A New Approach

Started by Libby183, April 27, 2018, 08:50:29 AM

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Libby183

Well, I said I would start a recovery journal,  so best to get on with it, or knowing me, I will talk myself out of it if I give myself time.

Am going to a GP later at the suggestion of my EMDR therapist.  To be honest, I am not sure if there is much point.  I am sure my pain is cptsd related.  It would be good to have a definite diagnosis or opinion,  though. I will also ask again about the purpose of the duloxetine I take. He didn't prescribe it originally so it would be interesting to see if he thinks it is worthwhile for me despite the side effects.

Anxiety about this appointment building already so better take my doggy for a walk.  That usually helps.

Hope67

Hi Libby,
Great that you've started your Recovery Journal - and I hope you'll find it helpful.  I hope your GP appointment went ok today.  I hope you enjoyed your walk with your doggy.  I also find that walking helps. 
:hug: to you Libby.
Hope  :)

Libby183

Hope,  thank you so much for my first comment in my journal.  It means a lot to me.


The GP appointment was pretty much as I expected.  He didn't really have anything to offer,  other than an increased dose of duloxetine. Still wondering if that is a good idea or not. He also said I could have a blood test,  but I don't think I will.  It just seemed like something to fob me off with.

I was,however, reading a leaflet in the waiting room about online GP services and it mentioned access to your medical records. I think I will look into that because I have this strong need to understand what,  deep down,  is wrong with me. Doctors never really give much away in my experience,  but I may find something useful there.  I think it's all about control. I was so utterly controlled by my parents that I feel scared of any situation where I am vulnerable.

This seems to lead on to my therapists suggestion that I search for memories where I felt weak.  That's really hard because my whole relationship with my parents was about my weakness and their strength.  For both of them, that was the right and proper way. After all, parents are in charge.  Added to that was my mother's need for me to be weak so that she could feel she was strong. I had to be sad so that she could believe she was happy.  I had to be fat so that she could be thin and so on and so on. So did I feel weak?  I don't know. But I did feel powerless and helpless. Above all, I was powerless to be myself.  Perhaps these are the memories I could look for.  I really feel that I never got to find out who or what I really was. And I still have such strong doubts.

An absolute requirement of the therapy,  I am told, is to switch off my intellectual brain and allow my emotional brain to take the lead.  I am having real problems with this. It has led me to realise just how truly limited my emotions are.   In emdr sessions,  I can picture traumatic scenes from childhood,  but there aren't really any emotions attached that I am aware of. Should I be aware? Not sure. Is that why the treatment is not being fully effective?  Don't know.  Am I beyond help? That's what worries me.

Anyway,  I am committed to carrying on with the therapy.  Perhaps these are normal hurdles to overcome.

Sanmagic has written a fascinating reply in my emdr thread. There is so much information and advice there,  and I am going to re-read it a few times.


sanmagic7

hey, libby,

glad for you starting this journal.  it usually helps me to write about stuff, if only to get it out of me.  often i've found clarity and realizations as i write, too, and feedback and support has been tremendously important to me as well.

also glad you found some of what i wrote helpful for your therapy.  any questions, feel free to pm me.

i'm one who has had a hard time with emotions, and eventually discovered (thru this forum, actually) that i have alexithymia.  it's a condition where the brain connections between emotions and being able to verbalize/realize/recognize them are faulty.  i took an online diagnostic, the TAS-20 (toronto alexithymic scale - here's a link if you're so inclined   http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=Awr9CitJfORafYAAqxtXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTExdXU4OGx2BGNvbG8DZ3ExBHBvcwMyBHZ0aWQDREZENl8xBHNlYwNzcg--/RV=2/RE=1524952266/RO=10/RU=http%3a%2f%2fwww.alexithymia.us%2ftest-alex.html/RK=2/RS=SXkjU01N4re0eg5A3jthhU1BaNg-) that assured me my emotions have been missing from my conscious ability to access them.

don't know if that fits for you, but what you wrote about not knowing how you feel/felt about what went on in your life sounded so very familiar to me.   when i thought back to previous therapy sessions, i struggled mightily with coming up with feelings/emotions about what was happening or had happened.  i still struggle, but it's gotten better from working on it, re-wiring my brain a bit.

when emotions are difficult to access, the t needs to know about that and find another way to help you thru the therapeutic process.  your t could even find the TAS and give it to you during a session.  that way they can better understand what's happening with you, why it's difficult for you emotionally (if, in fact, you are alexithymic).

