Eye Contact

[globetrotter]

I am not sure if this is a Social Anxiety thing or a CPTSD thing but I need work on my eye contact. I am a great listener and will look folks in the eyes when they are talking, but when it's my turn to talk, I look away. I am not sure what this is about. I don't think it's lack of confidence, but it may be something about not wanting to be "seen". My therapist was pushing me because I can't look at her except for fleeting glimpses, unless of course, it's idle chit chat, then no problem. But if we TALK about eye contact, forget it, it's not happening.

Anyone else have this problem? I guess it doesn't present the best warm and fuzzies when I won't look at someone when I talk. I even do this with my S.O., where I will look away and then come back to a locked gaze. Weird, since this is the person I would trust with my life.

It's a hard habit to break. It takes dedicated focus!

[schrödinger's cat]

I can relate. I'm often too tense and socially hypervigilant to simply hold a normal amount of relaxed eyecontact. I'm either avoiding people's eyes, or I'm keeping too much eyecontact, usually because I'm worried that I'd slide back into avoiding people's eyes. All or nothing. I'll probably have to watch more people talk to see how they do it, so I can then fake it till I make it. It's annoying though. In my teenage years, I was so lonely and isolated that I'm still self-conscious when it comes to the tiniest things. It's like: "this thing you earthlings call a con-vur-zay-shun: how does it function? Take me to your leader so he can inform me of the requisite paradigms."

[Rain]

For me, it is Shame.

I have worked through eye contact issue for me, but I still do it on occasion.

[globetrotter]

It seems like something that should be simple, doesn't it?
It as another way to avoid connection. Eye contact can also be incredibly intense.

My boss can have a wickedly icy look. I can't look at him when he has that look. I wonder what's lurking behind it.

Sometimes it's interesting to lock eyes with a stranger. Who looks away first?

Fake it til I make it. Yes. Fleeting glimpses. Hello, can you see my fear? Yeeesh.

[Rain]

Hello, can you see my fear? Yeeesh.

What happens next?

[globetrotter]

Look away!!!!

[Rain]

btw, I love the picture under your name, is that you?   A cat?

[globetrotter]

Yes that's a self portrait.
I have two cats.
When we have staring contests they usually look away first.
seriously, eye contact issues vary based on the individual,  level of emotional investment,  and an old habit that needs ome focus.

[Sandals]

GT - do you know where you look when you look away? Do you look down?

The reason I ask is that I have heard that looking at someone keeps us in the present, whereas looking down puts us in the past. I know I often look down when I'm trying to recall something, which I guess makes it in the past. I've also linked looking down to shame (past again).

It's a bit of an interesting self-study to do.

[globetrotter]

That's an interesting question! I look UP or at the wall.
Some of it is for sure SA. I can be very careful at word choosing and formulating my thoughts which are easier without distraction. ..like being looked at ;-)

[morph]

I have remarkable difficulty with this.  Either I am intensely staring into their soul and make them uncomfortable (maybe my own projection) or they are looking into my worthless being which is terrifying!  I think intimacy has a hard time when this is the starting point.

I often look at my wife and marvel when she is talking to someone.  She will lean towards them and stare unflinchingly for ages into their eyes.  People love her for it!   She has no shame - sometimes to my consternation!  But Oh - What a lovely way to be able to live.

[Butterfly]

Eye contact when others talk, yes. When I have something to say, no. Hadn't made that connection so that is for this topic. Thanks for bringing this up - it helped me think through the following.

For me it's the inner critic 'fact' that what I have to say is worthless, I'm being a bother to others by speaking. I'm here to serve, to listen, I'm not here to need anything myself, to have a worthwhile opinion or thought, unless it's to help others and serve. If I have a useful or helpful thought to share that's worth listening to up and to the point I've provided enough information at which point I'm interrupted and cut off. That's the message I've gotten since childhood. Praise only for help and service provided but not for being my own person. If I am caught being my own person it's taken away from me because uPDm will now do the same, feel the same, whatever I am she is too, I am consumed and swallowed up so I am no longer my own person.

Sorry, didn't mean to go that deep. My thoughts just sorta got away from me.

[morph]

For me also I think it largely depends on the circumstances.   If I don't think about is I make enough eye contact so that no one has ever accused me of having my head down and talking to the floor.

However if I think about it I become become 'paranoid?', uncomfortable and obsessed with it.   I watch with a critical eye, so to speak, the nuances of the pupil being controlled by the iris and become quite alarmed and afraid when I see a sudden constriction.

I've never put that into words before!   Maybe another door opening for me.

On an aside; I've been quite aware of the importance of eye contact, for a long time, since I was ripped off buying some cannabis.  I met some 'oik' on the street (back in the days!) and after handing over several hundred quid was quite surprised when this honest chap didn't fulfill his side of the bargain.  On retrospect, even though I was a fairly savvy dope dealer I had been fooled by his wide open, unflinching eyes.  Think he must have glued them open with a botox anti-venom!

[Widdiful Falling]

I can relate. I'm often too tense and socially hypervigilant to simply hold a normal amount of relaxed eyecontact. I'm either avoiding people's eyes, or I'm keeping too much eyecontact, usually because I'm worried that I'd slide back into avoiding people's eyes. All or nothing. I'll probably have to watch more people talk to see how they do it, so I can then fake it till I make it. It's annoying though. In my teenage years, I was so lonely and isolated that I'm still self-conscious when it comes to the tiniest things. It's like: "this thing you earthlings call a con-vur-zay-shun: how does it function? Take me to your leader so he can inform me of the requisite paradigms."

I died laughing!

This exactly describes my life right now!   

[outercalm]

I do the EXACT same thing and have puzzled over it as you are. I think I may do this because I am so careful about how much I let people in and, somehow, allowing eye contact lets people into my inner world. When someone else is talking, I have no problem making eye contact. I think there is something about the idea that I am conveying more than my words when I'm speaking, but not when I am listening. Does that make any sense?