New to this topic and without diagnosis..

[Sophisticat]

Hi everyone,

I'm a 28 year old PhD student ( ) from Germany and think that I might suffer from complex PTSD. I'm currently in psychodynamic therapy and on antidepressants to minimize my anxiety (kind of generalized anxiety) and to get my strong emotions under control. I don't have a specific diagnosis since my therapist is not "a fan of diagnoses" and he told me that although I have all kinds of symptoms, they don't exactly match up to one specific condition.

Since I self-harm and am kind of emotionally unstable and have various problems in relationships (like intense fear of abandonnement and some chaos) my therapist mentioned BPD, but refuses to actually diagnose me with BPD because he is pretty sure that I don't meet all of the criteria necessary for a personality disorder. So again, the symptoms are "not enough" to justify a distinct diagnosis. 

I know that I probably don't need a specific diagnosis to start solving my problems, but I feel like it could help to "accept" my behaviour as it is. So this is why I did my own research (something I'm used to because of my job and my hypochondria  ) and found a description of complex PTSD. And it was like reading my own story - but I never thought of me as being "abused" or "traumatized".

I have a very negative self-concept, expect others to dislike me and thus constantly try to be "perfect" .. cricitism hurts me deeply, I'm aware of EVERYTHING I do, expect people to judge me all the time. I expect my boyfriend and friends to leave me and the smallest thing can leave me feeling rejected. I'm not able to regulate these emotions and either selfharm or withdraw.. or get angry (with my boyfriend) - feel victimized easily? I think this is probably what an emotional flashback could feel like?
I experienced depersonalisation and derealisation when I was younger (once for 2 weeks).. nowadays these periods just last seconds when I'm in very stressful situations, which is kind of normal, I guess.
I somatize a lot.. and am pretty depressed at the moment.. I cannot stand my boyfriend or someone close when they are angry, even if I'm not the reason for their anger. It feels like bursting..

I grew up with an emotionally abusive father (this is what my therapist said). I don't really like this description and don't want my father to feel bad about himself.. but everything I did could be a potential mistake causing an outburst (the smallest thing, it was always my fault or my mothers fault). My therapist mentioned that this was a traumatizing environment to grow up in, but for me this is just they way I grew up, I guess. Even today it's the same.. I often just don't want to visit my parents, as I know that the next outburst is just around the corner.

So, the reason I wanted to join this community is to learn more about complex PTSD and to find out whether this is something I potentially suffer from. I guess I should speak to my therapist, as I don't know whether he had heard of complex PTSD before (since it's not yet part of the ICD10?).

But I don't really know how to address this... I don't want the therapist to think of me as someone who wants to tell him how to do his job. Actually I'm just desperate to understand myself.. 

Thank you 


PS: I hope that my English is good enough.. 

[Blueberry]

Welcome to the forum Sophisticat! 

Your symptoms sound as if they could be cptsd. Obviously we can't diagnose you though. If you look around the forum and keep recognising yourself in posts, then that would be a good indication! You don't have to have an official diagnosis to post on the forum anyway.

As you say, you don't need a diagnosis to start working on your problems but it can be very useful to avoid damaging therapy. For some of us getting the diagnosis or even just realising - "Hey this is cptsd!! I'm not 'just difficult to treat' " was actually a relief. Also yes, if you can 'name' it, maybe you can accept it better. In my experience, getting better at accepting is a process.

Even emotional neglect is enough to cause cptsd, so emotional abuse even more so. Seeing the environment we grew up in for what it was is also part of the healing process. Whereever you are on that journey, it's fine. Going at your own pace and small steps are really beneficial.

It sounds to me as if your therapist is being careful and not overly rushing with diagnoses. I think it's positive he didn't put you in the BPD box right away! He probably has heard of cptsd since it is known of in Germany. In my experience it can become awkward if I have a problem with my therapist on his way of dealing with something and I don't express it for a long time. It becomes an unadressed issue in the relationship. But again go at a pace you feel comfortable with in addressing the issue.

 

Your English is plenty fine for the forum, excellent in fact. 

