see it that way for her.  well, it's the same for you.  stay safe while driving, and know that whatever happens, you'll be ok.  you are showing so much courage and strength - maybe more than you ever realized you have.  best of luck with everything.  we're here both for you and with you. 

[Blossoming]

Oh what a relief to come here and have some sympathy and understanding Wife2 @and sanmagic7.

The interview went well despite being stressful. I got passed on to the next phase and when my physical and further background checks are done (in 4-6 weeks) I should be able to start working.

When I got out of the interview early at 3:30 this afternoon the PI said my husband left work early (15 minutes after my interview started) and never returned to work!!! I couldn't get the GPS on his car because it has some aftermarket modifications so the PI lost track of him. The PI went to the mistresses house and neither one of them were there so I think they probably met at a hotel. Now I have to act like I don't suspect a thing and try to get more evidence this coming week. This is so hard. I've already lost ten pounds but I have to stay strong. One of the worst parts is that I've inadvertently driven him to be more careful and secretive. If I had known last month what I know now I wouldn't have let on that I'd discovered anything. I'm truly sickened by his lies but I have to hold it together a bit longer so I can get hard evidence. This is challenging to say the least. I'm hoping he will go out drinking with his friends this weekend so I can have time to search for the GPS port. Sometimes I wonder why I'm going to all this trouble but I committed to him and I'm going to see this through and make him own up to his behaviour if for no other reason than my own self esteem. What a mess.

[sanmagic7]

congrats on a great interview, blossoming.

i hope you get what you need so that you can put the matter to rest about your husband.  it's awful to think of what you're going through.   best to you with all that.  hang tough - we're hangin' right beside you.

[Blossoming]

You're wonderful sanmagic7 and your post got me thinking about my needs and more specifically what I don't need.
I really find my husband's addictions (alcohol, drugs and sex) are simply becoming too much to bear. I have been living in a loveless and neglectful relationship for far too long. I'm going to try to get more evidence this week so he can't keep lying and gaslighting me but I'm 95% sure done with this marriage. It actually feels good and right to begin to close this chapter of my life.

[sanmagic7]

well, blossoming, i say good for you!  figuring out our needs, as compared to our wants, is pretty important to my mind.  i've been thru the addictions nightmare with 2 husbands, and stayed too long both times.  (that doggone 'fixer' part of me wouldn't let me leave until too much damage was done).  i'd say you're getting to the end of your rope with it all, and i'm glad.  you deserve much better than 'loveless and neglectful'.   you go, girl!

[Wife#2]

Blossom, I think you've finally reached that place my father described as 'time for divorce'. My father hadn't intended to divorce my mother until I was 18 (I was the youngest). He accidentally met the love of his life while married to Mom, still. But, he stayed. Until.... He realized he didn't hate Mom. He wasn't even really mad at her anymore (she hadn't cheated, but she'd tried to make Dad miserable, and was succeeding). He just didn't care how she felt anymore. That was, he said, when he knew the marriage was completely dead - flat line - no resuscitation possible. That was time to leave.

Now, he cares about her as a fellow human being and as mother of his children. Beyond that, though, her PD ways make it too difficult to be even in the same room as her.

I hope for you there is that peaceful moment - that moment you when know that you know that you know that divorce is the best, most sane, most self- and child-protective thing you can do. When the hardships you don't know make more sense than the pain you do know. You certainly know pain  Isn't it time for a little peace?

[Blossoming]

Thanks for that Wife2. It's funny that just last night while talking with my husband I realized that I have developed enough self-esteem to want more for myself. I know I deserve better and I'm ready to move forward in life. Yeah, some parts are sad but it's time. Thanks for sharing the story about your father.