Codependency Triggered by The spartan life coach

[hurtbeat]

Anyone else being triggered by The spartan life coahch's videos where he is codependent with Sam Vaknin? (dating 1 year or so back from his most recent)

I've been listening in on Richards old videos and coming up to his later videos I just find it extremely triggering to see how codependent he is and how he has lost touch with reality.

I don't know.. I just wanted to voice this, I feel so sorry for Richard and my codependency is flaring up like crazy- telling me that I must warn and protect him since he has helped me with his past videos where he wasn't crazy.
How do I un- codepent?
And how can I turn my back on this when I see Sam Vaknin trying to Narcissist all over us with his sadistic motivations?
I feel like it is an important subject that I care deeply about and it's important to speak up but I just don't know if I can bear the sheer magnitude of what's going on here!

[Kizzie]

Perhaps email and simply say what you've written here?  Sometimes the simplest solution is the best one   

[hurtbeat]

To him?
Nah, I know what he has said about peoples protests against Sam Vaknin.
"They aren't thinking critically and they need to wake up" 

[89abc123]

I wouldn't worry about Richard Grannon. I think he has enough knowledge and healing to be able to handle himself. I think sams work is important to him and he values that information.

I do get really uneasy about Sam too (which I think is normal considering he's a sadistic psycho....not exactly a 'likeable' guy). I did pick up on a contradiction from Sam in Richards latest documentary. I don't beleive everything he says, but that's my opinion and has no factual basis. Another thing that bothers me greatly about Sam...he says in a video that he doesn't beleive people can change yet he has brought out a new therapy model. Um. What's the point there. I think enough people on the planet pay $180 per session to not change...but that's my hatred of mainstream psychology coming out.

But again, I'm no expert. I have no idea how sincere Sam is or what he's trying to do.

As for Richard grannon I'll always follow his work. You don't have to agree with everything that one person does to benefit from it. I hope that helps your need to save him a bit. I know you are only trying to care, and it's super sweet of you to want to protect him. But I think you should turn that need to protect inward to develop skills to protect yourself.

The point of the videos is to help YOU heal your issues. He's not asking for therapy from us. It's all about you; so take this time to self nurture and put yourself first. Self care is a step in the right direction to heal codependency.

[hurtbeat]

I know, and if I could turn my feelings to whatever I wanted I would probably be happy and rich by now.

I think you said it yourself, Sam is full of contradictions and the things he says proves that his main goal isn't to truly help people.
I don't know.. I guess I am kind of sad because I see Richard being all messed up and questioning all of his old beliefs.
Like he's 'not even sure that Narcissism exists because it is a term that only exists within certain contexts'.. what context does he live in then?
Is he living in the realm of the dead where one is all and all is one and Narcissism is just a word and feelings are just colours of the wind? 

I guess it triggers me because he used to be so confident and strong with himself and now his perception of the world is being messed up by a narc, just like mine have been with narcs.
And all he can say to explain his confusion and lack of logic are the self blaming words: "I don't know. I'm not smart in that way, I'm better at simplifying things". (leaving Sam to be "the smart one" who can explain the world to us)
It's just so painful to witness because it resonates with my own pain and how I have been feeling stupid for not understanding the crazymaking logics of the narcs.

I really do hope that he'll stop thinking that he's not smart enough just because he's being manipulated, it just breaks my heart.
His videos are more personal than professional so when watching and listening to his videos about CPTSD you can't help but getting to know him as a person too.
In a way he has built his business on being a role model and it's kind of like watching a mentor going into a bad relationship and ruining everything he's built up; all the while ruining my hope that I could ever be free of narcs.
If he can't protect himself against narcs then how could I ever hope to do so?




I've been avoiding him lately anyway, I see no other way.

[Hazy111]

Its interesting what you write hurt beat , but i dont get that at all from Sam Vaknin and Richard Grannon. But then im not a codependent.

I think Sam Vaknins work has been very useful. He might not be the definitive last word on narcissism, but he has opened my eyes to so much. I have narc traits (the fight trauma mode of C-PTSD according to Pete Walker)but not fully blown NPD i am told.

I think his videos have helped a lot of people wake up to narcs in their life and how they operate.

When watching Richard Grannons videos its interesting i get the feeling hes a bit of a narc himself. He obviously works out and likes to film himself in vests/t shirts  showing off his body. Also the whole concept of regularly posting on You Tube , twitter , etc can be construed as form of narc supply. Or is he a covert narc? in that he likes being in  the presence of a fully fledged one?
Might you not projecting your codependency fears onto Richard, he comes across as quite confident to me?

Just my view. I do agree about, Sam Vaknin now got a therapy for narcs after saying that therapys wasted on them,,,hmmmmm $$$

Anyway hurtbeat i hope this isnt upsetting and i am in no way invalidating what you feel.