[Blueberry]

P.S. This fact sheet might help you and your therapist, if he understands English https://www.blueknot.org.au/Portals/2/Fact%20Sheets%20Info/Fact%20Sheet_GPs.pdf

You can check out similar downloads here http://www.outofthestorm.website/downloads/

[Jdog]

Hi, and welcome to our forum!  I want to echo what Blueberry said about there being comfort in having some kind of diagnosis as well as the idea that even having "just" emotional neglect is enough to cause cptsd.  For the record, I did not have a therapist diagnose my cptsd, although she was accepting of my realization that I have cptsd.  I figured it out myself, mostly by reading Pete Walker's books and also somewhat from this site.  And I also "only" had emotional neglect from a distant father who didn't like me very much and taunted and bullied me from day 1.  And no, you don't have to think of your father as a bad person, just a damaged one. 

Glad you are here, and best wishes as you go along your own healing path!

[Sophisticat]

Hi everyone 

Blueberry Exactly, I kind of feel like something is just wrong with me and it definitely would be a relief to receive some form of explanation.. whether it is cptsd or bpd. Actually I'm also happy that my therapist didn't diagnose me with bpd right away, but since I haven't told him everything I experience every day, he might change his mind..

He always mentions "the trauma", he has told me before that "we" have to be careful because of possible re-traumatisation.. he mentioned hypochondria, generalized anxiety, some emotional instability and ptsd when I asked him about a diagnosis, but not complex ptsd. When I asked him, he even reasoned that my symptoms don't match ptsd, because I don't have flashbacks and because the "traumatic event" wasn't a single traumatic event (like war or something). So I'm not sure whether he knows cptsd..

Thank you for the fact sheet and the link. This is really helpful..

Jdog Thank you! Did you just "tell" your therapist about cptsd and did she then confirm your assumptions? Did she know about cptsd before? I'm sorry that you had to go through emotional neglect from your father.. I always wonder whether they know the consequences of their behavior? My father does not seem to notice anything..

[Three Roses]

Hello, Sophisticat, and welcome to the forum! 

Bessel van der Kolk is an expert in the field of trauma and the brain, and is the author of a book I think you must read, entitled "The Body Keeps The Score". Very illuminating and I think you'll enjoy reading it from a medical student's perspective.

I'm also self-diagnosed. I'm waiting for cptsd to be included in our DSM for an official diagnosis. But no matter if I am ever diagnosed with it, I find this forum and the information here indispensable (and the lovely, understanding people who post and reply).

[Blueberry]

he mentioned hypochondria, generalized anxiety, some emotional instability and ptsd when I asked him about a diagnosis, but not complex ptsd. When I asked him, he even reasoned that my symptoms don't match ptsd, because I don't have flashbacks and because the "traumatic event" wasn't a single traumatic event (like war or something). So I'm not sure whether he knows cptsd..

Then it sounds as if he doesn't know the difference between ptsd and complex cptsd. The problem with that is therapists may end up battling symptoms with us without getting further down into what's at the root of it all.
I'm going to send you a PM.

[Jdog]

Hi-

My therapist did know about cptsd but I am so good at masking things that she didn't realize how I was really feeling.  Once I opened up more, she agreed that was a possibility.  Like your T, she isn't big on diagnoses.  And, insurance won't cover cptsd so she wasn't submitting that in her notes. 

Thanks for the sympathy over my Dad's treatment of me.  He's been dead for a really long time - never got to really know him as an adult, which would have been a good thing I think.  In retrospect, he was a truly remarkable person with deep wounds.  He likely wasn't thrilled to be a parent, and definitely didn't want a girl.  So, a bad situation for each of us. 

[Sophisticat]

Three Roses Thank you, I will definitely look into it.. they even have it at my university, so I'm going to pick it up later. 

I am really surprised that so many of us are self-diagnosed, but I guess it makes sense since it's not in the DSM yet.
And even though I've  been here on this forum for only 2 days, I already feel like reading into this topic and getting some feedback helps a lot!

Blueberry Yes, I guess he doesn't know the difference. I think he has a sense of what the problem is, since he focused on my childhood pretty quickly and called it "trauma" - and he asked me to write a letter to my father and so on (it didn't really help). But sometimes I doubt that he really understands how I feel and how this affects my life.

I have this (negative) self-concept and strongly depend on the opinion of others - one person (even if I don't know them) can make or break my day - he does not seem to understand that this really is how I feel. I mean, I know that it doesn't make sense, so no one has to tell me, you know!?