the other possibility is that your emotions have been frozen or numbed to a point where you just can't easily get at them.  again, your t could help you if they're willing to be open to this.  however, just insisting that you rely on the emotional side of your brain can be unrealistic if it's not readily available.  you can tell them that you need help with this.  to my mind, the t needs to step up when their client is struggling.

i hope you find some success with your t.  i've been a therapist, emdr-trained, for 25 yrs. and never knew about complex trauma or alexithymia until i researched it for myself just in the past 3 yrs.  this stuff is not widely known, c-ptsd isn't formally recognized in the therapist's diagnostic manual,  and it's rarely talked about.  i belong to an emdr support forum for therapists, and have brought this stuff up to them.  most of them had no idea.

once again, in the helping professions, med. or otherwise, we must advocate for ourselves.  i've had all the tests, too, including an mri on my brain, and it's all shown nothing of note.  i'm sure my chronic pain is c-ptsd related as well.  we're all in the same boat, libby, and together we'll get thru this.  love and hugs to you.

Libby183

Thank you Sanmagic. I definitely think you may have hit upon something with the idea of alexithymia.  I did the test (thanks for the link) and came out as high in the trait. Also I read around the subject and felt that it really made sense to me. The nature / nurture aspect of its "cause" fitted, because my nm had no emotions at all, other than anger. She literally had no words for emotions.  "Quite nice" was the only positive thing she would say occasionally. 

What really struck me,  however,  was the link to autism.  I have an autistic son and always felt that there was an overlap between cptsd and autism. After all, in the past,  I think that autism was blamed on cold, distant mothers.  I often wondered if, as a child, I had autistic traits,  but perhaps it was the first signs of alexithymia?  My son had very violent tantrums when younger, but I was very understanding of this and now he is an adult,  he is very calm and generally works on understanding other peoples thoughts and emotions.

I am definitely going to discuss all of this with my therapist.  Especially how it seems to be linked with pain from undischarged emotions.  Perhaps this will lead to a new approach.  Certainly worth a try and I will read some more about the subject.  It's fascinating.  Many thanks.


I had a lovely day yesterday,  visiting my dd and her boyfriend,  with dh and my dog.  I realise that the only time I was in any pain was when we were stuck in an unexplained traffic jam.  It stuck me that,  although the pain was there and is affected by driving, it was really the cars and people all around,  and my irritation and anger at them for being "in my way" that was the issue. Perhaps it is because I can't really feel emotions, in this case, anger and feel guilty about expressing it, that I distract myself by focusing on pain instead.  It's not something I had considered before, and may not be valid at all. But the pain was gone as soon as we got to my daughter.  Emotion turned inwards and felt as pain seems logical.

Thinking about it,  it was very much the case with nm that if I did something genuinely stupid, like losing money or reversing the car into a post, she was not angry with me. I think that if I beat myself up enough, she didn't need to
It was minor infringements, silly things that made her so angry. I suppose being young that I thought they were minor, so wasn't sorry enough.  Then I had to be punished. Then over time I accepted more things about myself as bad and proceeded to mentally beat myself up.  Is this the inner critic maybe.  Again,  it could link in with the pain.

The concept of alexithymia could also explain my hatred of community type events.  I thought it was just that nm loved this sort of thing and always made us attend.  But it really could be that I just couldn't appreciate that shared sense of celebration or whatever.  I didn't feel it as a child, and I don't feel it now.  It sounds really bad, makes me feel not fully human, hence my avoidance. 

Finally,  I need to come up with memories where I felt weak or powerless. That is hard. That was my whole childhood,  but how much did I really feel it and can I attach it to specific memories?  I shall give it a try, anyway.

I really don't expect anyone to read through all of my waffle, but it is good to get it down in words. I am starting to experience the value of journalling.

sanmagic7

can't really comment today, libby, but i'm glad you found the link helpful.  love and hugs.

Libby183

Thank you so much for all of your support. I'll let you know how the next emdr session goes.

Hugs, Libby.

Hope67

 :hug: to you Libby. 
Hope  :)

sanmagic7

one thing i wanted to say, libby, is that you either may not have specific memories that pinpoint times when you felt weak/powerless (like you were saying, there was so much, it was subtle and pervasive, and it all ran together -but, that thought of the 'look' from your mother could be a memory or at least a target for the emdr process) or you may not be ready to bring up any such memories at this time.  i think that needs to be respected, too.  sometimes trying to grasp a memory that is too painful can be overwhelming, and retraumatizing, so please be careful.

hope your next session goes well, especially with your newfound information.  i'm interested especially to hear what your t thinks about the alexithymia.  might be interesting.  remember, always, this is your process, your recovery, and your pace.  love and hugs to you libby.