[hurtbeat]

We can all have more or less N- traits, Richard has built his practice on what he's good at and he is obviously a person who is comfortable with teaching people.
I don't necessarily think it makes him into a narcissist who doesn't truly care for others.

As a codependent I'm not really interested in how narcs think and feel, I'd rather be interested in overcoming the damage narcs do.

[89abc123]

I don't really agree that he is 'messed up'.

I think what is really going on with Richard grannon is that he is continuously researching and continually being presented with new information. That new information is always going to trump previous ideas. That on top of having an ever increasing following, he needs to find more and more ways to get this info out to a wider audience. It is a positive he is always coming up with new theories because we live in a world where mental health treatment has barely progressed or improved compared to other medicine. The people who are pushing for change are heroes in my view; whether he gets that info from an npd or not.

In saying this, I can totally see how you've been triggered by it all because I think every single person who discovers they have been abused by a narcissist goes through a 'narc hunter' phase where we obsessively hate these people. I went through a period of about 2 years where a good majority of my spare time was spent finding out as much as possible about narcissists. It wasn't completely useless...but it was extremely unhealthy.

It wasn't until the obsession subsided that I've finally been able to fully grasp the concept of emotional flashbacks.

I hope you spend more time on self help than narc hunting and don't waste 2 years on it like I did. You WILL be narcissist free if you focus on fixing YOU, and not others (please don't take offence to this...we have all been there)

[hurtbeat]

I'm ending this discussion here.

[89abc123]

Wow ok.

I don't really understand why but hey do what you have to do.

[SE7]

In saying this, I can totally see how you've been triggered by it all because I think every single person who discovers they have been abused by a narcissist goes through a 'narc hunter' phase where we obsessively hate these people. I went through a period of about 2 years where a good majority of my spare time was spent finding out as much as possible about narcissists. It wasn't completely useless...but it was extremely unhealthy.

It wasn't until the obsession subsided that I've finally been able to fully grasp the concept of emotional flashbacks.

Hi, you bring up a lot of good points. I only recently realized the whole narc. thing and definitely went through that phase which I think is necessary when at first realizing what the problem is and who the narc. is, etc. It was very valuable to me and I know I still need to know more since I only did that exploration for a few months (I need to study more of the behaviors they do so I can label them and know it's not me with the problem). But I quickly realized it was going to be very unhealthy for me to focus too much on the narcs and narcissism in general, that it would be more helpful for me to focus on the healing 'recovery' part of it all, which is why I'm more focused on the CPTSD aspects. There is a huge amount of (understandable) bitterness in the narc. community on YouTube, and at times it can be valuable for me but I find it can be triggering also, and can lead me into a dark place of bitterness that is not a good place to stay at for long.

I also found certain people on YT can be triggering, because as victims of narc. abuse they absolutely have narc. traits, which I'm sure I probably have in certain areas too (it's inevitable, being raised by 2 narcs -- we learn to fight it with what we learned). I'm learning to take what works for me and leave the rest. I was once in Coda many years ago on and off and though the 12 step path helped me, I couldn't stick with it probably because I didn't totally identify with the codep. community since the real issue all along was narcissistic abuse which I was unaware of. Many of the Coda people were more like my narc/borderline mother, so my brand of codependency felt more rare since I was on the other end of it.

Anyway, I'm rambling here Just thought you brought up a lot of good points.

[89abc123]

Hi SE7,

I probably should have worded that different and just spoke for myself not everyone else because I think it offends people...but I definitely got narcissist obsessed. I learnt so so much but I did waste a lot of time...again focusing all my energy on them and not myself.

I also found that I would be put off by people who displayed ANY narcissist traits at all, which isn't fair because we all have some traits and it doesn't mean someone is a full blown npd...but I threw them all into the same basket. If I had of kept going with that mentality I would be 100% isolated because no one would ever 'measure up' so to speak.

That's great that you have found out about narcissistic abuse! Of course I think it's massively important and being here validates our experience but I have to be careful not to let myself cross over into unhealthy obsession. Here's to focusing on ourselves more than we focus on them!

[Blackbird]

I also got obsessed, with any cluster B types really, since I experience a wide range of abuse from different people with different traits.

It's like that saying, when we're a hammer we see everything as nails.

[89abc123]

It's like that saying, when we're a hammer we see everything as nails.

That's so true. You'll always find those traits in people if you are looking for them.

[Lingurine]

Hurtbeat, I thought that I heard Richard himself tell on one of his video's, that he is a covert narcissist, but maybe that's not important for this discission. Point is, when people hurt you, then it's time to put boundaries in place, sometimes that leads to NC. I do agree that we all have some traits, maybe we have to be a little selfish to survive. As long as we don't hurt other people...

Lingurine