I'm always nervous in social situations, especially around people I don't know well or around authority figures (sweating etc.) and my future.. I just expect something bad to happen (disease, loss..). It's so frustrating. I think he understands that there is this one "self" that adapted to the environment and acts like everything is fine most of the time (sometimes even in therapy) and the other "self" with all of those negative, self-destrucing emotions.

But I don't know whether he really understood that the second "self" is.. kind of my "true" self?! He mentioned that all of my behaviours like the self-harming and the emotional instability and so on are coping/protective mechanisms and thus "normal", but he doesn't think that they are part of my personality. This is what he told me. This is why he doesn't want to call it BPD. But actually I'm pretty sure that they are part of my personality, indeed I'm sure that they are my personality.



Jdog Yes, I guess I can really relate to the "masking" thing. I think this is basically what I've just described in the upper section of this post.
I think my dad also is a person with deep wounds - but he actually was thrilled to become a parent (this is what I've been told) and especially to have a girl. And I guess he loves me truly, so for me it is thus very hard to accept his ambivalence. And this is why I don't want to call it "emotional abuse", because I know that he doesn't want to hurt me - and I don't want to hurt him by telling him that something is wrong with him.
I'm really sorry that your dad didn't manage to deal with his inner demons.. I hope that my dad will be able to deal with his problems one day.

[Boatsetsailrose]

Hi sopisticat and welcome to the forum.
Bdp is now called 'emotionally unstable pd' in the uk. I know from hearing of others experience and also my own one professionals often limited knowledge of cptsd misdiagnosis can happen.
I was brought up with a m who seems to fit into bpd and i have cptsd but i can see traits cross over ...

As u say a diagnosis can be helpful and for me having cptsd really helps and helps me get the right help.

Complex PTSD is going into the icd 11 and there is research and reading which can be found via google. I did all my own research and thats how i have got and continue to get the right treatment . the therapist and psychiatrist diagnosed me through me working with them and ultimately asking for it to be formal.
Some professionals call it complex trauma or child trauma

Best wishes for the next stage of your recovery 

[Sophisticat]

Hi Boatsetsailrose

Yes, in Germany they also refer to bdp as "emotionally unstable pd". In our last session my therapist mentioned that I most likely suffer from an "emotionally unstable pd" - but not really from "bpd as most people would define it". Nevertheless, he suggested me to join a DBT group..
I forgot to mention cptsd to him because the last therapy session was so intense.. but I'm going to mention cptsd next time.

I read that the treatment is quite different for bpd and cptsd..

[Boatsetsailrose]

It could be helpful to you to have a proper assessment and to be clear on the symptoms of cptsd (there are some worksheets under resources on this site which i used at my last assessment and were v helpful.
Quote 'most likely is vague and it needs proper clinical assessment . there is some writing that pete walker did on the opening pages of oots website about bdp (emotionally unstable pd and cptsd and how people get misdiagnosed. I personally wouldnt be happy at all with a pd diagnosis when what i have is a psychological injury ... But this may well be different for you and that's understandable.
My understanding is dbt is for aiding managing strong emotions ...i haven't heard anyone talk about this treatment for cptsd but that's not to say it couldn't be helpful ...

Sending you best wishes

[Sophisticat]

Thank you, Boatsetsailrose

Yes, a proper assessment is probably essential.
But I think that I have to be assessed before I'm allowed to join the DBT group anyway. And as you basically pointed out.. I guess nobody would be happy with a pd diagnosis when it's not a pd.

At the moment I'm just relieved that there is a "name" for my feelings/behavior (whatever it is in the end), but I actually think I can identify with both cptsd and bpd, especially because I have a strong fear of abandonment, my relationships can be quite chaotic.. and if I'm honest I can be very impulsive (especially with the self-harm, drinking etc).

Thank you for suggesting the article by Pete Walker - in a way it confirms my assumptions.


To be honest: I'm in therapy since April this year and the first therapy sessions were about my anxiety (which is a huge problem), but it felt like "something" was missing.  But a few weeks ago this "dark" part of me started to show a little more (especially towards my therapist), the self-destructive, needy, childish, strongly emotional part I normally try to suppress or deny because I was and am ashamed. Receiving a diagnosis (or a definition?) "for" this part would really help me to just accept that it is there and that I don't have to feel bad about it. Even if it is called bpd..