Libby183

Thank you both for your best wishes. It's so good to have people who care and are genuinely interested!

With regard to the whole question of emotions,  I seem to have had something of a breakthrough.  I have felt so emotionless for so long, I had come to think I really had no emotions or just negative ones!

As a result,  and because I have never been convinced of the value of duloxetine/cymbalta,  I decided to stop taking it.

I seem to be doing well. I knew what to expect,  and despite the withdrawal symptoms in my head,  I actually feel quite positive.

In my last therapy session,  we dealt with memories around my mother and sister. This was a big issue for me because I was the scapegoat and my sister was the golden child. We went back to a situation when I was not much over two years old and it was said that I tried to "get rid" of my sister because I was so very jealous of her. Even before the emdr I was feeling quite emotional and I actually cried real tears.  It must be decades since I cried. I definitely think I have finally found some emotions!

So despite the brain zaps etc which are not pleasant at all, I feel that I am on the right track again.  I even did a small diy project that I had been putting off for ages.

My "homework" from therapy is to start rewriting my story,  as the therapist puts it. Instead of acting like a controlled child, I have to act as an individual adult.  I would have responded badly to this suggestion a while ago, but I can accept myself better now.

Despite its ups and downs, I think therapy has made me trust my belief that my parents damaged me very,  very badly,  so that I can move on a little.  I think you are right San,  now I need to finally deal with the all-pervading image of my horrific mother.  Perhaps then I can finally let go of feeling that I was sacrificed to make her feel better and that she was able to walk away,  safe in her belief that she was the most perfect mother who ever walked this earth. Can this ever be resolved,  I wonder.


Hope67

Hi Libby,
I am glad you're experiencing 'something of a breakthrough' - that is so great to hear.  I related to many of the things you wrote here - which I realise is because we do share experiences of a difficult mother and also a relationship with a sister - I wish you strength in working through these things - you're doing really well -  :hug: to you Libby.
Hope  :)

sanmagic7

yes, i do believe it can be resolved with work, determination, patience (especially with yourself) and time.  take the time you need, break it into small pieces that are manageable, and you'll see progress.  i'm really happy for you that you were able to finally cry.  it took me a long time, too.  now, i cry all the time!  but i'm getting to profitable crying at last - cleansing tears, tears with a purpose.  that's feeling pretty good, even if it's painful for a bit.

i think you're doing great, libby.  love and hugs to you.

Eyessoblue

Hey Libby, I'm so pleased things are working out so well. It was only when I started doing emdr that I found my buried emotions and was able to cry, since then I can cry a lot easier too. I am also considering coming off my medication have been on it for 15 years and feel quite numb whilst I'm on it, I really want to deal with all the help I'm getting by being the real me and not the medicated me so may look at doing this as well. Really pleased for you tho.

Libby183

Thank you,  San magic. You are spot on, as ever.  I can see now that you have pointed it out,  that dealing with the memory around my sister,  was part of the bigger picture of the whole issue with my mother.  Dealing with the memory through emdr and actually crying,  does seem to have started to lift a weight,  and I do feel more "present". 

I think that stopping the duloxetine has played a part. Like you,  eyesofblue, I must have been on antidepressants of one sort or another for nearly twenty years.  Whilst coping with my special needs twins and my disordered mother,  it was probably the right thing just to go with it . But I was never sure if they really helped,  probably because I didn't feel much of anything except anger. I certainly didn't feel "better", whatever that was!

Despite the brain zaps etc, I am definitely more comfortable with myself,  doing things my way.  I know it is absolutely not recommended,  but so far I have coped much better than the two times I tried to slowly cut the dose.  I gather that this drug has a very short half-life so I think this means that withdrawal symptoms take hold quickly.

I have just had home made fruit crumble and custard for breakfast!  Nm would be absolutely disgusted but I did it because I wanted to.  Next step is to do it without even considering her views. Perhaps as I deal with memories of her through emdr, I will be able to let go at last.

sanmagic7

fruit crumble and custard for breakfast sounds spectacularly amazing!  made my mouth water just thinking about it.  i love having out-of-the-box types of breakfasts.  if i eat particularly what i want for breakfast, it starts my day in the best way.

nM's got nothin' on you and what you eat when. 

i'm so glad that your tears have helped lift a weight.  those are the cleansing tears, washing away the poison and toxins from our system.  that stuff is heavy, indeed.

keep going, libby.  i think you're doing swell.   love and hugs to you, sweetie.